Amtrak- What a shame

I recently rode the Cardinal in "reserved coach."  I expressed the same sentiment you have in my post-ride email survey.  If airlines (which I despise) allow a traveler to select seat(s) and even pay extra for better ones, why would it be so difficult for Amtrak to do the same?

I did see a paper slip on one pair of seats that said "reserved."  Eventually an elderly woman with a walker sat in them.  It's my understanding that if you CALL and speak with a ticket agent on the phone, they can somehow communicate to the Conductor that you need two seats together.

I also saw or read references that one individual can purchase two seats if desired if you need more space, or for whatever reason.  I don't like holding on the phone any more than you.  There's no "record" of such telephone conversations, and they can be fraught with error.  Unfortunately Amtrak continues to struggle for its very life.  They have a limited budget, and it appears that these types of arrangements might be best handled with last century's technology. 

Oh- one more suggestion I made.  I would LOVE it if every Amtrak locomotive were equipped with a "dash cam" that looks through the windshield from the engineer's point-of-view.  Passengers should be able to connect to the real-time video stream via Wi-fi, and view it on their personal mobile devices.  In some ways, THAT would be even better than a window seat!  I doubt it will happen.  But it would be an inexpensive way to improve the ride experience, at least for us train buffs!

In the 1920's, (hard to believe we have to specify century now) it was said that you could travel across country from coast to coast and only walk 2 blocks.  The inter-connectivity of trolleys, interurbans, and mainline trains made it all possible, and it was all free enterprise with no govt. intervention, except or right of way access,  that created it.  In the 1930's, GM and Firestone started buying up and dismantling all those trolleys and interurbans to sell buses and tires, and a court case brought up by Green Peace in the 80's actually proved that they did. The 2 companies were found guilty, but no sentences or fines were issued.  All the of the 'wish we had the trains like they do in Europe' sentiment is fine, but you have to remember that Germany is half the size of Texas, and Britain is the size of North Carolina, a bit easier to fill those places up with a fine system.  In today's environmental rules world, and expense, to  establish a nationwide train system to rival countries such as those, would be just about impossible for one entity like a government to accomplish.  It would take the govt. to over rule environment regulations, and make some kind of concessions for free enterprise to rebuild the systems of old, but then you have to get people to use them.   As a thread of logic, it would seem that to the environmental activists, that getting rid of aircraft flying at  30,000 feet and dumping burnt kerosene up there by the ton, would be worth a train system, maybe electrified the whole way, that might have to ford a stream or cross a valley that would mess up their views on keeping nature as natural as possible.  And again, you would have to ramp back commerce to the timing of the passenger train days where it took 3 days to cross the country, rather than 6 hours, and relearn how to not be in a rush.

I spent two weeks rail traveling around Japan this Fall, and it was glorious. The USA is never going to catch up.

The Acela really is showing its age. I mean... it has phone booths! 
I agree with you: the Amfleets are genuinely nicer. In the last 10 years, I've only ponied up for Acela tickets during the pandemic (paid tickets and points tickets were super cheap). Even then, I only took it when the timetable begged me to do so. 

You are not the only person annoyed by the lack of reserved seating. I sent my mom (a frequent flyer) back to Baltimore on Amtrak a few times, and she was appalled by the idea of first-come-first-serve seating. Appalled by the idea!
I'm cheap. I've been an adult for two decades and I didn't even know there was a higher class of service on the regional. I bought her a business ticket so she could have an assigned seat. It was DOUBLE the price. She got a complimentary soda.

If at all possible, I try to ride named trains between NYC and Baltimore. I know that is not always on your schedule, but there usually seems to be a lot of space on those trains compared to a regional. Plus you get footrests (Amfleet II). My guess is most NEC riders don't realize a long-distance train makes many of the same stops, so they ignore the Palmetto (which I took for $17 last year).

I'm disappointed you couldn't find your side-by-side seats, but it could be worse: remember when it used to be standing room only?

@Ted S posted:

MY EDIT

Oh- one more suggestion I made.  I would LOVE it if every Amtrak locomotive were equipped with a "dash cam" that looks through the windshield from the engineer's point-of-view.  Passengers should be able to connect to the real-time video stream via Wi-fi, and view it on their personal mobile devices.  In some ways, THAT would be even better than a window seat!  I doubt it will happen.  But it would be an inexpensive way to improve the ride experience, at least for us train buffs!

Ted - back in the 70s or 80s (I believe, not certain), the Airlines were live “streaming” their planes taking off, right into the passenger cabin, in real time. This continued up until an AA flight crashed on takeoff from O’Hare, and the passengers got to watch their impending, and concurrent, fatal crash before they passed on to their eternal reward. I believe you will never, as a passenger, get to experience train travel in the same fashion, for that very reason.

@Mark V. Spadaro posted:

Ted - back in the 70s or 80s (I believe, not certain), the Airlines were live “streaming” their planes taking off, right into the passenger cabin, in real time. This continued up until an AA flight crashed on takeoff from O’Hare, and the passengers got to watch their impending, and concurrent, fatal crash before they passed on to their eternal reward. I believe you will never, as a passenger, get to experience train travel in the same fashion, for that very reason.

Hi Mark,

it was the DC-10 crash at O’hare that put an end to streaming live. This is the accident when the number 1 engine departed the wing on takeoff and took all the hydraulics with it dooming, the jet.

@toddstrick posted:

Road Amtrak NEC on Saturday. Wilmington to DC and back. Southbound on Acela. The train set it worn out. Besides being filthy on the outside. The interior isn't much better. Seats are uncomfortable. Table was clean but didn't look clean. Rough ride, probably due to track.

Northbound Northeast Regional. I actually prefer the Amfleet cars. Train was full. People putting their bags on seat next to them. Crew to busy to deal with that. We also couldn't sit together.

Crews are professional and friendly, even if out of uniform.

Will Amtrak ever have reserved seating on all trains? Does bother anybody else it doesn't? This is 3rd time for us not sitting together.

Is it going to get worse if they do expand service?

We are definitely way behind compared to other countries

Unfortunately, this is what happens when a railroad is treated as a stepchild and not a good one. Amtrak for years has cut service and destroyed their network. Recently, a friend took the Auto train back to DC from Florida. There was no food service on the train. It made intermediate stops and there was one food truck that you had to disembark run to the truck get your food and run back to the train. He said he would never take a train again this is the experience Amtrak gives to most of its riding public, and then they wonder why people don’t take the train

@Ted S posted:

If airlines (which I despise) allow a traveler to select seat(s) and even pay extra for better ones, why would it be so difficult for Amtrak to do the same?

Just a correction. Not all airlines do, including most prominantly Southwest Airlines, one of the largest in the country. No reserved seating.

@CALNNC posted:

In the 1920's, (hard to believe we have to specify century now) it was said that you could travel across country from coast to coast and only walk 2 blocks.  The inter-connectivity of trolleys, interurbans, and mainline trains made it all possible, and it was all free enterprise with no govt. intervention, except or right of way access,  that created it.

Unfortunately, by the 1930s, lots of those local trolley and interurban companies were bankrupt. It’s idiomatic that there’s no money to be made hauling passengers.

@CALNNC posted:

In the 1920's, (hard to believe we have to specify century now) it was said that you could travel across country from coast to coast and only walk 2 blocks.  The inter-connectivity of trolleys, interurbans, and mainline trains made it all possible, and it was all free enterprise with no govt. intervention, except or right of way access,  that created it.

This couldn't be further from the truth. Most of the transcontinental railroads were built with substantial government help, from federal surveys to significant land grants to public funding. One major example: the Pacific Railway Act of 1862.

NE Regional Business Class has assigned seating, makes a real difference to me as I get on at Newark. I usually book early and have gotten a widow seat every time. You also get more leg room, a foot rest and curtains to pull across the windows.

@smd4 posted:

Unfortunately, by the 1930s, lots of those local trolley and interurban companies were bankrupt. It’s idiomatic that there’s no money to be made hauling passengers.

Which is the reason passenger railroads are govenment supported in virtually every country in the world. The U.S. has been a slow learner, with many politicians still thinking Amtrak should be self-supporting.

@CALNNC posted:

In the 1920's, (hard to believe we have to specify century now) it was said that you could travel across country from coast to coast and only walk 2 blocks.  The inter-connectivity of trolleys, interurbans, and mainline trains made it all possible, and it was all free enterprise with no govt. intervention, except or right of way access,  that created it.

@Matt_GNo27 posted:

This couldn't be further from the truth. Most of the transcontinental railroads were built with substantial government help, from federal surveys to significant land grants to public funding. One major example: the Pacific Railway Act of 1862.

Yup. Railroads were heavily subsidized practically everywhere in one form or another. Supported by government bonds, federal subsidies, and land grants. Those Pacific Railway Acts of 1862 and 1864 were prime examples. Railroads were rewarded with enormous land grants, at one point were one of the largest landowners in the western US. (At one time the Texas & Pacific Railroad was the largest landowner in Texas.)

@Scotie posted:

NE Regional Business Class has assigned seating, makes a real difference to me as I get on at Newark. I usually book early and have gotten a widow seat every time. You also get more leg room, a foot rest and curtains to pull across the windows.

I really feel for you guys who get on at Newark or Wilmington (or the other Newark), it didn't occur to me until this post that the rest of us have pretty much set up camp after we leave NY or DC.

That certainly is the case which is why I take business class. Lately from Newark (NJ) I've gotten a roomette to Richmond. You can take your shoes off, spread out and you get a lunch included.

@Mark V. Spadaro posted:

Ted - back in the 70s or 80s (I believe, not certain), the Airlines were live “streaming” their planes taking off, right into the passenger cabin, in real time. This continued up until an AA flight crashed on takeoff from O’Hare, and the passengers got to watch their impending, and concurrent, fatal crash before they passed on to their eternal reward. I believe you will never, as a passenger, get to experience train travel in the same fashion, for that very reason.

Perhaps they could do it with a slight time delay?  If automobiles can detect what seems to be an unavoidable collision and apply the brakes, you would think that a RR locomotive could do the same, and black out the stream.

Or, they could limit viewing to adults who sign a digital waiver stating that "some footage may be graphic or disturbing," etc.  I would sign in a heartbeat!

Maybe, Ted. Wouldn’t consider it likely.

@ThatGuy posted:

Unfortunately, this is what happens when a railroad is treated as a stepchild and not a good one. Amtrak for years has cut service and destroyed their network. Recently, a friend took the Auto train back to DC from Florida. There was no food service on the train. It made intermediate stops and there was one food truck that you had to disembark run to the truck get your food and run back to the train. He said he would never take a train again this is the experience Amtrak gives to most of its riding public, and then they wonder why people don’t take the train

Amtrak was given $66,000,000,000.00 in the Infrastructure Bill in 2021. They immediately issued press releases about pie-in-the-sky expanded routes, here, there and everywhere.

In the meantime, 2 years later and service has gone downhill on the existing network. Beech Grove has long lines of out of service equipment. They cannot fill out full train consists on the LD trains. The Siemens Chargers are hot garbage. the Chicago maintenance base is a total joke.

Amtrak has no interest in acquiring and holding on to a customer base? How do I know this? Because I have ridden dozens of long distance trains over the last 5 years and have been burned time and time again. Late trains, missed connections, cancelled trains leaving me stranded with no alternate transportation, poor and indifferent onboard service and being awakened in the middle of the night in my roomette by a conductor and being told rudely that I didn't "belong" in my room because of Amtrak's clerical error on my tickets.

As a taxpayer, I'm sick of hearing about "poor" Amtrak being treated like a redheaded stepchild. Give me $66,000,000,000.00 and I'll dye my head red (my hair has been gone for years).

Like everything else the government does, Amtrak is rife with nonfeasance, misfeasance and malfeasance. To me, their onboard service is a jobs program for the otherwise unemployable. No one in the private sector can get away with treating the public with such indifference, rudeness and contempt.

My last LD Amtrak trip was six or seven years ago from Tucson to Washington D.C. and return . I have not taken another LD Amtrak ride for exactly the reasons outlined by Nick, above. It certainly is a pity, because I used to really enjoy my trips starting back in the middle 1970s.

@Nick Chillianis posted:

Amtrak was given $66,000,000,000.00 in the Infrastructure Bill in 2021. They immediately issued press releases about pie-in-the-sky expanded routes, here, there and everywhere.

In the meantime, 2 years later and service has gone downhill on the existing network. Beech Grove has long lines of out of service equipment. They cannot fill out full train consists on the LD trains. The Siemens Chargers are hot garbage. the Chicago maintenance base is a total joke.

Amtrak has no interest in acquiring and holding on to a customer base? How do I know this? Because I have ridden dozens of long distance trains over the last 5 years and have been burned time and time again. Late trains, missed connections, cancelled trains leaving me stranded with no alternate transportation, poor and indifferent onboard service and being awakened in the middle of the night in my roomette by a conductor and being told rudely that I didn't "belong" in my room because of Amtrak's clerical error on my tickets.

As a taxpayer, I'm sick of hearing about "poor" Amtrak being treated like a redheaded stepchild. Give me $66,000,000,000.00 and I'll dye my head red (my hair has been gone for years).

Like everything else the government does, Amtrak is rife with nonfeasance, misfeasance and malfeasance. To me, their onboard service is a jobs program for the otherwise unemployable. No one in the private sector can get away with treating the public with such indifference, rudeness and contempt.

when I say step child they are, they cannot dump routes that make no money. Are forced by the freight rr that own most of the track outside of the corridor into late trains. Best of all its the government that put all of the manufactures of passenger cars out of business. When I worked for PennCentral the engine I  ran daily was built in the 30's every time the PC tried to drop service that was sucking the lifeblood out of it in stepped the government. Like the post office you cannot close this or that, and you have to do with less.

66 Billion is not a lot of money when running a railroad. The PennCentral had a payroll of 1 million a month so why it may seem to be lots of cash it really is not, the average cost for high speed rail is 125 million per mile. So the money that amtrak gets may seem like a large amount but spread it over an entire system it is nothing. The airlines get far higher amounts for less return.

Wow!  That's some Amtrak bashing!

My Amtrak experience during the past 3 years has been positive.  I have taken the CZ twice from Chicago to the SF Bay Area and the Empire Builder once from Chicago to Glacier Park.  I had a roomette on the CZ and a bedroom on the Builder.  

The trains were clean and mostly ran on time.  The food service was excellent and the crews were friendly.  

I also ride the Amtrak Capitol Corridor trains between the SF Bay Area and Sacramento several times a year.  The Capitol Corridor trains are subsidized by California.  These trains are on time and clean.  They have good light food service and the crews are friendly.  You can get a breakfast sandwich, orange juice and coffee in the morning and an OK burger and a beer coming home in the evening.  They also sever a good, not great, CA wine.

I haven't taken a NEC train for many, many years.  I am sorry to learn about the issues on these trains.  I would think that Acela would be Amtrak's best since it is a premium service.  I am surprised to learn that it is not.  NH Joe

@New Haven Joe posted:

Wow!  That's some Amtrak bashing!

My Amtrak experience during the past 3 years has been positive.  I have taken the CZ twice from Chicago to the SF Bay Area and the Empire Builder once from Chicago to Glacier Park.  I had a roomette on the CZ and a bedroom on the Builder.  

The trains were clean and mostly ran on time.  The food service was excellent and the crews were friendly.  

I also ride the Amtrak Capitol Corridor trains between the SF Bay Area and Sacramento several times a year.  The Capitol Corridor trains are subsidized by California.  These trains are on time and clean.  They have good light food service and the crews are friendly.  You can get a breakfast sandwich, orange juice and coffee in the morning and an OK burger and a beer coming home in the evening.  They also sever a good, not great, CA wine.

I haven't taken a NEC train for many, many years.  I am sorry to learn about the issues on these trains.  I would think that Acela would be Amtrak's best since it is a premium service.  I am surprised to learn that it is not.  NH Joe

No, that's a factual account of my experiences. I'm glad you had three nice trips.

@ThatGuy posted:

when I say step child they are, they cannot dump routes that make no money. Are forced by the freight rr that own most of the track outside of the corridor into late trains. Best of all its the government that put all of the manufactures of passenger cars out of business. When I worked for PennCentral the engine I  ran daily was built in the 30's every time the PC tried to drop service that was sucking the lifeblood out of it in stepped the government. Like the post office you cannot close this or that, and you have to do with less.

66 Billion is not a lot of money when running a railroad. The PennCentral had a payroll of 1 million a month so why it may seem to be lots of cash it really is not, the average cost for high speed rail is 125 million per mile. So the money that amtrak gets may seem like a large amount but spread it over an entire system it is nothing. The airlines get far higher amounts for less return.

$66 Billion is not a lot of money? Oh ****, lets just give them the keys to the Treasury then. 

High speed rail in the US is a pipe dream. Just look at the train from nowhere to no place in California for an illustration of what a bait and switch boondoggle looks like.

@Nick Chillianis posted:

$66 Billion is not a lot of money? Oh ****, lets just give them the keys to the Treasury then.

High speed rail in the US is a pipe dream. Just look at the train from nowhere to no place in California for an illustration of what a bait and switch boondoggle looks like.

I get it you hate Amtrak but until you decide to have an intelligent conversation there is no need to carry this on.