Pulmore Tire Repair/Replacement

If you attached a picture, it did not come through. Is the Pulmore tire the problem or is the wheel damaged?

Ray

Ray, the 'rubber' is chipped off.  The metal wheel is ok.

I'm not sure what the problem is.  Looks like a simple remove the rod screw and slip the new tire on.  Measure the wheel diameter at the tread (not the flange), and also the width of the tire groove.  With that we can match up the proper tire.

FWIW, I'd change both of them if you're changing one.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I'm not sure what the problem is.  Looks like a simple remove the rod screw and slip the new tire on.  Measure the wheel diameter at the tread (not the flange), and also the width of the tire groove.  With that we can match up the proper tire.

FWIW, I'd change both of them if you're changing one.

John, there is no groove, there is no separate 'tire'.  Postwar Flyer Pul-More wheels had the rubber 'galvanized' to the metal wheel.  To remove remnants one must cut/scrape it off with an exacto or other type blade.

I imagine Portlines has some sort of replacement but he is out of the net until May.

Check Portlines.com website. Doug may even have a clinic on this. He is very helpful with all things "S".

It sure looked like a groove, but no groove certainly changes things.  I suspect it's glued on, the trick is finding the right tire and glue.

Take a look at Repair Clinic #11 on the Port Lines website. Some 0-8-0's had PullMor rubber vulcanized to non-grooved drivers (the early production years.) Later engines had the bands on grooved drivers. Doug sells replacement tires with the band vulcanized but that requires pulling the wheels. He also sells thin and thick bands to be superglued on to the wheel. Thin bands are for the non grooved drivers.

Take a look at Repair Clinic #11 on the Port Lines website. Some 0-8-0's had PullMor rubber vulcanized to non-grooved drivers (the early production years.) Later engines had the bands on grooved drivers. Doug sells replacement tires with the band vulcanized but that requires pulling the wheels. He also sells thin and thick bands to be superglued on to the wheel. Thin bands are for the non grooved drivers.

Tom is right on here, the bands at Port Lines are what you want, use goo from Walther's to mount the tire but make sure you remove all of the vulcanized material from the factory. For the wheels that had the vulcanized tire use the thin bands. I don't like the super glue, can dry to fast for an old guy like me, I use the Goo and let the engine sit over nite upside down in a cradle. If you replace do both Pullmore wheels or you may end up with different overall sizes on the wheels.

Ray

Ray

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

It sure looked like a groove, but no groove certainly changes things.  I suspect it's glued on, the trick is finding the right tire and glue.

John, that 343 is an American Flyer engine from the 50s, just a long time before the grooves were used.

Ray

Thanks guys.  Doug is out of the net until May.  I'll see what the owner wants me to do.

@Rayin"S" posted:

John, that 343 is an American Flyer engine from the 50s, just a long time before the grooves were used.

I confess that I never saw one that had the tires glued on from the factory before.  I've led a sheltered life, and most of my train exposure is with more modern equipment.

I have used these glued on tires before.......I didn't have any luck with them....after a day or two the tire band came loose.......waste of time.   My problem is the new tires that you place on the modern engines.......they seem to crack and break off .....usually if I park a engine for month or two then the tire bands break..........that's 6.00 each time it happens...............Lionel can't make a tire band to last anytime and 70 year old gilbert engine with tire bands are still running....... go figure..........Any one ever use bullfrog snot or something like that.....??????????

Regards

Jackie

"Bullfrog Snot": can't say from personal use, but anything that has the potential to leave residue on the track is something I would avoid...

Mark in Oregon

I was recommended to use BFSnot, I didn't like it one bit.

The glue on tires from Port Lines that I mounted with Goo have been ok, I think if you use the super glue, it might be brittle, the Goo product seems as though it retains elasticity.

Someone on the forum recommended I believe something like liquid electricians tape thinned out and applied with a brush, but I haven't tried that.

Ray

My dad was a big time Flyer collector, and when he had his hobby shops, we did a lot of repair work, ….I seem to recall a flat faced O ring from John Deere of all places that mimicked the Pulmor tire to a tee, ……we would clean the wheel really good and affix it on there with vulcanizing cement ( tire patch glue) I remember it sticking so good, that if you didn’t get it right the first time, you’d have to destroy the O ring to get it back off,……it worked that good!…..I do remember the cement was made by Safety Seal ( tire plug and patch company ) but I’ll have to see if I can find that John Deere O ring, …..I might have a couple still in the bins…..that was 35 some odd years ago,….

Pat

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I confess that I never saw one that had the tires glued on from the factory before.  I've led a sheltered life, and most of my train exposure is with more modern equipment.

John,

I have a combination of old and new, Legacy is FUNNER.

Ray😁

Ray do you have any problems withe Lionel legacy engine with rubber tires......I'm changing these rubber tire all the time.   I just made repairs to my challenger engine and found 3 of the 4 tires had broken and fallen off.......

Jackie

I can share my experience as well. First, the track I am using is SHS/MTH solid Nickle/Silver, not Gilbert track. I have a lot of Legacy and TMCC engines so no one engine is in use all the time. The Legacy steam engine tires seem to stretch and I find them off the wheel dragging along on the drive rod. I have never had a steam engine tire break. I just put a few drops of superglue in the metal tire groove and put the rubber tire back in place. So far I have not had one fail a second time. I know we are not supposed to do this but it has worked for me since I got my first Legacy engine, a Big Boy, back in 2010.

The Legacy diesel rubber tires do break and fall off. I just remove the sideframe and put on a replacement. Then I have to search along all the track to find the broken rubber tire that fell off.

Jackie,

Actually I have had very little problems with the traction tires on my legacy engines, my Big Boy needed to have the tires replaced for the first time this winter. I was running my Challenger today and it still has the original set of tires on it. The challenger has been running quite a bit of late and I have a grade of 1 to 1 1/2% and this pulling 18 cars, seven of which are auto carriers each of which are carrying eight die cast (M-2) automobiles. These are still the original tires that came mounted by Lionel when I received the engine. I have replaced the two of the traction tires on my SD-70 but I would say all in all I have had good results with these.

I do have a Flyonel Northern, the 800 UP, on that engine when the tires did go I replaced them with some very narrow O-rings that I got from the Home Depot. Are all the traction tires you have from Lionel, sounds as though, from what I've heard the tires from Port Lines are better but I am not speaking from personal experience, just what I've heard.

One other thing I should mention, although I don't know if it means anything, my layout has all Gilbert American Flyer track.

Ray

Ray, I do not know if the type of track makes a difference in traction tire life. I just thought I would include it for future reference. I also have a number of grades between 2% and 2.5%. A typical freight is 15 cars, but none of the Gilbert diecast cars are used.

Tom, I reworded my post, I did not use any of Gilbert's die cast cars, my auto haulers are each loaded with 8 of the M-2 automobiles. That makes those cars quite heavy, my other long freight is a consist of forty S-Helper ore cars, those are all die-cast.

Ray

I never purchased any of those ore cars. 40 is a lot of cars even if they are short.

@Johnsgg1 posted:

What is the best way to repair this Pulmore tire/wheel on a Flyer 343 0-8-0?

Thanks.

Doug offers a pull-more rim for 0-8-0's.  I haven't used them, so I don't know if they're actually rims like the original in your photo with its rubber vulcanized to the metal or not, but that would be great if they are.  Then all you'll need to do is remove the driver, separate it into its three components, replace the rim, reassemble, mount, gauge, true, and re-quarter.   Unless you plan to remove, service, and reinstall all the drivers, first make sure they're quartered the same as the tool you're going to reinstall the one or pair that you remove.  Otherwise you will need to remove and reinstall them all in order that they match in the end.   Typically you'll find them quartered 87 degrees or 90 degrees (fore or aft).  I just serviced a custom steamer that had been set to about 85.  I prefer and use 90 fore.  

I too would recommend doing both pull-more drivers at the same time, unless the other one is in great shape.  At least micrometer their rim and flange OD's.  It helps for those to be the same or at least very close.  I think Doug sells his rims for $28 a piece.  As mentioned he's out and his online store is not working while he's away.  I recently rebuilt a 343 RIT, 343 RIC, and 346 for customers which all needed their drive wheels fully serviced including pull-mores replaced.  I used complete NOS pull-more drive wheels (hard to find, not cheap, but work great).   Don't have many left.  May have to try Doug's rims when I run out.  

I wanted to add this information, I received this email from Ed Goldin, which I will paste here, he will soon be making vulcanized Pulmore wheels available.

Hi guys,

Don't know if I told you but I will be carrying new vulcanized diesel wheels for American Flyer engines and soon new pul-mor wheels for steam. Also just got new LED Headlights that are direct replacement for the old headlights and they work great. (see attached photos)

Ed

His contact info:   customercare@goldinhands.com

Ray

Thanks Ray.  That's great news!  Repro vulcanized pull-more wheels used to be available and then were no longer.  I'd say that was about 5-10 years ago?  To have them back again will wonderful.  I came across one on a 343 last week.  Unfortunately it was missing its partner wheel so I used a pair of NOS Gilbert, but they're hard to find.  Go Ed go, and thanks in advance.  Can't wait to see them.  Was a timeframe for their availability provided?

In terms of LED direct replacement bulbs, Doug Peck recently announced them, but the more the merrier and better for all of uS.  I purchased a few from Doug, but haven't tried them yet, so can't offer any comparative observations.  

I received the same email from Ed. The timeframe for the vulcanized tires was "soon."

Hi all,

My first set of diesel wheels are completed and have been shipped. I send him wheels and he then sends them back to me when completed. I am trying to dig up diesel wheels so I can keep some in stock and I can then work on a exchange basis. I sent 26 and 18 are already spoken for and as of now the turnaroud time is about two - three weeks because he is out of country and it needs to go through customs. Once I can get the diesel wheels in my system then I will start on the steam engines.

The LED's are made to US specs and hence does not have the extra thread so it fits much better for steam engines and they also work great in the diesels. Here are two pictures of before and after with the vulcanized wheels and the LED's.