3RD Rail just announced the ATSF Prairie

How awesome thanks for the info!

Go scott go!

Those PRB models were manufactured in new Zealand by The Model Company. He's had some wonderful kits mostly in 1:45 but very close.

Nifty loco.  Boy, does that tell my age!

 

When you click on the picture of the loco, you get the reservation page and not an enlarged picture of the loco.

 

Ed

 

Interesting model and prototype. What kind of duty did the Prarie handle?

And also, a CB&Q O1a Mikado!

 

Rusty

Can anyone tell the engine # from the announcement photo?

 

The 1010 shown above was one of the Death Valley Scotty locos.  The prairies started out as passenger engines but ended up being used for just about everything.  I can remember seeing them in branch line service out of Topeka in the 1950's.  The 1035 was one of the engines lost to the Kansas River when the bridge failed in the 1951 flood.  In 1953 there were still 83 prairies on the roster.

 

 

Allan

 

Just ordered the AT&SF 2-6-2 Prairie from 3rd Rail. Really hope Scott gets enough orders to actually get this one made!

Scott and I were discussing future projects while we were at the York TCA meet last week and decided on the Santa Claus Prairie and the CB&Q mikado.

 

I usually receive more requests at the Chicago March Meet for Sunset to do the Burlington mikado than any other locomotive. Not surprising considering the show location.

 

A lot of larger SF steam power has been done so maybe it is time for the 2-6-2.

 

No decision on class variation or details for either of these locos has been finalized.

For instance, check out the photos posted by Yves and note the trailing truck difference - inside vs outside journal.

If you are a potential buyer, e-mail Scott with your suggestions and desires.

I wish Scott would look at the PRR J28 Prairie

 

as well as the PRR F3!

 

PRR 2-8-8-4 "Big Liz" would also be nice too!

 

No decision on class variation or details for either of these locos has been finalized.

For instance, check out the photos posted by Yves and note the trailing truck difference - inside vs outside journal.

If you are a potential buyer, e-mail Scott with your suggestions and desires.

I.m glad you cleared that up.  The picture on the site seems to be a 1000 Class.

 

I think Santa Fe had 7 Classes of Prairies from 3 builders, Alco, Baldwin, and Santa Fe build 4 of their own.

 

Above, Yves pictured 2 Classes, the 1800 produced by PRB, and engine 1010 from the 1000 Class.  Engine 1010 was famous for being the "Death Valley Scotty" engine, and it also was used on TV in "Death Valley Days".  1010 is probably the most notable historically.

 

The most numerous class was the 1050 Class consisting of 153 engines.

 

Many of those engines were built as Vauclain 4 cylinder compounds and later simpled.

 

I have the PRB Prairie, but would would appreciate the qualities of Sunset/3rd Rail engine.  Regarding the PRB engine, Gary Schrader wrote a great article published in OST and available to read on their website, titled  "From a Sow's Ear to a Silk Purse."  His rework is a great lesson. On detailing the 1800 Class.

  

 

Matt posted:

What kind of duty did the Prairie handle?

In the early 1900's everything, from the 1920's on local freights.  Also note Allen E's comments above.

The SantaFe 2-6-2 is a nice choice, but I am VERY enthusiastic about the Burlington O1a 2-8-2. Marvelous utilitarian locomotive that handled every type of service, and were  the last steam locomotives in regular service on the CB&Q (Jan 1959). these locomotives took many forms, with Worthington and Elesco FWH's, oil burning and coal, conventional and L&B extended smokeboxes (allowing lignite and bituminous useage) and conventional coal side sheets on the tender vs. 45 degree canted in, for switching visibility.

       Just a quick bit of history: it was a group of wrecks on both the Beardstown Division and the Colorado & Southern that brought back a herd of O1a's in the Fall of 1958. The C&S wrecks (2) prompted a frantic call from C&S HQ in Denver to the Q's Chicago HQ for help, as a number of diesels were destroyed in the wrecks. The Burlington dispatched 5 O1a's to Denver, where they worked for about 6 months in switching, local freight, and sugar beet service. The Beardstown Div wrecks brought 5 O1a's back for coal mine run service, 2 of which were diverted to Denver and were replaced. A total of 11 O1a's were in service that Fall, including one leased to the MO-based, coal hauling Bevier & Southern. Good old fantrip favorite 4960 was withdrawn from service at Herrin Jct., IL, in late Dec 1958, to pull it's first (12-28-58) of many, (including the Circus Train from Baraboo, WI-Milwaukee) fan trips. Burlington locomotives were nicely maintained, with oxide red cab roofs, graphite smokeboxes and fireboxes, a colorful Burlington Route herald on the tender, gold lettering, and generally a nice glossy freshly painted appearance.

         I HAVE JUST RESERVED TWO! I would encourage all interested parties to get a reservation(s) in! And pairing up these locomotives with a predominately UP, GN, NP, D&RGW, ATSF roster  makes sense, as the Burlington went to many "gateway" cities, such as Chicago, Mpls/StP, Denver, Billings, Omaha, Ks City, Cheyenne WY, etc. and mixed regularly with other roads' power.

       Here is a picture of #5090, with an L&B front end: http://www.railarchive.net/randomsteam/cbq5090.htm    

Plus passenger helper service. From photos I have seen it looks like Cajon and/or Raton Passes.

Mark - Nice story, great info. 

 

Since I'm attempting something of a Colorado theme, I was probably more interested in the Burlington Mike than the Santa Fe Prairie.  Both engines would fit. I would have enthusiastically jumped on a true Santa Fe Mikado, or a C&S 2-10-2, but both engines offered are still very attractive.  As you say, a nice pairing.

 

Marker/Howard - CB&Q mikes ran regularly into Denver, on the "Q", not just in C&S service. it should be noted that the C&S facilities adjacent to the Denver Union Station were a joint operation with the ATSF, so it was common to see ATSF steam locomotives in the C&S Denver roundhouse. Additionally Rock Island 4-8-4's were seen in the DRGW's Burnham roundhouse and servicing facilities, demonstrating how multiple roads' power mixed it up in gateway cities. For a CO based layout, you just can't beat the O1a's!  You might want to explore the Burlington's 2-10-4's, too, as they were rebuilt for fast freight (meaning 55 mph) service in the mid to late '30's to Denver, as a product of the completion of the Moffat Tunnel, which allowed much more competitive west coast connecting schedules. In fact, the "Q" began calling their 2-10-4's "Colorados", following the rebuilds!  

Big Liz WAS an electric, an FF-1, 2-8-8-2.  The Pennsy did not have a 2-8-8-4. The #3700 pictured is the 2-8-8-0.

Ed

Personally, I would prefer the larger, "heavy" 2-8-2 type in the O-2 and/or O-3 classes, especially with the "later steam era" modifications/up-grades of twin cross compound air compressors and the Elesco Feedwater heaters, to name just two. Nothing says Burlington like the Elesco equipped O-2 and O-3 big mikes. 

HW,

I agree with you, but I am not a Burlington modeler so we'll see what the concensus of  CB&Q fans is.

 

Am I correct is assuming from your comments that the O-1 and the later classes really do not share much in common unlike the Colorados which shared many dimensions and were differentiated mainly by easily changed features such as the Elesco vs BL feedwater heaters?

The O2's and O3's were generally viewed as the homelier of the Burlington's Mikados (although I do not find any Burlington locomotives to be homely, that is probably the general view). They were of an earlier design dating back to 1912-1913, and have a boiler which looks much heavier then the O1a's. They were precursors of Burlington's 2-10-2's and look similar, minus one driver set.

Bob,

 

Actually the O-1A locomotives did have varying features, such as tenders (oil vs. coal), crosshead guides, with or without feedwater heaters, cabs, etc., pretty much like the CB&Q 2-10-4 Colorado class. However, you are correct in that the M-4A locomotives did look pretty much the same except for the 2 different types of feedwater systems, and 2 different cabs.

 

Even the bigger O-2/O-2A and O-3 locomotives tended to only vary slightly between feedwater systems, cabs, and crosshead guide types. Then there were the "USRA Heavy Design" O-4 mikes, of which Baldwin only delivered 15 to the CB&Q, in 1919 (#5500 thru #5514)

 

The definitive book on CB&Q steam power is the "Steam Locomotives of the Burlington Route" by Bernard G. Corbin and William F Kerka, published by Bonanza Books (I have the 1978 printing).

The Burlington 2-10-4's were the same locomotive underneath the feedwater heaters, excepting an angled cab on the 1929 delivery vs a square cab on the 1927 versions.  All dimensions were the same. B&LE borrowed the Burlington blue prints and built 44 (if memory serves) comparable locomotives through 1944. The B&LE versions were some 10,000 pounds heavier. 

Additional thought on O1a vs O2/O3:   the latter engines were predominately "Lines West" locomotives, whereas the O1a's went over the entire system. A couple of O3's switched the Lincoln NE yard through 1957. O1a's also switched Lincoln through 1957. My preference strongly goes to the O1a. And I have put two reservations in.

Were any Elescoed, coal-fired O1A's lettered for and operated on the C&S?  Photo?

That would make one interesting.

The C&S did not have any O1a's. They did have O1's, an earlier Burlington design dating back to 1910-1911, and with lower drivers on the C&S only, of 57".

The C&S received a group of 6 Burlington heavy USRA 2-8-2's in 1957, to supplement their motive power needs. Those locomotives were the last steam locomotives sold for regular service in the United States.  The USRA locomotives were renumbered into the C&S numbering scheme (#'s 804-809).  

The leased O1a's on the Colorado & Southern ran from Denver to Fort Collins and most of the intermediate branch lines, 1958-1959. Some of them were Elesco-equipped, including #4978, now on display in Mendota, IL.

I have the 3rd Rail CB&Q O5 4-8-4 and it is BEAUTIFUL.

 

Just to clarify.  The 1000 class Prairies had inside bearing trailing wheels.  The 1800 class Prairies were larger and had an outside frame trailing truck.  I think the 1800s were built several years later than the 1000s.   Recently, I came across some photos I took in the Argentine yard in early 1953.  Both classes were in the dead line.

 

Wes

You might want to explore the Burlington's 2-10-4's, too, as they were rebuilt for fast freight (meaning 55 mph) service in the mid to late '30's to Denver, as a product of the completion of the Moffat Tunnel, which allowed much more competitive west coast connecting schedules. In fact, the "Q" began calling their 2-10-4's "Colorados", following the rebuilds!

Thanks Mark.  To get this straight, they ran into Denver from the east.  They would not have been seen on the "Joint Line".  I really love the CB&Q 2-10-4 with the Elesco feedwater heater, but put off buying it because of reading that they were used in the plains. 

 

That's why I would really like a C&S 2-10-2 which on occasion double headed with Santa Fe steam on the "Joint LIne".  One of the best scenes in "Otto Perry's Santa Fe", is a C&S 2-10-2 double heading with a Santa Fe 2-10-2 heading south out of Denver.

 

Howard - Yes, neither the Burlington 2-10-4's or the O1a Mikados worked on the Joint Line. At least one O5 4-8-4 strayed south on the Joint Line, but it was hauling a football special down to Texas so it was not anything approaching a regular occurence. Oddity of oddities, Burlington's streamlined Aeolus 4-6-4 #4001 made some trips north out of Denver on the C&S, pulling the "Buffalo Bill", during the '38 or '39 Yellowstone Park season. But do recall, the Joint Line begins in Denver, so the 2-10-4's and the O1a's were were quite close by at the Burlington's engine facility in Denver.

        Closest you can come to an O Scale C&S 2-10-2 would be the USRA light 2-10-2 done 35+ years ago by the earlier Sunset. Alas, the C&S engines were "heavies" and equipped with either Elesco or Worthington FWH's. The Sunset engine came w/o a FWH.  I absolutely love the C&S's other 2-10-2's, such as #900, 902, and 903, particularly in their last years toting around auxiliary water cars (ex Pacific tenders). They ran in that configuration north of Cheyenne, handling helper assignments on diesel powered freights out of Chugwater and iron ore and rock trains from on-line mines. Alas, I consider it wildly fortunate that we may be getting an O1a.......I just don't see a commercial builder/importer doing the other 2-10-2's. Or perhaps even the USRA heavy 2-10-2's as very few railroad were assigned them. Those engines were originally assigned to the Burlington, who tried them in Beardstown coal train service, found them to be a bit too slippery, so shucked them off on poor old subsidiary Colorado & Southern.