A request for the manufacturers

Your problem is the cost of tooling and manufacturing, the manufactures demands for high volume of units, and the street price of what the hobbyist will spend for such units. Would YOU pay for a $600.00 for a light rail car?  How many others will pay for such a car and can 300-500 of these items be sold to justify the tolling and expenses to make one. How long does the manufacturer have to wait til he can do a second run and reel in the profits.

The Western Hobbycraft Trolley- one of the best o scale detailed trolleys around for the money- took a decade to disburse of the stock including several sales. That was just one run!

The Peter Witt can still be found at discount from some top ten dealers.

"how many Big Boys and massive articulated locos can you really sell?"

Apparently enough. If they weren't making money, well, you know. I have no earthly idea of their current costs and profit-per-unit of anything, but so much of the new stuff's "newness" is electronics (low cost items) and paint jobs, they might be pocketing a pretty penny on all the re-issues (that is, no, or little, new physical tooling). Let's hope so, because this is one marginal product; it's a leisure item that might be gone with the economic wind one day. Maybe they'll make enough now to enable them to take some risks on some actual new tooling in the future.  

It is a very simple formula.  On the manufacturing cost side factor in research, design, tooling, manufacturing, decoration, taxes, costs of labor, and distribution costs.  

Divide that total by the number of units sold and include a profit margin of 10-15% and you have your unit price.  

In O scale the number of prospective buyers is shrinking.  In HO or N is is holding steady or growing depending on what you hear.  Simple answer is that it is not impossible to develop new product in O, but it is getting more and more challenging to develop new product at a price most people are willing to pay in this scale. 

I believe Rivarossi made a decent LRV back in the 80's in HO.  Based on a US prototype but I don't recall from where.

Specifically for light rail trains, we have a disadvantage in that international manufacturers haven’t regularly contributed to our hobby in O gauge for exact-scale trains.

By comparison, light rail transit models have been made by competing companies, Tomix and Kato, in N scale, using designs of Asian prototypes that are also appropriate for the American market. Given that the N scale market is huge in Japan, the tooling costs were easily absorbed, allowing models to be imported into the U.S. affordably and without much risk to the manufacturers.

I have seen HO modelers also lamenting the lack of HO LRT models available domestically. That has surprised me a bit, though I realize that N scale has a firmer hold in Japan.

But there is no Kato or Tomix equivalent in American O gauge. The closest we have is Bachmann and it’s Williams by Bachmann line, both associated with Kader, a Chinese company. Unfortunately, Kader is a toy company, one that leaves its model train division in the hands of Bachmann, which is expected to stand on its own as a profit center and which has never been a major player in Asia as a brand or domestic manufacturer.

Still, if I were to focus my lobbying efforts, I would turn to Bachmann, which could tool up designs for identical models in O, HO and N with an eye toward international sales. (Bachmann also owns Graham Farish, a former Great Britain N scale manufacturer, and Bachmann Branchline, which makes OO European models.) Of course, I have no idea what the market demand is in Europe for LRT equipment in those scales.

In O, I think MTH has a "contract" for Siemenns prototypes.  So no S70's from Lionel.  For now.

GG1 4877 posted:

In O scale the number of prospective buyers is shrinking. 

… it is not impossible to develop new product in O, but it is getting more and more challenging to develop new product at a price most people are willing to pay in this scale.

Demographics (fewer buyers) and higher tooling costs will make newly-tooled O scale models more costly and less common in the future. As manufacturers reduce their offerings in the O scale market, that would seem to create increased demand and prices in the secondary O scale market. However, as battery power becomes more common and more affordable, older O scale (2-rail and 3-rail) locomotives would become less desirable. I do not consider my trains to be an investment - just a hobby.

MELGAR

Someone with the most advanced 3D printers will have to make these smaller commuter rail vehicles, in the USA.

Andrew

MELGAR posted:

GG1 4877 posted:

In O scale the number of prospective buyers is shrinking. 

… it is not impossible to develop new product in O, but it is getting more and more challenging to develop new product at a price most people are willing to pay in this scale.

Demographics (fewer buyers) and higher tooling costs will make newly-tooled O scale models more costly and less common in the future. As manufacturers reduce their offerings in the O scale market, that would seem to create increased demand and prices in the secondary O scale market. However, as battery power becomes more common and more affordable, older O scale (2-rail and 3-rail) locomotives would become less desirable. I do not consider my trains to be an investment - just a hobby.

MELGAR

Melgar, I don’t understand your second to last sentence. Why will battery power make older locomotives less desirable? Yes, I agree battery power will become more common and affordable but there will still be many layouts controlled by power through the rails. I also agree that trains are not an investment and almost all trains (with very, very few exceptions) will drop in value. I just don’t understand what battery power has to do with it. Older locomotives become less desirable now and battery power, although it is available, it really isn’t “here” until manufacturers start factory installing it in locomotives. Once that does happen I can see some people switching over to battery power but I find it hard to believe that guys with large collections will dump their collections to buy new battery powered locomotives. Most of the time enthusiasts will just add battery powered locomotives to their roster. 

Just my opinion. I guess we will see when it happens. 

In my opinion, when battery power becomes cost-competitive or lower cost than power through the rails, buyers will prefer it and will be less inclined to want the types of 2-rail and 3-rail equipment in use today because new layouts will be built without powered trackwork. Those with wired layouts will continue to run their 3-rail trains but will buy new battery powered locomotives and run them on their old (3-rail) layouts.

MELGAR

I would appreciate some standardization around electronics...not so much is control systems, but in adding sound boards to conventional trains.  The MRC Sounder was a great example.  Surely there is a similar low cost market for this type of add on.

This thread has strayed from the OP's intention....looks like it ran its course as far as the original topic...