How was today's Allentown Spring Thaw meet?

I thought the show was great as usual. There were a couple dealers that I noticed were missing, but all the tables were filled in. Attendance was more than usual in the morning, but thinned out when the show started.

I bought parts and a bottle of body filler. Nothing exciting enough to photograph lol.

I thought it was a good show. different dealers where the usuals were not such as the former OGR booth and Where the Publicc Delivery track. I was really tempted y those Lionel 89' autoracks and 86' boxcars but ended up getting parts and some k-line 4 unit ttax set[need some parts] for $15.00-no box either.

 

I got some old Champ of the Road Tractor Trailers for $3.00 that I can superdetail.

The 89' autoracks have been out for awhile now, but it's the first I saw of Lionel's new 86' hy-cube boxcars in person.  Nice stuff, but ENORMOUS presence.  A small handful took up the whole width of a dealer's booth!!! 

 

Should be interesting to see how the market absorbs these huge scale-sized rolling stock.  I can easily seem them riding the rails at a club-sized layout.   But typical home layouts?  I'm not convinced.   And the fact that dealers are still trying to move the second production run of 89' autoracks might tell ya something right there.  Perhaps their novelty has worn off?  Or folks are just waiting for prices to come down a bit more.

 

In addition to 89' autoracks, Nicholas Smith Trains also brought a bunch of Lionel Centipede A's and AA's to the show.  So I guess even at their super-discounted prices of $575 and $1100, respectively, these items just aren't moving yet.  I would have thought at $1100, the AA's would be gone by now.  But that just goes to show you even super bargains don't always provide enough of an incentive for folks to part with their hard-earned $$$.  How low will these go before they finally sell out?   

 

David

I enjoyed it. I've only been there once before, so I can't say much about vendors, but I didn't notice any empty space. It was also really crowded, though I baled out at 12:30 for my 100+ mile ride home.

 I could be wrong, but I could swear the last time I was there I saw a vendor like Scenic Express, with a lot of scenery items. I was really hoping for someone like that today, but I didn't find anything. Still, I saw plenty of interesting items, and I picked up a few odds and ends. I grabbed an extra 022 switch, just in case. I finally found a couple of American Flyer gondolas that I had been hunting for. I don't really even run the train, but my father-in-law gave it to me, and a falling picture took it off a shelf and broke a couple of cars. I've always felt bad about that, so I was happy to finally find replacements. Also went off topic a bit, and grabbed a Batmobile slot car just because it was cool, and a diecast truck.

 Not a huge day, but certainly better than a day at the shop.

It seemed to be a great show. The place was busy in the morning. I did notice the railroadiana vendor was not there this time. I overheard a couple of vendors state the morning sales were good.

The real action was at the "Bandit Meet" outside the Ham Fam Breakfast...cars were flying out of the hatchback section of a couple of vehicles!!  Picked up some nice Atlas Hy-Cubes!!  

 

I agree with RockyMounatineer about the new Lionel 86'ers.  First time seeing them in person and all I can say is "wow."  I think most of us will need to bump out a wall in the basement or rec room to accommodate the sheer mass of these cars!

 

- Mike

It was a great meet as usual. I bought the usual several pounds of books along with some hard to find older HO equipment. I walked in at 9 and left at 11:45 just in time to see the first flakes falling. Within five minutes, it was starting to come down pretty steadily. Allentown continues to rank right up there with East Springfield and York as a true TRAIN event, not trains and dolls and toys and drones and baseball cards and so on. It was a great time.

 

Bob  

got there just before 3:30pm and some dealers was covered up and gone, some big venders not there, prices were just about msrp, if you were looking for "OLD" stuff you are in heaven, but new and today's trains was not much to look at.

 

looking for detail scenery stuff was just not there, very disappointed this time. some tables would not even deal, "it was take it or leave it" so we left it and walked on.

I thought that the Spring Thaw show was very good and the prices are always competitive. If you are into surplus or overruns some excellent buys were to be found. As for scenery supplies, for some reason the scenic vendors just don't show up there, but all the big train dealers do. Overall it is still the best non-TCA show in Pennsylvania. We arrived at 10AM (the show was packed) but left at 12 PM went shopping in the farmers market, had lunch at the Ritz and drove home to NJ in light snow.

I got there about 9:00 left at 11:45 I had to get home as I left a miffed wife at home with no heat in the house. At least I called the HVAC guy before I left. I bought a few parts and a pair of 022 switches. It was crowded at first and thinned out later. I finally got in the forum picture after 15 years. I really went there to drop off flyers for our upcoming train show in May. I also gave some to some vendors.

I enjoyed it always a great show. I did not buy due to my excess of items and having no room while my basement is remodeled. But there appeared to be some good deals and dealers seemed eager to sell. Always worth going in my opinion..

Got to the show at around 10:30 and proceeded to hunt for "stuff".I've  looked forward to this show through the years, as with the rest of our hi-railer group. This is probably the first time that I've only gone through the show 1 time, and have noticed some vendors who used to be there, aren't anymore for the last 2 shows. 

One of the vendors that used to frequent the Allentown show, I saw in Springfield, he told me he will never go back to Allentown again, because of a "disagreement" he had with the "Colonel". I also noticed that for the last 3 or 4 shows, there was a vendor who used to sell railroadianna, is no longer there. Many new faces in vending, and the once detailed vendors seem to be very limited. As some of you have noticed when you came in that the "Public Delivery Track" was not there and I found out why at the last Allentown show. Beth told my buddy Jeff and I that she's getting tired of doing the shows because it's a lot of work, and I got the impression that she's made a lot of money over the years. She also told us that she is getting into acting and loves it. From this point on, she said last time, that she will probably only do York, maybe.

One final note is that there seems to be a lot of toy's showing up on vendors  tables. I remember this event,at one time, to be a hardcore model train event. It seems to be mirroring Greenberg's show and that's bothersome.

Although, the best part of the day was seeing some fellow model railroaders, friends and 1 guy in particular, Casey Quinzel. Casey is one of the engineer's at New Hope & Ivyland Railroad who ran #40, and was one of the people who taught me how to fire a steam locomotive, as a fireman. Will always be greatful for the knowledge you passed along and the great times serving as a fireman. Enjoy your bachelorhood for now because things "will" change when you say "I do". Best to you!

                                           Steam Forever

                                          John J. Giuliano

 

John, I assume you are talking about Charles Ro.  He has not been to Allentown for a couple of years now... & also told me at York last year that he would no longer do the show.  Thats too bad, because since I drive 2 hours to Allentown from the south, his presence there made it really worth the trip.  The other main O Gauge merchants are great, but having Ro there was the "icing on the cake"

The vendor isn't Ro, but I can't remember his name. He sold people figures for "O" gauge trains, and usually had a lot of figures for sale. It's not comforting for us train shoppers to experience this sort of loss of specialty vendors. It's nice getting things off of the internet, but it's just like the kids of today that text, tweet or whatever, there's no interaction with another human being. The highlight of a show is meeting fellow modelers, friends, meeting new people and sharing ideas, so you can be a better modeler. 

Some of my best experiences recently, have been with N.J. Hi-Railers, and sharing some problems that we are having with TMCC, spending time, hands-on, with the guy's who can & will help you. Your not going to get that in a text or whatever. I'm thankful for the show in that respect!

                                                     Steam Forever

                                                           John

Allentown has been and will likely continue to always be a great train show.  But the marketplace has changed dramatically over the years, and both we toy train enthusiasts and our toy train suppliers are getting older each day with all the changes taking place.  

 

If business warrants staying close to home to generate the revenue vs. traveling and taking the wear-and-tear hit on the body, then that's the decision some dealers are making nowadays.  Charlie Ro hasn't been at Allentown for a few years now -- preferring to watch over business at the store and avoid the travel.   And for the first time since he's taken over Charlie's booth-space at Allentown, Chris of Nicholas Smith Trains had associates handle the show for him.  Beth of the Public Delivery Track has cut back on a few shows now.  And Joe Sr. of Grzyboski Trains had his sons take care of the show -- at least on Saturday when I was there.  While the sky is far from falling, you can see a pattern building... and it's not rocket science. 

 

It's fair to say that attending these shows as a dealer takes a tremendous amount of work -- no two ways about it.  Packing up a truckload of goods, setting up the booth, dealing with customers' incessant haggling for two days, and then hauling unsold merchandise back to the store/warehouse (in all kinds of weather) gets old after you do it for 10-20 years.    So I'm not all that surprised to see some of these changes taking place.

 

All these observation notwithstanding, Allentown is still a great train show that's yet to disappoint me anytime I've attended.

 

David

Busy for a threat of snow? So the people didn't mind coming out in the snow for a twice a year event? I haven't been there since Nov 2010 because something unfortunate happened to me and I was escorted out by a cop, the ones that are paid to sit by the doors to guard the hall and make sure nothing takes a hike. The cop talked with Bob House in his office on the way out and Bob said I need to have my mom or someone with me besides my brother next time. I'm not going to get into what happened. I haven't been back since, starting with the Feb 2011 show to now. They haven't updated their Facebook pics since 2011!

I feel sorry for the dealers their cars and trailers must be buried in the parking lot.  Snow on both days is a show killer

Does anyone have any pictures of the show?

Exactly. Gets old after you do it once. 

 

Well I elected to stay home and scored an item on the for sale forum here instead.  I call that a good day.

dennis,

my oldest son was looking at two HO freight cars, price was $44.99. He had $20, I took $20 out of my wallet and my son offered $40. Vendor said no can't do it, now $44.99 for two HO freight cars made in china about 5-6 years ago seems overpriced to me. So he lost a sale over $4.99, we both shook our heads and walked away. I don't know about any dealers on here, but I would rather take $40 cash and lose $4.99 then have to pack it back up and take it home.

Some dealers seem to be like that. I was looking at a lionel car a dealer had for $55 and another dealer had it for $40. I said to the expensive dealer that the guy next to him has it for $40. He told me to go spend my money over there and don't bother buying anything from him. I laughed and said trust me I would never support your business.   This was not at this show it was at a show about 4 years ago.  Funny how some dealers react to certain things

I've got a question about yesterday's show. Did the guy that walked away with the Conrail 2 pack ever go back and pay for it? Just curious.

It was my first time, enjoyed the trip from North Jersey.  Weather was not bad and roads were good getting their.  Seen a lot of nice stuff, and all the all the tables were full, but I think the weather kept people away.

I felt sick to my stomach when I heard that announcement. Pete Costa, the dealer whose merchandise was taken, has been one of the fairest and most reputable guys in the business for years. No dealer should have to go through that but I felt particularly bad when I heard it was him. 

 

Bob

pete: must have been some hard nose dealers there. when i sell at a show,i always tried to help out a younger buyer because 1] alot of kids dont have a ton of money to spend and 2] i felt it was an investment in the future of the hobby,3] some  kids and parents  remember me at future shows possibly forming a freindship of sorts.-jim

 

 

who is bob house? you started the story,might as well finish it.-jim

I think we can figure out the rest!

Pete is a great guy to deal with at train shows and so are his helpers.  I believe Pete goes the extra mile to make a sale at a price both he and the buyer are happy.  I often heard Pete pleasantly say "don't worry what the price tag says, I can do better and let's see if we can make a deal."

 

I did not know about Saturday's walk-off until I saw this thread.  Based on what I heard this morning at A-town, I do not believe that they found the person(s) who walked off with Pete's stuff and did not pay.  It would be helpful if the show operators had video surveillance at the entrance/exits so that if such a situation occurs, they have the ability to review the tape and possibly identify or post a picture of the person(s) of interest online and at other meets.  I would guess it would not take much time for someone to identify or provide a tip.

I know Son House but not Bob House.

 

The rest of the stormy is Thawful!  

 

 

  Yeah, when I heard it, myself and a guy standing near me just shook our heads. The vendor, however, insisted that it could have been an honest mistake, and she told a story from her own experiences. She seemed to have much more faith in people than I did, but I was hoping to hear that she was right, and I was wrong. Guess not.

I see your point, but let's be realistic...there is very little packing involved with 2 HO cars.

Well, why can't Charlie Ro also have his lieutenants do the duty for him on shows like this?  I bet they move more product in two days at a show like this compared with just holding down the fort in Boston, where they can still take phone order & staff the retail store.  I think Charlie left for some other reason.    Just sayin'.

I spoke to one dealer about another show and he told me it cost him about $5,000.00 just to go to a show for the weekend.  He has to rent a truck and pack it up on Thursday, drive to the venue and set up on Friday.  Pay his staff to run the booth for both days.  tear down and drive back home on Sunday and unpack the truck and restock his shelves all the while keeping his store open.  He has to pay for hotel rooms for his staff ans well as pay the staff.   

I suppose anything is possible.  But sometimes I think we're all guilty of thinking of things from a buyer's perspective -- rather than a seller's perspective.  WE want to see certain dealers to appease OUR needs and likes.  But what about theirs?

 

That's what I was referring to when I mention today's marketplace has changed.  Back in the 1980's and 1990's, Charlie would take out a 4-6 page add in the "other" magazine.  Today?  One page... maybe two.

 

Same thing for shows...  Decades ago a dealer might attend more physical shows, because that was necessary to REACH a broader audience.  Sidetrack Hobbies was a regular attendee of Greenberg shows up this way (i.e., PA/NJ), but now doesn't see the ROI in participating.  Can't say I blame them, since I don't even attend Greenberg shows as a buyer anymore.   

 

Look at our list of forum sponsors...  How many attend Allentown?  Or perhaps the appropriate question is, "How many have never attended Allentown?".  In most cases, I'm sure the costs outweigh the benefits.  And then there's this thing called the Internet that has changed nearly everyone's buying habits. 

 

As buyers we wish all the dealers could attend these shows.  But reality dictates a different scenario.  And after all, isn't that what York is for?   

 

Then again, perhaps there's some saucier story at play here... and somebody ticked off so-and-so... And so-and-so packed up their bags and went home --refusing to play ball anymore.  Yes... that sounds much better.  That must be the real reason! 

 

David

When the dealers start skipping York, then we get concerned.

 

I have spoken to a couple people that have done the York Meet for years and thier opinion is York started going down hill when they let the dealers in.  their claim was people were spending their money buying new stuff and not on the old stuff. 

Interesting perspective.  Were in not for the Orange Hall's preponderance of dealers, I wouldn't even attend York.  Aside from connecting with old and new friends -- which is an equally important part of the York experience, I view York as more of a "show" than a train "meet".  But I fully acknowledge its roots are strictly in the latter camp...  thus the somewhat outdated way of thinking that "York started going down hill when they let the dealers in".

 

As for the "new stuff vs. old stuff" factor... we may see the pendulum swinging back to excellent / like-new, pre-owned stuff (as well as new "old stock") due to the grossly inflated prices we're now seeing for goods coming out of China.  I'm glad to finally see Atlas-O has shipped the CZ observation car, 'cause that will likely wind down by Atlas-O purchases.  While I thought the price-point for the CZ cars was excellent, the price-points for their scale freight cars has gotten absolutely ridiculous.  Same with some of Lionel's recent pricing in the 2015 Signature Edition catalog.    I'm glad I built a large portion of my O-Gauge toy train roster when prices were much more reasonable.

 

I think dealers are gonna really start feeling the pinch with some of these recent price hikes on new product.  And folks will consequently find better deals on the slightly older stuff (i.e., built 10-15 years ago) at more affordable price-points.

 

David

I always thought this was a free country, and we were free to choose what and where we buy?  I sure hope that's not changing.

 

Truthfully, while I spend a lot of time in the dealer halls, I spend a lot more money in the other halls as much of the stuff I buy is "recycled".