2065 trouble!

Maybe not enough downward pressure from the pick up arm assembly?

As Chuck said , make sure the rollers have good downward pressure on the rail. Clean the rollers with scotchbrite or similar .....no steel wool. You can put a tiny dot of oil on the roller axle points. Also check the pivot pin for the roller arm. Make sure it’s clean, and not rusty. A small drop of oil on them will help them out too.....Some heat will happen at the roller, especially on some of those spur gear motors........Pat

Make sure the rollers are contacting the center rail with enough pressure. Also check the wire to the center rail pickups. Might be old/corroded. A new wire couldn't hurt.

Thank you for the suggestions. So can the springs on the roller assembly be adjusted for more downward pressure, or do I need new springs?  The funny thing is, I bought a 685 locomotive at the Nashville show about 2 weeks ago. It looks to have the same mechanism as the 2065, but I can run it for an hour or more, and the rollers are cool to the touch after all that time.  I will welcome any more suggestions that anyone has. Steve

When you wet sanded the commutator did you clean out the grooves between the three plates. Another thing to check when you have the brush plate off is to check the resistance between the three (plates)  poles. All readings should be the same. Then check the resistance from the plates to the armature shaft. It should read 0. If you get a reading here the armature is starting to short out and will need replaced. Same thing is if the readings vary between the three poles the armature should be replaced.  I think any of these conditions will cause the motor to run hot and put a heavy load on the rollers.

I had an American Flyer engine that had mis-matched readings on the commutator. It would run for about 5 minutes then get hot and slow down. I rushed the job and didn't check the armature. Took three times longer to repair because of this simple oversight.

Forest.

About all I can think of now is in your opening post you stated you replaced the rollers. Try the original ones again and see if they get hot.  Just moisten the roller pin with very little oil. Maybe the reproduction rollers are the problem.

I did clean out the slots between the armature plates. I will check the resistance on the armature plates, too.  I have really enjoyed helping this thing to run again, and it runs great. I may be just a little obsessive about it running perfectly, I may be asking too much. I let Sherman Leonard rebuild a 2025 locomotive a few years ago, and it silently now and very cool. That is what I would like for this 2065 to be, but that may not happen. 

Thanks for all your help!

Steve

Replace the rollers, suspect low quality rollers do not transmit electric to locomotive, too much resistance and sparking occurs

Hey Doug, thanks for your message. I am getting no sparking whatsoever, I just checked it with the lights off. The funny thing is when I run the locomotive suspended on blocks with alligator clips, the rollers don't get as hot. So it may be a spring or pressure issue. I don't know who made the rollers, but they are new and look very similar to the rest of the rollers that I have.  Steve

Make sure the wheels, rollers and track are clean and free of grease and dirt. They will cause the rollers to get hot because of increased resistance in the electrical path. Clean all with a rag dipped in Naphtha.

To the reply by Forest, I think you meant to say that the resistance reading from the commutator segments to the armature shaft should be infinite, not zero.

Larry

However, the wt of the engine causes the motor to have resistance thus more power is needed there for more draw electric  on the rollers that is where the resistance shows its self , on blocks is not a good test for heating up of the motor or the rollers.  run a Amp test on the locomotive using a amp meter should not exceed 3.5 amps.  Check the brushes, some low quality brushes do not work well due to high resistance.

Hey Doug, How do I run an amp test on this locomotive? I would like to try this next. 

Thanks Steve

TrainLarry posted:

Make sure the wheels, rollers and track are clean and free of grease and dirt. They will cause the rollers to get hot because of increased resistance in the electrical path. Clean all with a rag dipped in Naphtha.

To the reply by Forest, I think you meant to say that the resistance reading from the commutator segments to the armature shaft should be infinite, not zero.

 

Larry

Yes, my bad. Infinite is what I meant to say. Zero would be a direct short. Sorry.

Forest

Amp meter goes inline (series) on one of the track's power legs.

My 2065 can have 6.5a peaks at start up, and runs at about 3.5a under a good load. It likes at least a 1033 driving it, tripping smaller 50w - 60w units easily and tripping CW-80s etc with fast starts; but easy on the throttle and it'll run on those too.

Actually, look at the rear roller too; but wire and it's overall connection real well.

A bad rear roller connection would/could force more current across the front roller as it seeks the easiest path 1st; it's not always where the heat is as much as why.

How many track connections? How big a loop?

Wow @Adriatic, 6 amps for the loco by itself is pretty extreme!  Two amps for just the motor is what I would expect running unloaded.  Add a little for the headlight and smoke unit. 

@Steve1964 To measure the current draw you'll need an AC ammeter in series with either the hot or ground side of the circuit.  The amps may vary considerably as the loco goes around, especially if the track is laid on the floor, and the floor isn't level.  Try to test the loco by itself or with non-operating freight cars, as lighted passenger cars, etc., will only increase the current draw.

It's fun to work on these old trains, but the new rollers and brushes you installed may have a higher resistance than the originals.  There have been other posts on the forum about recent-production brushes with a MUCH higher resistance, almost to the point of being incompatible.  I would borrow some little-worn brushes from another postwar steam loco, and try again with the original rollers.  My $.02.