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RE: Switch Machines --> "Tortoise" - "Smail" - "Cobalt"

Warning: (#1)
There is (x1) big major manufacturing flaw when it comes to these types of switch machines.

Warning: (#2)
Check all functions (100%) before mounting these types of switch machines.

"Tortoise" (Circuitron - USA - P/N 800-6000)

"Smail" (Circuitron - USA - P/N 800-6200)

 "Cobalt" (DCC Concepts - Australia - P/N DCP-CB1DiP)

Special Notes: (Switch Machines)
- All (x3) require V-DC power supply
- All (x3) use stall motor control (motor always under power)
- All (x3) use the same method type of staking (melting) the moving contacts onto the arm



=======================================================

I am presently modifying my (x27) "Tortoise" switch track machines,
before re-mounting to my model train layout.
I must damage the manufacture label and remove the (x5) screws for required modifications.

Warning: (#3)
Once the manufacture label is damaged, "All Warranty" is "Void".
Removing the (x5) mounting screws

(#1)
Tortoise Powered Turnout Shorts.
https://sites.google.com/site/...wered-turnout-shorts
(#2)
Adding an internal 0.1Uf 50V capacitor onto the circuit board (x2) motor terminals
https://ogrforum.com/t...82#71256347285334382
(#3)
Adding sound dampeners between switch machine and underside mounting surface.
Using (1/8") double sided foam tape.

=======================================================

Internal Throw Arm:
- (x2) mounted copper plates
- (x8) contact copper wipers
- (x4) plastic mounting pins = heat melting the (x4) plastic mounting pins

=======================================================

Actual Experience: (#1)
Of the (x27) "Tortoise" switch track machines, I found (x3) "Tortoise" switch track machines,
with (x1) totally broken "Off" copper wiper plate from the moveable internal throw arm.

Actual Experience: (#2)
Of the (x27) "Tortoise" switch track machines, I found (x4) "Tortoise" switch track machines,
with (x1) partially broken "Off" copper plate from the moveable internal throw arm.

Actual Experience: (#3)
Out of (x27) "Tortoise" switch track machines, I found (x7) "Tortoise" switch track machines faulty.
That is almost a (24%) failure rate.
It only takes (x1) switch track machine, to screw up the model train layout.

Actual Experience: (#4)
While repairing the movable internal throw arm, the plastic seems to be made of ABS.
ABS is a low cost engineering plastic that is easy to machine and fabricate. (a harder plastic).
The (x7) "Tortoise" switch track machines that I found to be faulty, had one or more of the plastic mounting pins, incorrectly heat melted.
Some of the tops of the hard plastic heat melted pins, broke off.

=======================================================

Testing Procedure: (#1)
Test "All" switch track machines, before mounting to a model train layout.
Take each switch track machine and shake it.
If you hear an inside rattle sound, a copper plate is broken "Off".

Testing Procedure: (#2)
Connect a constant 9.V-DC power supply (Battery) to the (x2) motor terminals of the switch machine.
The throw arm will go to designated polarity location.
Check the (x2) individual switch contact points, for electrical connections.

Testing Procedure: (#3)
Reverse the constant 9.V-DC power supply (Battery) to the (x2) motor terminals of the switch machine.
The throw arm will move into the "Opposite" designated polarity location.
Check the other (x2) individual switch contact points, for electrical connections.

[ED-RRR]......

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Images (1)
  • Internal Throw Arm
Last edited by OGR CEO-PUBLISHER
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Hello: Clem K

All (x27) of my Tortoise switch machine V-DC motors operate (100%) correctly.

Where I found the problem, was that there was almost a (24%) failure rate,
when using the (x2) S.P.D.T. switches (#4) and (#5).

I use (x1) S.P.D.T. Tortoise switch, to insure (100%) "Digital Track Signal" to the switch track "Frog".
I use (x1) S.P.D.T. Tortoise switch, to my CTI - Model Railroad Computer Control, for track signals.

[ED-RRR]......

turbgine posted:

I have used Tortoise switch machines for 30 years without ever replacing one. The bi-color LEDS wired in reverse parallel have worked without fail.

Hello: Turbgine

Previously Stated: [ED-RRR]
The (x2) copper wiper plates mounted onto the movable internal throw arm,
are only heat melted on the (x4) plastic mounting pins.

Fact: (#1)
You [Turbgine] stated that you have used Tortoise switch machines for 30 years,
without ever replacing one.

Question: (#1)
After (x30) years, [Turbgine] are the latest "Tortoise Switch Machines"
still being manufactured "Exactly" the same ?

Question: (#2)
Are you [Turbgine] stating that all purchased "Tortoise Switch Machines are (100%) fully functional ?
This is also including the (x2) S.P.D.T. Tortoise switches.

Question: (#3)
Are you [Turbgine] stating that the (x2) copper wiper plates,
heat melted on the (x4) plastic mounting pins,
will "Never" brake off (under constant wiper contact pressure),
and will "Never" require any future maintenance ?

[ED-RRR]......

ED-RRR posted:

Question: (#1)
After (x30) years, [Turbgine] are the latest "Tortoise Switch Machines"
still being manufactured "Exactly" the same ?

Who cares, he has a 30 year history with the design, that's pretty impressive!

Question: (#1) Are you [ED-RRR] stating that for 100% certainty that they've changed the manufacturing processor quality of the product?  If so, care to post some evidence to that "fact"?  If the manufacturing has changed, that would seem to indicate that anyone using them would have a lot less than a 30 year history.

Question: (#3)

Are you [Turbgine] stating that the (x2) copper wiper plates,
heat melted on the (x4) plastic mounting pins,
will "Never" brake off (under constant wiper contact pressure),
and will "Never" require any future maintenance ?

Totally bogus question, nobody could claim that.  Let's look at this a different way.

Question: (#2) Are you [ED-RRR] stating that for 100% certainty that these parts will break?  How many have you personally had break?

Why do you insist on always taking the confrontational attitude?  Are you capable of having a rational discussion about a topic without immediately challenging every statement?

RE: (100%) Track Power to the switch track "Frog".

Since I brought this up this subject, I feel that I should do some clarification.

Question:
Do your (O) scale locomotive sometimes show signs of hesitations,
while going through a switch track ?

Fact: (#1)
There are different types of (O) scale "Switch Tracks" from different manufactures,
using (x2) rail track systems and (x3) rail track systems.

Fact: (#2)
There are different types of (O) scale "Switch Tracks" from different manufactures,
using different ways to power the switch track "Frog".

Special Note:
The supplied example "Only" applies to (x2) rail "Switch Tracks" systems.


(#1)
The switch track "Frog" is only track powered supply,
by the (x2) moving rail contact points. (slide chair).
Having (x2) poor electrical contacts, due to track oxidization,
will cause poor electrical conductivity to the track "Frog".

(#2)
Adding a direct track power supply to the "Switch Track Frog", from the (x1) S.P.D.T. Tortoise switch,
will insure (100%) track power supply.
View image below.

[ED-RRR]......

Attachments

Images (1)
  • Powered Switch Track Frog

I have used Tortoise for years never replaced one, (TRUE!) all but 8 turnouts in the plan are worked by them. I have operating sessions every week I can afford to buy any type of switch machine, do you really honestly think I would use an inferior product on a railroad like this it's a switching layout and is used all the time no ovals, end to end, endless switching moves all day long I demand good quality items and that's what I have. maybe it's the West Aussie climate that makes them better.  I also pay the retail price and disgraceful shipping charges for the machines I don't like Cobalt because you can't move them manually only through electrical not good when setting them up or you have a sticking turnout a lot of my turnouts are one piece rail and soldered copper clad ties need heavier wire on the machine they still work great drop over for a session you will enjoy yourself working a trouble free railroad, we do. Next session scheduled for tomorrow be here by 9-30AM and finish at 5-00PM  lunch is provided you won't go hungry. Roo.

DSC00860

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Images (1)
  • DSC00860
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