I think the real "BETA TEST" will be when they ship in volume, same with Lionel's BASE3. Having a handful of folks tinkering with the system is not the same as having a thousand or so using it.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I think the real "BETA TEST" will be when they ship in volume, same with Lionel's BASE3. Having a handful of folks tinkering with the system is not the same as having a thousand or so using it.
I am in total agreement with you John. Nothing like a few thousand motivated testers. I just hope MTH will respond properly to the feedback to provide fixes and improvements.
@PRKTRAINS posted:Isn't time for the current iteration of MTH to publish on their website or this Forum some type of honest statement about why this is taking so much longer than originally advertised? Certainly COVID caused an initial disruption in the supply of the necessary parts, and also overseas production, but other industries that rely on chips and semiconductors have recovered as the pandemic has waned. Why is it taking MTH so long? Are there design flaws that are still being corrected? A little forthrightness would be reassuring to those of us who have been loyal MTH customers for decades, not to mention the 37 dealers listed on the MTH website (as of this morning) who have the product on order.
PRK
It's probably because they are at the very bottom compared to other corporations that have billions of dollars and have millions to spend for priority for semiconductors while Lionel and MTH don't have that privilege. I could be wrong though but that's how I see it. It took Sony 2 whole years to finally get enough Playstation 5's in stores without selling out quickly online due to scalper bots and they are a multi-billion dollar corporation.
The update was explained well. Things produced today all experience the same global wide obstacles.
Until the new unit is hooked up and latest download is obtained, there's nothing more to say.
I was hoping that @gunrunnerjohn was one of the beta testers.
When I was wearing a working hat, I was developing flight critical avionics, fuel management and cockpit instrumentation.
The development process was rigorous to say the least. Then there was a separate verification organization that validated all our work. Next there was the qualification process where the product was tested, zapped, frozen, cooked, and vibrated, sometimes several of those at once. Finally, we submitted all the results to the FAA for review and approval before the product could be put into service. Guess what? There were still glitches that slipped through at times!
Bottom line? I'm pretty sure there will be some warts on this one when it's released!
@gunrunnerjohn posted:When I was wearing a working hat, I was developing flight critical avionics, fuel management and cockpit instrumentation.
The development process was rigorous to say the least. Then there was a separate verification organization that validated all our work. Next there was the qualification process where the product was tested, zapped, frozen, cooked, and vibrated, sometimes several of those at once. Finally, we submitted all the results to the FAA for review and approval before the product could be put into service. Guess what? There were still glitches that slipped through at times!
Bottom line? I'm pretty sure there will be some warts on this one when it's released!
Yup, did the same.
I took part in the design of Boeing 757/67 fuel quantity and cabin temp indicators at Smiths Industries, Clearwater, Fl. The first grey and white LCD indicators back then.
Prior to that gig, BENDIX Avionics, Ft. Lauderdale, BX-2000 com/nav system and radars. RF screen room was up on the roof.
@SIRT posted:Yup, did the same.
I took part in the design of Boeing 757/67 fuel quantity and cabin temp indicators at Smiths Industries, Clearwater, Fl. The first grey and white LCD indicators back then.
Prior to that gig, BENDIX Avionics, Ft. Lauderdale, BX-2000 com/nav system and radars. RF screen room was up on the roof.
Small world, I was also deeply involved in fuel gauging, it was my primary focus later in my avionics career. I did a several bizjet fuel systems, Learjet and Hawker, the JPATS military trainer, Dornier 328 commuter, and the X47 UCAV. Most of my work was out of the Smiths Industries location in Great Valley, PA. I spent time late in the X47 project at Clearwater just before the GE acquisition.
@Chris3671 posted:It's probably because they are at the very bottom compared to other corporations that have billions of dollars and have millions to spend for priority for semiconductors while Lionel and MTH don't have that privilege. I could be wrong though but that's how I see it. It took Sony 2 whole years to finally get enough Playstation 5's in stores without selling out quickly online due to scalper bots and they are a multi-billion dollar corporation.
Excellent observation and related comments. Those of us who work with semiconductors are still living with this every day. The chip crisis is not over yet by any means.
PRK has just assumed that it's already run its course.
Mike
@gunrunnerjohn posted:Small world, I was also deeply involved in fuel gauging, it was my primary focus later in my avionics career. I did a several bizjet fuel systems, Learjet and Hawker, the JPATS military trainer, Dornier 328 commuter, and the X47 UCAV. Most of my work was out of the Smiths Industries location in Great Valley, PA. I spent time late in the X47 project at Clearwater just before the GE acquisition.
Yes, small world then.
Also did all the wire wrapping at Smiths for the Harrier AV8B Marine jump jets heads up displays. 80-81. Then went to SI-TEX KODEN marine next door for 10 years. Ross Engineering, then GTE Mobilnet / Verizon cellular.
We had a few parts shortages along (Japan control then) the way but nothing like today. The world has really changed.
One of my more interesting projects, the fuel system on the X47. I wish I'd gotten to see it fly off the carrier...
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@gunrunnerjohn posted:One of my more interesting projects, the fuel system on the X47.
The X-47/A/B was built by my company. Guess a lot of us in the forum have connections in our past vocations or military service that go well beyond trains. Sorry for taking this thread far off subject.
@Bruce Brown posted:The X-47/A/B was built by my company. Guess a lot of us in the forum have connections in our past vocations or military service that go well beyond trains. Sorry for taking this thread far off subject.
Yep, I guess we're a little astray. I spend a lot of days sitting in conference rooms at Northrop Grumman to have my five minutes of input. 
You have to know nothing will be accomplished when there are 40+ people in attendance!
Figuring there's only a couple people working on the WTIU, it should have been done long ago! 
Did MTH say anything at York about the new WTIU?
@MACADO 1 posted:Did MTH say anything at York about the new WTIU?
Yes I ask Rich Foster specifically about this and whether it could mate to a TIU. They will be coming out in Sept or Oct and they will be doing a video on how to use it and what it will and will not do. Another VERY interesting thing is they are going to develop a remote that will work with the TIU and the WTIU Without being tethered, But that is still in development. They need to get chips and such and finish making Transformers, Diesel and Steam Kits, WTIU's etc First!
@CurtisH posted:Yes I ask Rich Foster specifically about this and whether it could mate to a TIU. They will be coming out in Sept or Oct and they will be doing a video on how to use it and what it will and will not do. Another VERY interesting thing is they are going to develop a remote that will work with the TIU and the WTIU Without being tethered, But that is still in development. They need to get chips and such and finish making Transformers, Diesel and Steam Kits, WTIU's etc First!
Have they said if you could Super mode the WiFi TIU's?
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I think the real "BETA TEST" will be when they ship in volume, same with Lionel's BASE3. Having a handful of folks tinkering with the system is not the same as having a thousand or so using it.
That is a big issue, they need more and varied Beta testors. Many of their previous updates seemed 2 steps forward yet 2 steps back with some unintended issues. It was as if the testors had been told what was updated and they concentrated on that but didn't verify that previously working parts were still functioning correctly. And the loss of the near impossible "Crossing" horn sequence using the MTH remote with lashed up power while keeping the easily done Forward 2 and Reverse 3 "toots" needs to be remedied.
@CurtisH posted:Another VERY interesting thing is they are going to develop a remote that will work with the TIU and the WTIU Without being tethered, But that is still in development. T
My guess is that it will be based on top of the Android app embodied inside of a custom remote-style hardware case.
@CurtisH posted:Yes I ask Rich Foster specifically about this and whether it could mate to a TIU. They will be coming out in Sept or Oct and they will be doing a video on how to use it and what it will and will not do.
I'm also curious about how they'll support multiple TIU's. Bluetooth is mainly a 1:1 connection. The multi-connection capability of bluetooth is fuzzy at best in all that I read, and it sounds like there are lots of caveats on using multi-connection.
@CurtisH posted:Another VERY interesting thing is they are going to develop a remote that will work with the TIU and the WTIU Without being tethered, But that is still in development. They need to get chips and such and finish making Transformers, Diesel and Steam Kits, WTIU's etc First!
I'll believe the remote when I see it. 
We already had a remote that did that, but they choose not to support it!
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I'm also curious about how they'll support multiple TIU's. Bluetooth is mainly a 1:1 connection. The multi-connection capability of bluetooth is fuzzy at best in all that I read, and it sounds like there are lots of caveats on using multi-connection.
This will be easy and done the exact same way it is done now with the WIU/TIU combo. Each WIU will have its own IP Address, just like how TIUs can be assigned and addressed 1 - 5. Technically the 5 (W)TIU limit can now easily be expanded to hundreds because you aren't held back by that old addressing system but rather by the number of IP address available on your network.
Bluetooth runs more like a Master/Slave style system, WiFi doesn't have these limitations.
@H1000 posted:This will be easy and done the exact same way it is done now with the WIU/TIU combo. Each WIU will have its own IP Address, just like how TIUs can be assigned and addressed 1 - 5. Technically the 5 (W)TIU limit can now easily be expanded to hundreds because you aren't held back by that old addressing system but rather by the number of IP address available on your network.
Bluetooth runs more like a Master/Slave style system, WiFi doesn't have these limitations.
I forgot this is running WiFi and not BT.
@CurtisH posted:Yes I ask Rich Foster specifically about this and whether it could mate to a TIU. They will be coming out in Sept or Oct
Did Rich say if/when they are going to have just the WIUs? I have one pre-ordered and it said February.
Mike
Speaking of WIU- there is one up on the auction site with a BAD power jack clearly seen in the picture. I'm worried some uninformed person didn't pay attention and bid- not knowing of this major defect.
It might be fixable, it might be junk. Current bid ($153+) is more than you should gamble IMO.
UPDATE: It sold for $262 for a non working broken unit.
Here is what that failure often looks like inside. https://ogrforum.com/...t-wiu-power-jack-fix
Waiting for the fireworks....
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WOW, $262? I think I'll dig out my spare and put it on eBay! 
@IRON HORSE posted:Did Rich say if/when they are going to have just the WIUs? I have one pre-ordered and it said February.
Mike
Sept or October. Possibly may be some in July.
any word on these?
@ChrisFromCle posted:any word on these?
No announcements yet that I've heard. With all of the other short-supply DCS stuff that has been shipping lately, I think it is just around the corner.
@Vernon Barry posted:Speaking of WIU- there is one up on the auction site with a BAD power jack clearly seen in the picture. I'm worried some uninformed person didn't pay attention and bid- not knowing of this major defect.
It might be fixable, it might be junk. Current bid ($153+) is more than you should gamble IMO.
UPDATE: It sold for $262 for a non working broken unit.
And now you can buy them brand new for $180!!
@H1000 posted:No announcements yet that I've heard. With all of the other short-supply DCS stuff that has been shipping lately, I think it is just around the corner.
And now you can buy them brand new for $180!!
Yep, I pre-ordered mine from Trainworld with a credit card and it was shipped immediately at the end of July when they received it. Brand new for $190 with shipping. S-w-e-e-t.....
Will anyone ask the MTH crew when the new WTIU's will be shipped?
I wanted to say at York...
@H1000 posted:The guys who may be at York are not the R&D folks, they would have limited knowledge.
Good point, but presently everyone seems to have limited knowledge on this subject, so there's no harm in asking at York.
Will we get a firm answer either way?
Not likely -- this will continue to need extreme patience.
Mike
No new info on the WTIU from York. 
