"Trains that do more"?

I hope the discussion does not devolve into bickering about which manufacturer is better.

You are kidding right?

I think it's like most slogans these days where they proclaim "Our product is better" or "Our detergent is stronger".  Better or stronger than what, they don't say.

I doubt that MTH will change their slogan.  Other than Lionel, you also have WBB, Weaver, and Atlas, plus a few other manufacturers that don't have their own sound systems.

MTH's slogan is "Trains that do more."  It appears with the advent of Vision Line, that Lionel engines now have more features and "do more". 

What features did MTH introduce that pushed the envelope or that were never before seen? 

With MTH, Details are more "Road Specific" on their diesels and steam engines.

MTH also offers More Road names per diesel model run than their competition.

MTH also had die cast steamers in thier lineup- NO plastic steamers. Even in their starter sets, their steam engines are die cast.

MTH also offers Remote control in their starter sets. MTH has broken the mold with the tinplate line in :

• a Offering a tinplate line
• B Adding the smoke and digital sounds to the tinplate line ultimately rejuvenating a once perceived "dying" market.
• MTH was the First Mfg to install diesel smoke![ something that ROWI wanted to do with their high priced ALCo PA's but claimed they couldn't]
• MTH was the first to have die cast sprung metal trucks and couplers standard in their freight car & passenger car lineup. The competition still had plastic springs to hold in the couplers that were not too reliable.
• With PS1 factory installed, MTH was the first to have RTR programable locomotive- as archaic as they were it was cool back then!

 Does this slogan pertain to their remote control system?  I am simply curious about the features of MTH engines.  

MTH's DCS did more back at the "turn of the century" as opposed to the competition while NOT raising the price of the locomotives. With DCS one has more "creep" more "continuity" between locomotives [they didn't fight between unit consists because one unit has Odessey andthe other regular TMCC.]

DCs allows usesrs to "download" any advances in the software.

DCs allows users to play their own sounds and not just standard factory set sounds for PS2 &3 locos.

Over the decades, if their is one thing consistant with MTH, it's change! MTH seems to improve their product from starter sets to freight cars to accessories as time goes on as their competition tries to outdo one another. This ultimately drives the competition to either step up or get out of the way thus benefiting us end-users/consumers.

The one feature that MTH DCS brought to the table that I really like and use is the ALL feature. When you run multiple trains and at times on the same main line it really increases the enjoyment and ease of operating electric trains.

Technology is always advancing, over the 20 years or so, the new electronic train technology continues its march in the WOW factor. Every new operating system brings new features to the party.

When TMCC fist appeared it took running conventional trains to a new level.

When DCS made its entry it added more capabilities to operating trains with command control.

The latest entry is Legacy that has gone to another level.

A lot of electric train operators never jumped on the electronic bandwagon and are content with conventional operation, whatever floats your boat.

No, I was not kidding.  I really want to know if MTH introduced advancements, and if so what they were.  I am interested in facts and not in the silly our team is better than your team nonsense.

I am wondering if the lack of U.S. steamers in the most recent catalog is partially due to them taking time to dream up new features. 

I believe (perhaps mistakenly) that the two most innovative manufacturers are Lionel and MTH, since they have propitiatory operating systems.  Since Atlas and 3rd Rail are using the older  operating systems that makes it pretty difficult for them to push the technical envelope.

"Trains that do more" is simply a neat marketing phrase because it simply doesn't answer the question of "More than what?"  The target is not only moving, but it's unspecified.

MTH trains certainly do more than a basic AC/DC powered train, my Mr. Coffee coffeemaker or even some people I know, but probably do a little less than a prototype train, your PC or i-whatever.

Rusty

Loop back speed control, aka "cruise".  Fan driven smoke units.

Of course it will because the topic title is  "baited" to get that result.  Happens all the time with folks who can't resist the temptation.

But Bob has it right in the second post:  It's an advertising slogan, nothing less and nothing more.  MTH trains do more than the traditional toy trains.  So do Lionel trains.  Both have control systems that provide plenty of "more."

The DCS "ALL" command is the "best" feature of DCS (for me) and has permitted me to run my trains the way I do.  I start up to 4 trains simultaneously per loop that has permitted me to run over 30 trains simultaneously whereas with TMCC I topped out at 11. Legacy does not have this capability though its TR does come close but does not permit the use of MUs or double/triple headers in that methodology. The other feature that came out before Legacy, was the speed display readout. With TMCC I had to visually match speeds of multiple consists on the same loop. With DCS, I just set the trains on a particular speed.  Legacy caught up with its speed step and it has a greater grandularity than MTH's smph with approximately 3 speed steps per 1 smph at 10 smph. Additionally, when I was trying to decide between DCS and TMCC, the smaller number of components associated with DCS prompted me to go forward with DCS over TMCC. TMCC and then Legacy developed the openning doors on passenger cars and subways. MTH featured opening doors on the Coorslite train but has not continued to promote that feature on other cars. MTH has also brought its DCS system to the HO world and some of those capabilities (with smaller components) are trending back to the ogage market with their Proto 3 offerings. Additionally they support the 2 rail scale market by permitting their engines to run in that arena by swapping wheel sets. That said the feature sets between Legacy and DCS are similar with each having some points better than the other's and for me it is the best of all worlds because now I purchase engines from SMR, 3rd Rail, Lionel and MTH not worring about the control system but the features of a particular engine. 

"When will they ever learn, the answer is blowin' in the wind".

Kevin,  probably the biggest thing that MTH did to the hobby was in just showing up on the scene. Lionel had been recycling the same (nice) equipment for many years with little pressure to offer more and in fact had contracted with Mike Wolf to produce several new die-cast locomotives for them in the 1990s.

When contractual difficulties arose between Lionel and Mike, he launched Mike's Train House with a couple of scale Dash 8s and the first die-cast O gauge Challengers. Mr Wolf then introduced the Rail King Line with a small Mohawk and then a nice traditional sized Hudson, a slew of F3s, and he was off and running.

Lionel soon HAD to shift gears and peddle faster. The result is where the hobby is today with the amazing amount of diverse product and the two aforementioned control systems that we enjoy today!

Allan, I did not intend to bait a trap.  I have not been around see the evolution of DCS and TMCC into Legacy. Before 2010, the last time a played with a train was 1980 when I was 8 years old, and it was the conventional type. 

Of course I understand it is a marketing slogan, but I thought that there was the possibility that MTH trains do in fact at some point in time actually did more...than their competitors, than previous product lines....more than something. 

I would happily change the title of the thread.  How do I change the title?

I think Mike raised the bar for the O Scale industry back in the 90s.  He is doing it now with HO as well.  It is similar to  the 'horsepower' wars we are seeing again with the big 3 auto makers.  In the end, it is good to be a consumer with this kind of competition.

Dave

The technology increases come in waves. Like Dave said, back in the 90's when the market was really good, the manufacturer's were developing new items and features for our trains. Now that the market isn't doing all that well, the developments have slowed up a bit. Hopefully, if the economy ever picks up again, they will be back at the drawing board making "Trains that do more".

........but the big three auto makers aren't raising the bar by having them manufacturered in korea

My Camaro wasn't made in Korea.  It is just nice to see the competition.  I think that is a healthy thing.

Dave

The list of MTH achievements above should have included the Z-4000, the only modern 400 watt train transformer to receive the UL rating.

Having both the Lionel VL Hudson and a Z-4000, I would say both companies have made some marvelous advances in toy train technology.  

Indeed,hopefully Mth gets caught back up with American steam soon, so Lionel doesn't get lazy!

Looks like the bait shop's open for business...

Rusty

No baiting here Rusty, just a little tongue-in-cheek. Dave took it in stride.

The other thing about the Z4000 that was really innovative was being able to program your PS-1 with it.

Sure, the "Trains that do more" is just a slogan now but I think it actually meant something when it came out.  I'd have to dig out my old catalogs to check but I think there were a couple of pages in one that explained what it meant.  They compared features in their ready to run sets vs. "the competition" and did a pretty good job of making their sets look "better".  So, at least at one point in time they were comparing themselves to something tangible.

Regards,

Eric S.

Saline, MI

Nope...was proudly assembled here in Ontario by CAW members using 40% of parts coming from overseas..so since it's below the 75% required to call it domestic...it's a full import...

Do you work in Oshawa?  If so...Thanks!  I love my car.

Back to trains.

Another great feature of DCS is the Record/Playback which can be tricky to setup properly but the trains will do exactly what has been recorded up to 500 button pushes!!  All this in DCS without having to purchase extra equipment.  

The next thing is the DCSlite now included in most ready to run sets.  This is a great feature for people just getting into the hobby.  

"TRAINS THAT DO MORE" is the slogan used originally with the MTH HO scale offerings.  Considering the technology they have developed for the HO locomotives with PS3, operating remote ctrl HO couplers, etc. I understand their choice of words.

Don't forget the "Clank of Death" installed on PS1 trains...a industry first!

Perhaps they could change it to:

"Trains that do slightly less at this point, but not by much!!!" 

or...

"Trains that kind of do more than what they used to but not as much as they will later!!!"

I'm sure the lawyers would love it

Is my Maxima really a "Four Door Sportscar"?  No, not even close.  But it's catchy and it helps Nissan sell cars.  Now if they change it to something like:

"MTH:  Because Lionel really s**ks!!!", then I start to take issue

I am wondering if the lack of U.S. steamers in the most recent catalog is partially due to them taking time to dream up new features.

Wasn't there something a while back about their machinery that makes the steamers broke down or something?  What became of that anyway???

"Trains that do more." In Europe
Mike's Zug Haus.

Dav

I'm a big fan of both Lionel and MTH and all the other manufacturers for that matter but I think an advertising slogan like that would be funny as h**l!

Jerry

When I hear that term I think of MTH's HO and Tinplate line up. Both truly do more than ever before!  Lionel has to with Legacy. Both company's have gave us some cool toy's to play with! 

Thanks to both of them.

I had a Lionel diesel set when I was a kid and my sons got a steamer starter set from Grandpa 11 years ago.  The following year we discovered MTH starter sets and true to the MTH moniker, it "did more" than the Lionel starter sets.  (wireless remote, Protosound, protocoupler, Realtrax).  We've been with MTH ever since, adding DCS and have expanded our Realtrax layout.  Now we collect Premier for the enhanced details and scale size.  I admire Lionel's Vision line engines with the steaming whistles and steam chest effects and more complex sounds.  I wish MTH engines would add these features (for less $$$ than Lionel).  The point being that since the turn of the century, all digital O-gauge trains "do more" than their previous conventional counterparts.

This has been very informative.  I have to ask, is there really a "clank of death" on PS1 engines.  Is Joe joking or is that a real sound the engine makes?

There were "clinks" and "clanks" to give audio feedback while navigating the PS-1 menus.

The three clangs of doom, was/is an issue with some PS1 locomotives. The problem would arise, when the battery would get weak, and it would scramble the control chip.

 I had a PS1 switch engine devolope the three clangs of doom ailment before MTH devoloped the reset chip to repair them. My locomotive required a trip back to MTH for repair, they must have been REALLY BUSY in the service dept, it took more than 8 MONTHS to get my engine back. I hear that their service turn around time has improved VERY much.

 PS1 can still be found on NOS(New Old Stock) and used engines, but has not been produced in many years now, so it is a fading, but not extinct problem.

Doug

The other explanation making the rounds is the subcontractor doing the die-casting for locomotive bodies suddenly closed up shop, making it necessary to locate a new subcontractor, re-locate the tooling and get them set up and tuned at the 'new' facility.

---PCJ

It was a very real--and much feared--sound.  But things have advanced far beyond that in more recent times, and the latest MTH locomotives require no battery at all (and, in the case of steam power, have shed that unsightly tether).

Spoken like a true MTH fan

I think Mike raised the bar for the O Scale industry back in the 90s. 

And he still is raising the bar.

• Look at the Latest details of the premier line freight cars upgraded with separate metal grab rails. 
• Latest diesel locomotives with Road name specific separate details.
• Latest sound that is more realistic and clear than before

LOL!  I have to confess that I never mastered those clinks and clanks and that was why my beloved PS-1 engine sat on display for many years until she finally got a PS-2 upgrade.  Now she has her rightful place in my (admittedly small) fleet.