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27 replies

Shortening a Lionel drawbar?

LM Larry MullenOGR Forum Member
I was comparing my newly purchased 6-28063 PRR Duplex to my scale Lionel Legacy Turbine.  The eninge/tender gap is much nicer on the Turbine and to my untrained eye, I would think a similar gap could be reproduced on the Duplex.  They are both about the same length and the tenders seem identical.  Has anyone tried to either shorten a drawbar or use a shorter one from another engine?  Perhaps the Milwaukee 261 model from a few years ago would work.?

If this was brought up earlier, I apologize. I did look, but when I use my phone to search, I don't think it is as quite as easy.

Thank you.
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N NortonOGR Forum Member

I assume you are talking about Lionel's wireless tethers? I basically do the same thing RoyBoy does, cut and solder. The only difference is I mill each end half the thickness and do a lap joint. The drawbars are only .050" thick so an overlap won't make much difference. I just happen to have the equipment and the machining only takes a few minutes.

 

Pete

D500D500OGR Forum Member

And this is why I really dislike wireless tethers. These are models, and should be accessible as models - i.e. - things that we change.

 

I've done it (tender side: remove IR sensor, cut bar to length, Moto-Tool/file a new slot for loco side of things, re-attach IR reader with one screw (where possible; usually one will still be useable) and some silicone.

 

I can't imagine solder being able to pull a train, but I've never done it that way, so what do I know? 

 

===

 

Now, on an older steamer with a nice, flexible (literally) wire tether, you cut (maybe), drill a new hole, and move on. Sigh. 

 

Because our steamers tend (not all of them) to have the Olympic Broad Jump engine/tender relationship, the wireless tether was a terrible idea - L's and M's. Another reason to buy and upgrade PS1 steamers.

brwebsterbrwebsterOGR Forum Member

  Some only require slotting the tender draw bar with a few well placed drill holes and a file.  OTOH, I found fashioning a new engine draw bar from 1/8" aluminum bar stock, the best option when shortening the gap on my tether-less LionMaster T1 .  Saves buggering the original in case returning to stock is desired.  Of course, making sure your layout can handle each engine with shortened gaps is paramount.  Great looks ain't so great when they can't negotiate your minimum curves.

 

 

Bruce

N NortonOGR Forum Member

This is how I do it. I use a milling cutter with a diameter equal to amount I want to shorten the drawbar by. In this case 3/8"

First cut.

 

Draw_firstcut

Then the drawbar is flipped over and moved 3/8" and milled half the thickness. When the cut is finished the drawbar is in two pieces. This shows the two pieces, one will be flipped and soldered to the other.

Draw_pieces

 

Soldered and blackened.

 

Draw_soldered

Comparison to original.

Draw_compare

 

This is the engine before the engine drawbar was shortened. The tender drawbar has already been shortened. Original gap was much wider.

 

J3_Mid

 

This is the final gap with both drawbars shortened.

 

 

J3_after

 

I haven't measured tensile strength but am confident it far exceeds the tractive effort of the engine. I have pulled 12 18" heavyweights for a couple of hours with no problems.

 

Pete

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Last edited by Norton
N NortonOGR Forum Member

Even simpler is RoyBoy's method of cut and overlap. You can see how thin the metal is so an overlap would have minimal effect on appearance or function. If you used a metal shear or even hand shears you would not loose any metal to a cutting blade (kerf) and maximize the bond area.

Regardless if you use solder or epoxy you should sand off the blackening to get the best bond.

 

Pete

brwebsterbrwebsterOGR Forum Member

I stumbled upon my solution when I fabricated drawbars to close the gap on MTH Premier F units.  The left over MTH couplers fit onto the scale Lionel F units perfectly.  I removed the entire Lionel coupler assembly, which allows the MTH assemblies, whether spring loaded or not, to just drop right into the Lionel mounting tabs.   As always, minimum 072 curves recommended.

Best view with units compressed in reverse, shot from inside a curve.

when pulling, the max gap looks like so, shot from an unflattering outside curve.

Both MTH coupler designs bolt right in, although the attachment with screw doesn't self center.

 

Bruce

Last edited by brwebster
brwebsterbrwebsterOGR Forum Member

Coincidentally, another Lionel set of diesels that joined the roster yesterday also needed some TLC of the close kind.  This Alco FA2, AB pair had the same 027 gap exhibited by the F3's.  The B is unpowered, hence the electro-coupler on the A.  It only spent a few laps around the layout before ending up down on the workbench.

Because the bodies of the FA's overhang the trucks more so than on the F3's, the coupler assembly length is longer to compensate.  The fix was so ridiculously obvious.  The Alco coupler is above ( with the ears ), the F3 below

F3 couplers installed.   The wires shown in the gap transmit power to the EC on the rear of the B, now where it's needed.  Will probably add a TMCC board for dummies to take care of coupling and reverse lighting at some future date.

Oh yeah...they finally look acceptable, although the crew is complaining about sunburn.  Maybe something can be done about the riding height?  UGH!

Bruce

Henry J.Henry J.OGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER
brwebster posted:

Coincidentally, another Lionel set of diesels that joined the roster yesterday also needed some TLC of the close kind.  This Alco FA2, AB pair had the same 027 gap exhibited by the F3's.  The B is unpowered, hence the electro-coupler on the A.  It only spent a few laps around the layout before ending up down on the workbench.

Because the bodies of the FA's overhang the trucks more so than on the F3's, the coupler assembly length is longer to compensate.  The fix was so ridiculously obvious.  The Alco coupler is above ( with the ears ), the F3 below

F3 couplers installed.   The wires shown in the gap transmit power to the EC on the rear of the B, now where it's needed.  Will probably add a TMCC board for dummies to take care of coupling and reverse lighting at some future date.

Oh yeah...they finally look acceptable, although the crew is complaining about sunburn.  Maybe something can be done about the riding height?  UGH!

Bruce

Nice difference!  And, so simple.

jeremy ferrelljeremy ferrellOGR Forum Member
brwebster posted:

I stumbled upon my solution when I fabricated drawbars to close the gap on MTH Premier F units.  The left over MTH couplers fit onto the scale Lionel F units perfectly.  I removed the entire Lionel coupler assembly, which allows the MTH assemblies, whether spring loaded or not, to just drop right into the Lionel mounting tabs.   As always, minimum 072 curves recommended.

Best view with units compressed in reverse, shot from inside a curve.

when pulling, the max gap looks like so, shot from an unflattering outside curve.

Both MTH coupler designs bolt right in, although the attachment with screw doesn't self center.

 

Bruce

So what couplers did you end up using here?  Any part #?  I love these engines I just  don't run them for this this reason 

 

 

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