Affordable realistic water scenery for a large area.

If it were me, I would use a piece of window glass, with color variations spray-painted on the bottom using very flat "camo" paints, and waves hand-painted on top with Mod Podge.

Don't use wavy "shower door" glass -- waves are too regular and the Mod Podge does a great job.

Here is a small example of this technique:

You can use clear epoxy that is used for bar tops etc.  That runs about  $125.00 for 2 gallons.   

I like the techniques explained in the YouTube video: Marklin of Sweden Toilet Paper plus White Glue Equals Realistic Ocean Water. Check it out.

I used those techniques to make my removable river:

Arnold

PS: I followed the techniques in that YouTube video except at the end  I used multiple layers of Glossy Mod Podge instead of clear coat, whatever that is.

@trainmanmason posted:

Any water scenery expertise would be appreciated!

trainmanmason,

I sympathize with your question about how to cover a large area with “water.” I had spent a lot of time building my layout and was quite concerned about how the water would turn out. Like you, I had not previously modeled water.

In my opinion, it is essential to prepare the riverbed carefully if you want the water to look realistic. Think of how the muddy riverbed would appear if you could dive down through the water and look at the surface. You do need to cover the base with plaster, partly to seal it and also to give it color and texture.

I began by applying Woodland Scenics Mold-A-Scene ^TM plaster. I painted it several shades of brown and covered it with real dirt, several sizes of brown/dark brown ballast, and talus. I poured a thin (about 1/16-inch) layer of Enviro-Tex Lite® epoxy to simulate a shallow creek. I think it’s best to keep the layer of epoxy thin. In your case, like mine, you need to install temporary dams at the edges of the table to prevent the epoxy from flowing over the edges of the layout. I also reduced the water area somewhat by creating islands in the middle, but doing that depends on the particular water scene that you’re modeling.

I mixed exactly equal parts of resin and hardener so that the mixture hardened properly and did not remain sticky. I pre-mixed enough of each to cover the entire area and kept them separately in multiple small plastic cups until I was ready to pour. Then I mixed two cups at a time and poured the mixtures quickly but evenly into the riverbed. They flowed together and became a continuous smooth area of water.

Having said all that, I’m not sure how things would turn out when you need to cover 24 square-feet of surface. I asked people that same question and they considered my four or five square-feet of water area somewhat skeptically.

Photos show the water in the river-valley on my 10’-by-5’ layout. The last photo was taken from rear of layout beneath truss bridge.

MELGAR

I think the hobbyist has interesting choices to make when it comes to water on a layout.

Do you want to achieve a high level of realism, or do you want what you consider aesthetic beauty?

Does your layout have any toylike pre-war or postwar accessories with bright colors? If so, that could influence how you wish to model the water on your layout.

For instance, my layout is laden with Postwar accessories, and I wanted my water to be a pretty blue color (as shown in my above photos), which I knew was not very realistic looking.

One more thing: when you watch the Marklin of Sweden Toilet Paper Plus Water Equals Realistic Ocean Water YouTube, the water ends up looking much more realistic than my pretty blue water because much  more realistic color paints were used by the guy in the video.

Just my 2 cents. Arnold

One more thing: I did not want to work with anything like epoxy that might be toxic or might give off dangerous or unpleasant fumes in my basement near the furnace. For all I know, epoxy is not dangerous at all, but I did not want to bother researching it or taking any chances with it, or otherwise mess with it.

I was familiar with Glossy Mod Podge. I believe it's very safe, and even smells good. And it was a pleasure for me to work with it.

Trainmanmason, I think it's great that you are getting valuable and diverse input from everyone that has, and will, contribute to this thread.

Your layout is your little world in which you can make all the decisions.

Modeling water was one of my favorite model railroad projects. Arnold

I remember an old article in Model Railroader that detailed a simple method of modeling bodies of water, specifically those where the bottom is not visible in the deepest parts.

Basically the author painted the entire river bottom flat black, then sprayed light coats of brown (of whatever shade the riverbanks were) and feathered it out into a smooth transition from the banks to the flat black. This was then covered with 2-part epoxy (I believe the article specified polyester resin (which really stinks), but other materials are available now with much less offensive odor. Oh, and they also stressed you should test your river with actual water to check for leaks since you don't want the liquid resin finding them first.

The overall idea was that you're creating a low-grade mirror, which bodies of water are for the most part, especially where you can't see the bottom.

---PCJ

The river on the standard gauge portion of my layout is approximately 6' long by over 12" wide. I painted the river bottom with various colors of acrylic paint. The water was made by brushing on three layers of Mod Podge gloss.

Joe- your water looks great! JohnA

I would recommend checking out Luke Towan on YouTube. He does a fantastic muddy river diorama made with Envirotex Lite (jump to 27:28 on the video below)

Bryce

Nice job. 6'x12". That's a big river. Looking forward to seeing how you'll integrate into the scenery.

Joe the river looks great.  How did you get the ripple effect?

I created a river 8' wide for my layout, the PRR Panhandle.   The area was approximately 2400 square inches - 30"x94"x18"x94"x 3/8" deep.  I used Woodland Scenics Deep Pour (Murky) water.  Yes, it was expensive.  But the outcome was worth it.  Shoot me an e-mail (in my profile) for details.

George

Thanks to everyone for the wonderful tips and suggestions.  Somebody wanted me to update the progress....First I did some experimentation with different types of water and have attached a picture for those that are curious.

1. From left to right....ON the left is Mod Podge gloss.  My least favorite to work with.  It is not very good at self leveling and it takes weeks to completely dry when poured about an 1/8 inch thick.  Also....Even though I have a high heat dryer I use for shrink wrapping the skins to model airplanes at about 1200 degrees, it could not get rid of all the bubbles.  Perhaps a torch used for sweating pipes (which I do have) might do the trick if you have the time, but for the area I needed to cover it would not be practical.

2. The middle is using Epoxy.  The best of the 3 experiments.  I used the type that Bill Sherry (posted above) suggested works for thick clear bar tops purchased at Lowes for around $78 per gallon.  Air bubbles were easily removed and it dried completely to the touch in about 24 hours.  I added some Woodland Scenics water ripples to it after it dried and I liked the results.  It's also the least expensive of all that I found for the volume I needed.  Compared to Woodland Scenics prices for the same area of about 24 square feet (around 478 ozs. at 1/4" thickness at around $1200 or more), this water was a bargain and looks just as effective for around $160!!!

3. The third, on the right, is using water based acrylic lacquer from Minwax.  I did like the way it picked up it's own rippling effect from the wood undulations and it took several coats to get it to about 1/8 inch thick.  Air bubbles are also easily removed.  However, it also started creating a light bluish hue to the water which I did not care for, as I wanted the water to get darker as it got further from the shore.  It also takes several days to dry between coats.  Also, at $65 per gallon, it was going to be costly to get it to the thickness I wanted (about 1/4 inch).

@coach joe posted:

Joe the river looks great.  How did you get the ripple effect?

The Mod Podge does not completely level out. The ripples remain as it dries.

Sorry it took another day to get to this.  Had to get the Christmas decorations taken down outdoors on our warm day we had here yesterday.  Now, my updates....Before painting, I used a light coat of drywall joint compound on mostly all of the base of the plywood.  This sealed the seams for the plywood and screw holes.  It also makes it easier to apply the paint and prevents epoxy from leaking between the sheets of plywood.  Don't forget to sand it smooth before painting.

First, I painted the base with Woodland Scenics variety of water colors.  Tan on the riverbanks, to some green, then light blue, then the main body of water as dark blue....blending together as I went.  I really like the dark blue Woodland Scenic made for the illusion of depth.  It is not black, but a very dark blue.  Only took two and a half bottles of the Dark Blue for this area.  About a half a bottle for each of the other colors.

Next I added some stone walls to complete the sides...Then, I poured my coats of bar top epoxy (Glaze Coat Clear Gloss Oil-Based Lacquer - High Gloss Finish).  I did about a 1/3 of a section at a time (which was about a 1/3 of a gallon, too), so I could spread evenly and heat gun the air bubbles out.  Then, mix another 1/3 of a gallon and so on.  After about 4 hours, add your second coat if you would like.  After you've added all the coats, let dry for at least 24 hours. ...Don't forget to tape up your ends to keep epoxy from spilling onto the floors!  :-)

Next I added the waves using Woodland Scenics Water Ripples.  I used the ripples instead of the Woodland Scenic Waves, because of the scale of this river basin.  I can use the Woodland Scenic Waves for the tug boats as they part the water.  Additionally, as I worked with the ripples, I sprayed with some alcohol to help level and smooth them out a bit more. It took about 4 bottles of Water Ripples to cover the entire area with waves.  Furthermore, I left about 1/2 an inch or so between waves in order to keep some of the reflecting principles of the epoxy.  If it had all been solid waves throughout the base, I feel I would have lost some of the reflectivity.  Besides, you can always go back and add more waves to get the effect you desire.  It's difficult to take them back if you add too much.

Next came wiring and the bridges being added.  I wanted to showcase as many of the Lionel bridges that I could (and Lionel lighthouses) in this river area.  I still have a girder bridge to add, but this gives you the idea.  I've also added the interactive buttons on the side of the train board (lower left in picture) for the kids/adults to blast the foghorns of the lighthouses.

One last picture with bridges up!

Now, after months of stressing about this river piece and how to make realistic looking water, I can finally begin to lay more track and not be as stressed out about something I knew very little about, which was trying to make realistic looking water!!  Hope this post helps somebody else down the road with their river project!!

Came out wonderful, well thought out, tested and executed!

Extremely well executed, beautiful results!

@Scotie posted:

Came out wonderful, well thought out, tested and executed!

Thank you!  I know nothing about scenery.  I've always dreaded scenery.  I've built 5 layouts over my lifetime and have never done scenery once.  This will be my first layout I've ever had scenery on. 

@coach joe posted:

Extremely well executed, beautiful results!

Thank you so much!  I do appreciate the compliments!

That is scary, deep, dark, cold looking river water! What a masterpiece! Bravo!

@Golden Prairie Railroad posted:

That is scary, deep, dark, cold looking river water! What a masterpiece! Bravo!

Thank you for the compliment!