Problem with lashup

 Here's the deal with lash-ups....   When the voltage is raised above 0 on any tiu channel, a signal (watch dog) goes out looking for dcs  engines. It lasts about 4 or 5 seconds. This is not the dcs signal that we're looking for when we do   a track signal test. (you mentioned you had a perfect dcs track signal (10)

Lash-ups must see the watch dog else they won't move. Yep they do everything their suppose to do but move.

However you're getting some engines to move and others  that won't .

 Make sure the already created (lash-up) is  on the track before powering up  the tiu..

Ok so I just set up a 3' section of tubular track on the floor & hooked the TIU directly to the track.  Used a PS2 & PS3 engine to create a lashup.   Results - one engine moves, one doesnt

Back to square one!

Will both engines run separately not in a lash-UP?   Can you change the engine's ID and have it stick in a non lash-up mode . Perhaps one of the engines is reverting back to it's old ID created when the battery was good .  Of course proto.3 doesn't have a battery but proto-2 does.   Very frustrating   for you I'm sure.

I only have 2 PS2 engines, all the rest are PS3.  Everyone of my 22 engines runs fine when they are single units.   I've tried changing the address of the individual engines & of the lashup w/ no luck.  So far, I've only been able to get that 1 lashup to work that I spoke of earlier.     It's  frustrating beyond words!  I like to run trains w/2-3 units & I can't.  Not THAT big a deal on this layout bc its small, but the new one I'm building will be made for this kind of modern railroading.  I just dont know what it could be.  Would doing a TIU reset do anything?

A quick an easy procedure...with no power to engines toggle your DCS DCC switch back and forth as well as your 2rail 3 rail switch...probably wont help as other engines in lash up will not respond to lashup commands but were reaching here. Also did you try Barrys 3 ft test track procedure? Ahh i see you tried the the test track test..oops.

Unless you have another TIU and remote, think it is time to bring your engines somewhere else, make them into a lash-up there and then see if they operate correctly there. If every engine has the same symptoms when made into the trailing engine...

Have you tried this all with the TIU fixed out channels? (Missed it if you did.)

Only option would be to take 1 or 2 with me when I visit my uncle in NJ at the end of July.  He's the only one I know with a TIU.   I could also take it to my old hobby shop up there & see if they can update the TIU - not sure what that would do.  I just re-added all of my MTH engines back in the remote w/ no issues. I 'm really stumped on this one.

I see your not far from Charlotte NC..any Train shops in that area that might deal with MTH?

I would try the command "run as 1" or "run all" is it?

It commands all the engines on the track or the list at the start to run as if it was one engine. It is the same as a lash up just all the engines are not hooked up but will run the same speed.

I have used this command to lash up 6-2 motored diesels for a total of 12 motors.

The trouble I had was it kept blowing fuses inside the tiu, which is a ***** when it is mounted under the layout. The fix this I put 25 amp fuses in the tiu and a 20 amp before the tiu and it worked.

Press ENG and then Soft Key ALL

You really should not put higher value fuses in the TIU, you're asking for trouble.  The rated capacity of each channel is rated for 10 amps, so fusing at 25 and 20 amps is really not protecting much.  The 20A fuses are there to protect the internal wiring and components of the TIU, running with more than 10 amps for any length of time will be hazardous to the TIU's health.

the tiu had 20 amp fuses in it when I took it apart, if you are worried about it I would use the 10 amp slow blow in the tiu with an external 10 amp fast blow, that way you only have to replace the external fuse which would be easy.

My nest thing to try is to hook up one tiu and one transformer then hook up a couple of more transformers directly to the track with no tiu between them.

Then you can adjust the voltages to be all the same and then try to run your engine in command mode.

I figure all you would lose is the emergency stop directive as it only would power down the 1 transformer that has a tiu associated with it. The rest would stay at full power.

Originally MTH said you could run 99 engines at the same time on the same track but they didn't say how you could get enough power to them all.

My nest thing to try is to hook up one tiu and one transformer then hook up a couple of more transformers directly to the track with no tiu between them.

Then you can adjust the voltages to be all the same and then try to run your engine in command mode.

I figure all you would lose is the emergency stop directive as it only would power down the 1 transformer that has a tiu associated with it. The rest would stay at full power.

First, connecting multiple transformers to the same track is a very bad idea.

Second, what does this have to do with the problem under discussion?

Have you tried running thru the fixed terminals rather than the variable terminals?

Tried it last night before bed  - same result.

Do you guys think an update of the TIU/Remote would solve the issue?  I really cant think of what else it could be

Christopher,

Do you guys think an update of the TIU/Remote would solve the issue?  I really cant think of what else it could be

DCS 4.10 had more bugs in the lashup process than does DCS 4.30, although I'm not aware of anything that could cause the symptoms that you're experiencing.

 Maybe forget about the lash-up for a second. Delete it. Will the engines in question run using the All command and can you change the engine's ID and have it stick. I'm thinking  engine problem rather than a lash-up problem.

By have the ID stick means  powering down the layout for 30 or so seconds and powering up again... does the engine start up with the new ID.

I'm guessing you're pushing "d" when you create the lash up, just dbl ckn'g.  Better to know than not.

Also, another poster is/was having trouble with Proto 3 lash ups in this thread and has found a solution concerning earth ground.

Having no experience with Proto 3 lash ups I have little else to offer.  I do wonder how many others are having difficulties.  As Barry is paying attention to your thread he'll be the one to steer you in the right direction as to whether my suggestions have any bearing.

FWIW

I'm guessing you're pushing "d" when you create the lash up, just dbl ckn'g.  Better to know than not.

Good point. That entered my mind as well.

 I tried that last night too - I had 3 engines on 2 tracks & the all command worked for them.  I also tried changing the ID & that worked as well

You mean the scroll wheel?

Where you select the "done" from the alphabet list to finalize the lash-up?

Yes, after I name it, I hit the 'D' key

Sorry, I've been gone w/ computer issues.

So many of us are saying different things, it's tougher on you.
 If it were the watchdog signal, the engine would start up on power up if missed.

I take it the whole lash-up sits quietly and waits for you to start it up?

When you press start up, do you get any check track message? When you scroll up the speed, do you get any message?

 I'm thinking the remote would give a message if one of the engines didn't respond?

I did have one used engine I got that would fall out of command around the layout. It would lose power and/or short out on turns and switches.

 I can't see how he could even command a lash-up if he didn't complete building it?

You don't take your engines to a club or anywhere else where the addresses might be changed?

Just for kicks, I tried it w/ my two PS2 engines last night to see if they would behave differently - same result.  Lead engine moves, trailer is dead

Did you buy your TIU new? 

Did it come with 4.10 already installed?

Ditto for the remote?

I am wondering if the software on the DCS system may be your problem.  Can you upgrade the DCS?  If so, the may be the next step.

Christopher,

I'd upgrade the TIU and remote both to 4.30, after resetting both of them first. This will delete everything and let you start fresh.

I always forget to mention this.

I'd listen to Barry first. He's who I listen to anyways. He's got like a 99% correct average with me. (he is human!)

  We are all just trying to help.

Sometimes these posts seem like everyone is saying something different.

Please upgrade and post your results.

Again I'll post that I wish we could keep a list of the issues with each version of DCS (that are proven). It usually leads into too much off track grumblings from each of us.

 I know that I have run into my own difficulties at times that gets confusing on what's really going wrong.

 Once, I even had the wires reversed at the TIU on one channel after disconnecting for an update, that was embarrassing. The wires were marked with red tape for the hot. I just plain missed it. When everyone says they haven't seen the issue, it usually tells me I missed something easy!

Yep for sure! In the mean time , if you really wanted to run a lash-up give both engines the same id number. or use the all command.

Since IDs stick with the engine, take one off the track and delete it from the remote Edit the second engine to the same id as the deleted one.  put the deleted one back on the track and they'll run as one engine. (double horn, couplers though) Something to try...kind of fun...