Never heard of it.

Evine is from MN and similar to QVC & HSN

Special Value of the Day: $240+$10s/h Polar Express set - looks like the LC remote model prior to the newest LC +remote that now has snow on the car roofs.

http://www.evine.com/Product/4..._-TTV469085-_-111517

Last week Evine was selling a LC Hudson that came with 2 (two) pieces of straight track, even though the presentation had it running around an oval of FasTrack.

And the station host described it as "Back in the day, it was called a 'horse iron'".  I kid you not. 

Traindiesel posted:

Last week Evine was selling a LC Hudson that came with 2 (two) pieces of straight track, even though the presentation had it running around an oval of FasTrack.

And the station host described it as "Back in the day, it was called a 'horse iron'".  I kid you not. 

Not surprising for the left coast.

Hope you & Lynley have a great Thanksgiving.

Gerry

RickO posted:

Howard Hitchcock promoting Lionel trains in a 1hr spot on a home shopping channel right now . Dish network evine channel 134.

To me this smacks of desperation.

Pete

Texas Pete posted:

To me this smacks of desperation.

Pete

I guess this would make Lionel desperate for a LONG time. Lionel's days using home shopping networks go back as far a the Richard Kughn era using QVC and has continued ever since. This is nothing new for Lionel, it's called marketing. 

Texas Pete posted:

RickO posted:

Howard Hitchcock promoting Lionel trains in a 1hr spot on a home shopping channel right now . Dish network evine channel 134.

To me this smacks of desperation.

Pete

Really? How so?

Home shopping networks may not be my cup of tea (I never watch) but I’m sure their audiences are huge. Again, I’m not their target but I know there are 3-4 of those channels on my cable system. Selling trains -- or whatever -- on these shows reach millions that don’t participate on train forums or go to hobby stores. And don’t forget. With the holidays approaching it’s a good time to be making the public aware of what’s always been a traditional holiday purchase.

I call it good business.

This Evine event is being promoted on Lionel's Facebook page, so it shouldn't be a total surprise.

I don't want to come off as a shrill for Lionel, but what are they suppose to do? A visit to any train show and you'll see Lionel's die-hard consumer is getting older. Hobby shops are closing all over the place for any variety of reasons. The first rule of retail is a product has to be seen to sell. Go to the grocery store: Companies pay extra money to get their product on the end caps or middle isle displays, because they sell better due to the heightened visibility.

Let's face it folks: This is an overly critical crowd here on the forum. It's one thing to point out legitimate product problems. But there's also an undue amount of criticism about a variety of other things. I don't see any one else stepping up to the plate to start a brand new train company, pour a quarter of a million dollars into new tooling for a single locomotive, and then justify the expense when you only sell 500 of them. I personally think Lionel has bent over backwards trying to please the high end market (while trying to remain profitable), which happens to be the most difficult audience to please.

I applaud Lionel for making any effort to reach new customers.

It is a tough sell these days with the break down of the American family... nearly half the nation's children are being raised in a single parent household. Reality check folks: These households are not always flush with spending money, never mind that trains have traditionally been a father-son hobby.

And then there are those who blame the kids for wanting smart phones instead. When was the last time you saw a pay phone? It's almost been made essential today, for kids to have a cell phone. And how about the schools? They now expect kids to have access to the internet in order to do their homework.

These are changing times for certain, but whenever kids see my train layout, they still get as excited as we all must have been decades ago when we train guys were much younger. And I don't have high-end digital trains, and they still get a kick out of running them.

Yep, when I was a kid I remember fondly the Lionel display layout at the Sears department store... Sears is not doing as well these days. Lionel trains were everywhere when I was a kid. You don't buy what you don't see. 

Along with this Evine spot, I also noticed my local Walmart has a bunch of Lionel train sets this year, both the battery powered and electric. I got chatting with a store manager and now they're going to set up a display with one of the Lionel battery Christmas sets.

Man, if everyone here did as much to promote the starter end hobby as they do complaining about the high-end of the hobby, maybe things would be a little bit different.

One thing for certain: This particular sub-forum of the OGR Forums, would be much more pleasurable to read.

OK, just who is Howard Hitchcock?  I'm only familiar with Alfred Hitchcock.

Hot Water posted:

OK, just who is Howard Hitchcock?  I'm only familiar with Alfred Hitchcock.

Lionel LLC CEO.

I came across the show last night as well.  I watched for about 15 mins. I was glad to see it, but I was disappointed in the presentation, which may be limited by the TV program, or was perhaps lackluster on Lionel's part? 

Last night they were just trying to sell a toy train (Polar Express, Mickey Mouse set w ears, G gauge Mickey Mouse set).  Simple oval set up and add on figure 8, nothing exciting or enchanting about it.  Lionel needs to bring back dealer display type set ups for times like this.  They need to show the buyers what is ultimately possible, then point them the starter set to get them going.

Lionel shouldn't be merely selling toy trains, they should be selling the nostalgia, the cross generational relationship connections, the STEM (science, technology, engineering, and mathematics) involved, the tradition, the fun, the real life history, the carpentry, wiring, scenic-ing that are all part of the hobby.  

Buying that train isn't about seeing it go around in loops, it's about the relationships you deepen, the practical skills you gain, and the fun that you carry on for a lifetime.  That is what Lionel should be selling.  

Oh and by the way, there were no kids on set - that was curious to me.

Of course, those are just my two cents.

JD

They are most likely limited to what the network wants to sell to be shown.  The last thing they want is a bunch of returns because "this isn't what they showed on tv".  The network dictates the format not Lionel.

Notch 6 posted:

Texas Pete posted:

To me this smacks of desperation.

Pete

I guess this would make Lionel desperate for a LONG time. Lionel's days using home shopping networks go back as far a the Richard Kughn era using QVC and has continued ever since. This is nothing new for Lionel, it's called marketing. 

I may not have returned to the toy train hobby if it wasn’t for my wife bringing to my attention Dick Maddox’s appearance and demonstrations of Bachmann HO Explorer sets on QVC in the mid ‘90’s.  Dick was fabulous in his presentation; and yes, I still have that 2-8-0 passenger set.

Pennsylvania Flyer just crapped out on TV. Would only go in reverse and wouldn't respond to remote. Had to cut to another shot.  Frosty set was uncoupling.  How embarrassing on live TV.  To the casual viewer they covered it up well though.

Texas Pete posted:

To me this smacks of desperation.

To me, this smacks of terrific marketing! I wish we could afford to do it!

There is a whole world of model train sales beyond what you know as "the hobby." Lionel has sold their products via this method for many, many years. They sell a LOT of entry level train sets via Evine, QVC, etc.

An act of desperation? Not a chance. It's very smart marketing.

Last night they were just trying to sell a toy train (Polar Express, Mickey Mouse set w ears, G gauge Mickey Mouse set).  Simple oval set up and add on figure 8, nothing exciting or enchanting about it.  Lionel needs to bring back dealer display type set ups for times like this.  They need to show the buyers what is ultimately possible, then point them the starter set to get them going.

Lionel shouldn't be merely selling toy trains, they should be selling the nostalgia, the cross generational relationship connections, the STEM (science, technology, engineering, and mathematics) involved, the tradition, the fun, the real life history, the carpentry, wiring, scenic-ing that are all part of the hobby.  

For the vast majority, train sets from Lionel have always been what you describe as a simple oval set up. Some have come with a figure 8, some with an added truck, billboard or telephone poles. Granted during the MPC years, Lionel sets came with more rolling stock than they usually do now, and there were more sets that offered an expanded initial package.

But let's not overlook the sound packages that are now standard with starter sets. And let's not overlook the choice of control between the LionChief controller or using Bluetooth. There were a good many low cost starter sets in years past, that came with neither a horn or a whistle, never mind the added sounds.

Lionel is also aware that more people today rent, lease or live in an apartment/complex than do own a house. And with the changing economy, people move more than during the postwar years. There's many a town that was once thriving and isn't anymore. So Lionel comes up with the Plug and Play feature, which makes the floor or temporary layout more easily expanded with accessories.

In the history of the hobby, today is no different. You got a train set, and if the interest was there, you went to the train store and invested in building that first layout. Just today, there aren't Lionel dealers like there once was. So you're not going to see display layouts as you once did years ago.

BUT there's the internet. There's YouTube. There are new avenues of promoting and learning about the hobby, and how to go about building a layout. I recall when Lionel did the appearances with a layout on the TODAY show, there's was mostly nothing but nick-picking and grumbling... Where were the SCALE trains?  Oh, those were cheap starter sets. Why didn't they show off the Legacy control? The layout wasn't big enough.  The segment wasn't long enough.

Seesh! I think a big part of the problem is US: We expect Lionel to be and to do EVERYTHING (say 'entitlement'), and still be in business. Could starter sets be improved even more. Yes. We've recently seen threads about stripped gears and smaller motors in locomotives. So there's room for improvement. But meanwhile Lionel is investing a lot of money into the high end market, which while very devoted and spends year-round, is also still small. And those are also the people that grumble and complain the loudest.

So what should Lionel do? In years gone by, there was basically one product line. Now there's all these different sub-niches. They can't put money into all of them at the same time. Though I would agree that the starter set is the business card for the future, so a priority should be placed there. But the "traditional" market is more seasonal: The winter months. The high-end market is year-round. But how many people have 096 curves? So Lionel makes changes that allow scale items to run on more popular smaller radius curves, and some people still complain.

As the saying goes, it's much easier to drive the car from the back seat while taking a nap. If this is such an easy business to endeavor in, I don't know why we're not seeing a whole plethora of brand new companies started by people on this forum - who seem to know more about the business than people who are actually in the business - starting up right now.

brianel_k-lineguy posted:

Seesh! I think a big part of the problem is US: We expect Lionel to be and to do EVERYTHING (say 'entitlement'), and still be in business. Could starter sets be improved even more. Yes. We've recently seen threads about stripped gears and smaller motors in locomotives. So there's room for improvement. But meanwhile Lionel is investing a lot of money into the high end market, which while very devoted and spends year-round, is also still small. And those are also the people that grumble and complain the loudest.

And we have a winner!

 I wouldn't lump all the high end guys into the "grumble and complain" category.  Many  recognize that without the lower end sets and sales the higher end stuff can't get made.

 I wouldn't lump all the high end guys into the "grumble and complain" category.  Many  recognize that without the lower end sets and sales the higher end stuff can't get made.

You sir, are quite correct. I wish more people realized the second sentence. And while I know you are quite the high-end guy, you also display intelligence and balance in your postings, along with the occasional wit. 

Jerry Calabrese once said Lionel can ill-afford to abandon any one segment of the market. They need the high end as well as the starter/traditional market. I whole heartedly agree. But audiences have their place. Because of TMCC, we have Legacy. Because of Legacy, we now have LionChief and LionChief Plus. And all the sound features have trickled down to starter sets. Calabrese also said the battery train sets (much criticized here) are a $6 million dollar source of revenue for Lionel.

Just as the consumer cannot afford to buy everything they want in once swipe of the card (and many have pointed this out with their criticisms of Lionel's delivery schedule), Lionel also cannot afford to make all the products everyone wishes for, and to do it all at once.

I don't blame Evine for carrying what they do.  I do blame them for their insanely high prices for trains on their website. But I think the lineup is what you would expect on a Home Shopping Network show.  People buying a set for around the tree. Or a Ready to play set for their child to play with.  Or a casual train lover looking to get started.  At least they didn't bring those awful mega tracks this time.

JD2035RR posted:

Lionel needs to bring back dealer display type set ups for times like this. They need to show the buyers what is ultimately possible, then point them the starter set to get them going.

 

This is a terrific idea and would also love to see it. I’m partial to those old displays (and have built them myself) and they really do provide a better sales platform than a set box on a shelf or even a train running on a lonely loop of track.

Not sure we’ll ever see a return to the robust dealer displays of old but it’s a good suggestion for Lionel to consider.

Train Nut posted:

Pennsylvania Flyer just crapped out on TV. Would only go in reverse and wouldn't respond to remote. Had to cut to another shot. 

TV studios are a mess of RF signals that can interfere with LionChief.  Everything from the printer to the IFB - not like your home.  Polar Express was notorious for freaking out because it's RF signal/frequency was right in Bluetooth land.  

We had similar problems when we shot on Good Day New York.  Will only bring transformer trains only next time. 

Regarding the display layout, itmust be a restriction by the studio/shopping network, like someone said above - only showing what people can actually purchase. In the past I have seen Lionel display a modern display layout on news programs like the image below. 

Nothing new,Howard did christmas spots on QVC right after he took over.

Doug

Here are a couple of videos , just to let you guys know. They're pretty much selling out of everything, so I would say it was worth it  for Lionel to do this. 

I was suprised to see Howard Hitchcock doing the promoting, thus the reason for my post. I would have expected Meegan, JDon, Ryan or Dave,  but not the CEO.

I agree with posts above that it would be nice to see some of the scale stuff as it would be a better crowd pleaser.

It would also show folks that trains can do more than just run in circles at 90mph like they used to. Of course, I understand why they didn't.

I believe that  J. Don Reese has retired. And as illustrated by Lionel's FB page, both Howard and Meegan were pictured. Which is made clear by the above videos. Dave and Ryan are both in high end product development, not that they couldn't promote starter sets, but it is not their first responsibility.

Just as J. Don had sort of a grandfatherly appeal, I think Meegan is a real bonus for Lionel. She has passion, enthusiasm, a big smile on her face and young boys of her own, so she has some idea what might be popular. A train set with mouse ears or orange FasTrack is not aimed at serious scale modelers...they're designed to attract attention from parents with kids: The future (?) customers of Lionel.

I don't see any posts above thinking showing scale stuff would be a crowd pleaser. In this particular instance, that would be a dumb idea. The scale enthusiasts already know about the hobby and where to buy their trains.

The idea here is to promote the hobby to those who are not already in it. And no parent is going to buy high end scale proportioned/detailed trains for their young kids to run on the floor.

And if you've ever done a train show with a layout aimed at kids as I have, it is the kids who ask "how fast will the trains go?!" It's the kids that want to run the trains fast... that part of being a kid. We all did it too.

By watching the program people will see that today's starter set trains (remote control, sounds) can do more than just run in circles. And now, as in years gone by, if folks get tired of the oval, the idea is to go back to the store and buy more track... maybe an operating car. It was like that in 1950's... it's still like that today. That's why they're called starter sets.

Alex M posted:

Here are a couple of videos , just to let you guys know. They're pretty much selling out of everything, so I would say it was worth it  for Lionel to do this. 

Thanks for posting Alex. These segments were much better than the few minutes I caught yesterday. Mr. Hitchcock and Miss Megan hit on most of those things I was wanting to hear. And what a great deal in that Pennsy set. 

JD

OGR Webmaster posted:

Texas Pete posted:

To me this smacks of desperation.

To me, this smacks of terrific marketing! I wish we could afford to do it!

There is a whole world of model train sales beyond what you know as "the hobby." Lionel has sold their products via this method for many, many years. They sell a LOT of entry level train sets via Evine, QVC, etc.

An act of desperation? Not a chance. It's very smart marketing.

I have to say, I agree with you fully, Rich.

My wife drew my attention to the show, and we watched the Lionel segment together. We agreed that Mr. Hitchcock acquitted himself well, being professional, enthusiastic, cheerful, and informative.

The trains themselves came across as strong, of good quality, an excellent value, and enjoyable. Having them travel their little oval afforded the viewers a positive impression, and the fact that several were battery-operated seemed to promise a positive experience in getting such a presentation ready for Christmas morning for the parents thinking of doing so. Offering an extra figure-8 set of tracks seemed a smart move, too, wetting customers' appetites, right away, for expansion of the original purchase.

The whole presentation was attractive. I could readily see how folks who were already in our hobby would be attracted to the purchase of these sets, perhaps as gifts for lucky children, and I could see newbies having their first exposure to model trains as being an enticing one, via these Lionel offerings. The variety of the trains, some of American design, and some of European design, was a positive factor, too.

To my wife and me, the whole effect felt positive, and we were glad to see it having been done.

That's my 4cents worth.

FrankM

Trying to sell the scale sized (read EXPENSIVE) product to this audience would be a huge mistake. These promotions are targeted to folks who are only casually interested in the hobby. Lionel is shooting for an impulse buy to a new customer who likely knows nothing about the hobby...yet.

They are banking on selling a lot of inexpensive entry level train sets to a new audience, then converting a small percentage of these new customers into full-blown hobbyists who will buy another Lionel product.

I too watched just to see what the commotion was about.  The segments felt a little rushed but over all Meegan and Howard did a great job at conveying the excitement and value of Lionel train sets.  Only saw one derailment but the trains all operated, Howard and Meegan were very good at getting as much information out there as the time allowed.  I can't say where there was a downside to this.  I was especially excited to see Meegan use the Bluetooth App on air. I think it conveys a bit that the technology in Model RR is there.

Good Job Meegan, Howard, and Lionel.  Perhaps one of those folks purchasing will be on the forum someday. 

A gamble is a gamble, trying everything once can result in only two outcomes, success or failure. Who knows, maybe they did okay(or are doing) okay out in that market area and knew that they could pitch their stuff there.

MartyE posted:

I too watched just to see what the commotion was about.  The segments felt a little rushed but over all Meegan and Howard did agreat job at conveying the excitement and value of Lionel train sets.  Only saw one derailment but the trains all operated, Howard and Meegan were very good at getting as much information out there as the time allowed.  I can't say where there was a downside to this.  I was especially excited to see Meegan use the Bluetooth App on air. I think it conveys a bit that the technology in Model RR is there.

Good Job Meegan, Howard, and Lionel. Perhaps one of those folks purchasing will be on the forum someday. 

Hi Marty, I certainly age with the several positive and optimistic points you have made in their favor, especially that last one about the future.

Also, I was glad to see they had not displayed the high-end scale trains available, which, it seemed to me, not to be the purpose and outreach of this particular offering. Thousand-dollar engines might have scared some prospective customers and hobbyists away from us permanently. All commercial advertisers select their outreaches to various segments of their hoped-for customers very carefully, and with much thought.

Surely, if Lionel had not offered this presence on that show, somebody would have complained about that

FrankM

my son (11) and I watched the Lionel Evine segment also. was really excited about them showing their introductory sets - remember, they are trying to attract the casual viewer (as someone else noted above) and introduce them to this awesome hobby of ours. they did a really good job, in fact they had a presentation last year about this same time and were offering the PE - and it included the book and the bell, wanted to purchase it but it was already sold out - and it was priced similar to the other discount outlets (Trainworld, etc.).

what struck me about the segment with the Lionel (CEO?) was that the Evine host, Skip, was absolutely mesmerized watching the Polar Express and Pennsylvania freight sets going around the layout. reminded me of myself when I was younger, and how I got involved with the hobby.

great marketing for Lionel - remember, they are a business - when they are successful, it is good for us as well. gets more people involved.

they have a lot of lionel stuff on their web site;

http://www.evine.com/search/?q...Search_lionel+trains

Thing is that this is nothing new to Lionel if you really think about it. I was reminded about this in a different way because I had to get an engine repaired and another one upgraded, and it is technically crunch time. The manufacturers are looking for their great big push(or the start of it) to propel them to the holiday sales as much as we ourselves are working on our last minutes trial runs, detailing, planning, whatever else so that everything is smooth for the holidays.

I can remember in my great youth how we would go to my grandparent's Christmas night. Not only was there a Lionel Train under the tree(one of my Uncle's great postwar sets), but we were also in store for what he had upstairs which would involve the great S2 turbine 671 running all over the place to be followed by the Santa Few F3's.

The holiday season for nearly every train person has had a train running under the tree a few times here or there I'm sure, so Lionel is just doing the usual by getting more people(hopefully) launched into this great hobby of ours. Old Chinese proverb, "a thousand mile journey begins with one step".

I remember J. Don from Lionel and someone from Bachman being on QVC several times. Always thought it was a great way to reach new markets and increase brand awareness. Nothing desperate about it. Just adapting and using new tools and media to reach potential customers.

BRIAN WHITE posted:

I remember J. Don from Lionel and someone from Bachman being on QVC several times. Always thought it was a great way to reach new markets and increase brand awareness. Nothing desperate about it. Just adapting and using new tools and media to reach potential customers.

Richard Maddox from Bachman who later became president of Lionel.  He was on QVC with both companies.

BRIAN WHITE posted:

I remember J. Don from Lionel and someone from Bachman being on QVC several times. Always thought it was a great way to reach new markets and increase brand awareness. Nothing desperate about it. Just adapting and using new tools and media to reach potential customers.

Bravo!