SWITCHES!

You can't go wrong with Ross switches. Good choice.

If I were to build again, Ross would be my choice. Not enough time left to start another.

 

I just sold my two prewar layouts with all accessories. Prewar 0711 switches are bullet proof.

Ross.

pelago; Not trying to start a flame-war here, but your comment your "Atlas switches just seem to crap-out all the time" intrigues me. 

No I don't work for Atlas; and no I don't have any Ross switches only because I climbed on the Atlas"O" bandwagon back in the 90's when it was introduced. From everything I read, Ross is a great product.

Back to your issues with your Atlas switches; what seemed to "crap out all the time"? I know the turnout motors can fail with to much current flow via the pushbuttons....

All the ones I have installed now and on past layouts, have mechanically been very good. The BIGGEST issues I have with them are wheel-sets (usually Lionel's) that are out of gauge to the point they will cause a short circuit crossing the switch assembly. I find I have to file more clearance with the center rail as it nears the outside running rail at the frog area to eliminate this issue-an issue that should be taken care of by the importers, NOT the track makers. There is a good case for an industry standard in "O" gauge for correct wheel-set gauging.......

Not holding my breath that will ever happen either.

Gargraves track, Ross Custom switches and Tortoise switch machines. 26 years and counting. What a flawless recipe for trouble free trackage.

let me see if i can explain it further,

power supply is 12vdc, I used the control switches that came with it, simple momentary touch and release.  these little coils that control the arm do not like constant voltage on them and they will die if that happens (I happen to be a retired comm/elec maintenance type and hold many FCC tickets for various comm systems to be able to work on them)  these are so simple, put voltage across the two points m]elec/magnetism takes over and the control rod moves,  like taking a nail and wrapping wire around it and cutting a tin can and bending it to make a "telegraph" set...

but back to mine,  they would just stop,  apply the voltage all you want and no movement, but do it by hand and no problem, take the little arm that sticks up and move it up or down, no resistance at all.  No dirt inside it, using a simpson 360 multimeter (old school, analog type) and voltages are where they are supposed to be, and all the grounds are good, but they just would stop working, then the next day hit the momentary switch and the switch activated, where yesterday it would not..  Leaving nothing to doubt i would take the switch out, (real pain in the *** if it is balasted and lookes good) but not working is not working.  take it out go through it completely, have it so clean a actual feather activates the mechanical arm, put it back in and hit the switch and it works, then a week later it craps out again.  I have one that for the life of me i can not figure out, it is frozen frozen motionless completely,  have not forced it, have it on the work bench now and trying to get eyeballs inside that little core to see if something is in there???

but there you have it

nah, you did not start a flame war, not at all.

Seems like we have to say this every week.  Ross are the best switches.

.....

Dennis

I had used Lionel 0-27 switches on my previous layout and never had a good enough excuse to rip up the layout to replace them....until I purchased a large articulated MTH steamer. Forget about the curve but going straight the slightly raised center rail would jam the pickup rollers between the rail and engine frame and that wasn't going to work. I had to finally replace the switches. Two Lionel switches stayed in places where that engine was too big to travel. Ross went on the mainline tracks. 

 

The first Ross switch, I think, may have been a dud. Some bent rails and frequent derailments but I put many years of service on it and "made it work". With my new layout, that switch was retired and all new ones put in. What a pleasure to run on them. One needs a small adjustment but otherwise they are the best you can get. I use all of them as manually thrown with no machines but regardless, these things are works of art. Only derailments are caused by operator error. Steve is one of the best guys out there as well. 

Thanks for your reply pelago; I figured your issue was the switching coil which IS rather dainty.....

I never have those issues as I manually control all mine in a walk-around environment.

I am using Atlas switches because I am using their track and wanted matching switches. They are not inexpensive either. I like the solid rails, looks, and just about everything else with entire Atlas track system. Solid rail was possibly the thing that got me interested in Atlas track and the more I looked the more I liked about it. I have to agree with D&H 65 about the Atlas switches, although I have not had any derailment problems yet. 

 

I know some folks run their Atlas switches on DC, but I believe the Atlas manual recommends 16-18VAC. I believe someone even reported using 20VDC to get the best operation. Maybe the 12VDC you were using was causing you problems with your switches? Kind of sounds like it could have been a problem from what you described. I have never tried using DC on them or less than the 16-18VAC Atlas recommends. As for the switch machines, all dual coil switch machines have the same burn out problems when the switch button is held too long, it is not unique to only Atlas.

 

I'm also sure Ross makes very fine switch, they probably have the best reputation of anyone in O gauge switches. They also have the best selection of switches available in O gauge. As I said above, I wanted solid rails and everything to match or I may have given Ross more consideration. I did look at them, still do sometimes. Atlas has a pretty fair selection also, but not like Ross. If I ever need that certain switch, Ross may make it on to my layout.

 

Ross also uses the DZ-1000 or DZ-2500 switch machines which are not dual coil and don't burn out like the dual coils do. I just had to purchase a DZ-1000 for one of my Atlas switches in a curve that I couldn't get the supplied switch machine to fit on. This is really the first problem I've had so far with any of the Atlas stuff I have. Someone more experienced may have been able to get it to fit? I didn't want to have to cut anything out to make it fit either. The DZ isn't wired yet, so I can't speak on it's operation. I'm sure it will be fine though, many here use them and seem to be quite satisfied.

Ross, Tortoise, or Caboose Industries ground throws.

Ditto

When I began to plan on my current, perpetually under construction layout, I had a mix of Gargraves and Super O track from my previous layout.  The connections between the two were rough at best and I didn't like the look of two different track systems on the layout.  So for the new one I looked into Atlas O, MTH Scaletrax and getting more Gargraves.

 

I always loved Super O track, but the lack of wide curves and switched eliminated them from the start. (I'll use them for Christmas layouts and my proposed subway/elevated lines.)  I do like Gargraves track, but their I had a lot of problems with derailments on their switches.  Looking at Atlas and MTH, I loved the solid rails on both, which eliminated Gargraves hollow rails.  But I chose the Atlas track because of the wider curves and switches available at the time (2004).  Atlas track just seemed stronger and heftier than the Scaletrax, and more customizable.

 

I also considered Ross switches but chose to stay with Atlas for uniformity.  So far I've had zero issues with the Atlas switches, making sure I didn't burn the switch motors out when I activated them.  Although I was concerned about that on switches I couldn't see clearly on the far reaches of the layout, since I couldn't see if they moved properly and relying on faith there'd be no derailment.  With that, my latest redesign with put all track and switches within easy reach to operate them manually with no need to worry about burning them out.

 

At the same time, I would have had no problem at all using Gargraves/Ross track and Ross switches.  It was just a personal choice to use Atlas, no reflection on the quality of the track or I would not have considered them in the first place.  I have bought several items from Ross Custom Switches and highly recommend their products.  Steve Brenneisen is one of the class guys in this hobby and a pleasure to talk to and do business with.

 

 

I have 125 Lionel 022 switches, which after suitable modification (Google 022/711 switch operating pblms) have been bullet proof.  I recently bought a number of Lionel 711 switches and a couple of 6-65165/6.  The old 711s appear to be much higher quality than the new 5165/6s.  They all need some restoration as they are 80 years old.  Obviously I run tubular track which I have always used and like just fine.  I am not a model railroader but rather a toy train operator.  My layouts don't look anything like a real railroad but are complex with lots of track and switches.

BTW, I paid between $4 and $7 for most of my 022 switches.  The big advantage of tubular track is it is cheap.

'tubular track is it is cheap.'

something to be said about that!!

the atlas and ross are NOT, but i felt this would be probably the last layout for me WTH

you got that right, friend of mine used fasttrack and in a room 10'x 10'

built a layout and spend over $1000 on track. fasttrack switches alone

cost him $60 a piece.

http://catalog.rossswitches.co...t.cfm?item_id=738188

500.00 us dollars

Ross track & switches with just a couple of Lionel 72" switches.

All Atlas track and switches and have never regretted it.  Have upgraded all the switch machines to Tortoise though which was the original plan.

 

Art

I have Atlas track and switches. I had problems with the switches having dead spots. After putting jumper wires where it was needed solved that problem. If I were to start over, I would be tempted to go the Gargraves Track/Ross Switches route.

Got to admit, that is a nice looking setup they have there! You would probably be approaching similar cost by using 4 switches and a cross (Ross or Atlas) to try and build one yourself. Would probably not look as nice. The Ross is already built and looks really good too.

I'll call your $1K bet on switch purchases and raise you to $2K! I had all of the FasTrack I needed to build my layout. Immediately prior to laying track, I bailed out. Sold all of the FasTrack and purchased Gargraves / Ross. No regrets.

 

I especially appreciate that Ross is a made in USA product (no "offshore production issues") and if you call at the right time Steve answers the phone to take your order! The variety of switches will let you do things that you can only "wish" that some of the other brands would do.

 

Gilly

 

BTW, my Gargraves is stainless steel with wood ties. By experience, I have noted that this track stays much cleaner than the Atlas track used on the majority of our club modular layout. The Gargraves flex track is also super-easy to use.

I sure wish Steve had come out with his tubular track design before I invested in the new Lionel 0-72 version. If I ever rebuild, Ross will be my choice.

I had excellent results with Ross switches on my first layout that I'm going to use them on my next layout (currently being built).  I like the fact they are made in America, and come in many sizes.  Also, I'm using DZ-2500 switch machine for TMCC compatibility.

 

I have just a few switches for the yard/terminal area.  And, yes, their switches are not inexpensive so I bought the switches over a couple of years to lessen the cost impact.

 

Ron

 

 

Ross, GG, Tortise.

I've heard a lot about the Tortoise switch machines. I have one Atlas switch on a curve and can't get the Atlas machine to fit to my satisfaction. I got a DZ1000 for it and it fits fairly well, but I am not sure I like it. I was thinking about trying a Tortoise. How hard was it to fit your Atlas switches with the Tortoise machines? I am guessing you are satisfied with their operation also? Thanks for any info you can add.

This question can probably be answered when i get the first Ross switch, but why would someone buy a non motorized switch and then buy a separate tortoise switch to hang underneath?

would seem a preconcluded disastor waiting with mechanical switching where one has to go around and manually switch?

now to predicate this question a bit i have only seen or held two types of switches old lionel 0-27 from the last century and Atlas

I have not been doing this nearly as long, not even close to what you all have been doing

so i am a relative newbie to this new stuff.  back after wwii it was lionel or american flyer and that was it

I use fastback switches and track and have not had any problems. Some claim that the track is noisy but so our the real thing. 

Atlas switch machines come on all their switches and they are O.K. but Tortoise is a much better option in my opinion.  So I used Atlas until I was ready to switch over.  My son installed them all for me and he made it look easy.  It would have been harder for me as I am not as mechanically inclined as he is.  With two of us doing it, one on top and one on the bottom it was pretty fast and easy.

 

I love the operation of them.  Very smooth and extremely reliable.  They won't burn out like Atlas can.  They hold the closure rails tight against the stock rails.  AND everything looks so much better without an oversized, ugly switch machine on top.

 

Art

I have been lucky with Atlas but did not enjoy the learning curve. For the most part I have the drops on all three rails of all three legs. Switch machines are big and can give "ify" performance so I switched to Z Stuff switches. Most of my Atlas switches were acquired at 50% of retail either on eBay or here on FSOT. Be mindful of the jumper wiring under the switch. Older switch wires are embedded in the plastic and are failure prone. Newer have obvious external wires but can also be unreliable. If I had it to do over again would still go Atlas because I have Atlas track.

 

I may be wrong but recall that Ross switches are not pre-wired.

another thing to think about, and this is now today real time.

Atlas is undergoing some serious issues with their production plant in China, hard to get the real answers but when the people at atlas say they expect to start receiving pieces and parts in February??  well, sounds kinda iffy at best.  had i not had atlas to start would have gone another direction

Thanks for the Tortoise info, Chugman. I may have to give one of these a try.

 

Not 100% certain, but I think the Ross switches can be purchased ether way, wired or un-wired. I think Ross-Ready is the wired version and comes with a DZ1000 installed ready to go.

 

Atlas has had a lot of problems with manufacturing, but I think those are over and they are getting back to normal. Some product is becoming available, my LHS told me Saturday that they were getting some Atlas switch machines in next week that I have been waiting on for months. Things may finally be starting to look up for Atlas-O track and switches. 

 

They also lost their main O gauge person a year or two ago due to his untimely passing. He will not easily be replaced and I'm sure this also has affected their O gauge line and not in a positive way. Two very large obstacles to overcome for any company.

 

Also to add, my LHS has also been out of Atlas HO and N for quite sometime and they are now just about fully re-stocked with both of those lines. Maybe another good sign for us in O gauge. 

First choice is ROSS......

But I have many GarGraves too. The current GG are better than the older ones.

But I use the older ones off the mainline in switching areas.

along the same lines.....

accessory transformer?

a stand alone transformer for accessories? Lionel makes one for around fifty bucks, and the various accessories use, unfortunately, different voltages,  some of the audio devices use either AC or DC to run, Miller engineering same story

comments

I use conventional old 3-rail track and switches because they are cheap and reliable. Once I bought a box full of rusty old O72 curves and long straights for $5. It took some work to clean it up, but that's the price of cheap!

 

Old Lionel O22 non-derailing switches are my favorite. I've gotten some of them for cheap or free, and reworked them to get them working reliably again. O42 manual switches are good, too. I also have a few 711 and 721 switches (O72 curves).

 

I don't recommend the old O27 "non-derailing" switches because they draw power all the time a train with metal wheels is on the switch, and they use track power only unless you modify them. I've modified some for fixed voltage input with capacitor-discharge power supply, but there are some limitations with that. But I do use a substantial amount of O27 track with various curve radii.

 

My preferred way to clean rusty track is with a big wire wheel in a bench grinder. Pull the track pins and clean them individually. Gently ream out the rail ends with a drill bit and re-shape the holes by inserting a rod and crimping the rail web with dull dikes. Clean rusty switch rails carefully with sandpaper, and take the switches apart as necessary to clean contacts etc.

 

The price of cheap is sweat equity on old stuff.

 

ACE, you and I agree.  There is something to taking old stuff and making it work again.  I am restoring a lot of 072 track and switches to make them useful again.  It takes time, but the results are worth it.

 

My easy to clean the rust off of the rails it to run the train.  Make a loop of track and run a short train until the top of the rails are shiny.  Takes a few hours, but I am running the train, not rubbing the track with a ScotchBrite pad.  I have written a few times about bending the rails where the pins are installed to make a better connection.