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I'm trying to re-splay the side frames on my 601-101 motor truck. I've got the cross hair splaying tool (DC-1003), but am kind of stuck trying to find something that works as an anvil. It appears I need something like a 3/16" shaft, about 1-1/4" long with a flat end to serve as an anvil that will actually fit up inside the truck, and will not hit the side frames and/or the plastic edge of the field coil.

What do you use?

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I believe there is a tool for that. Here is Train Tender's listing. I don't know whether this is a Hobby Horse tool, or one that Jeff makes.
Since I have this tool, it's the first thing I would try. If it didn't fit, then it's a matter of looking around the shop for something that will fit. It might mean clamping the "anvil" in my wood vise, and striking the splaying clincher by hand, using a soft faced mallet.

ST350-GSTGP sideframe tightning support tool20.00

Let's see, soft faced mallet in right hand, motor truck assembly in left hand, splaying clincher in .... wait, I ran out of hands!

I confess to using this flawed and very awkward technique - I have clamped a round punch with a flat end facing upward into my metal vice, then my work on top of that, then smacked a cold chisel from above using a conventional hammer to tighten things up. Not too worried about damaging the cold chisel or punch, I have a lot of them - and I wear safety glasses! But I am wondering what the risk might be to the side frame casting. Have you seen those break using this technique?

I notice you said you would clamp your "anvil" in your wood vise. I'm guessing your choice of a wood vice is to lessen the chance of tool breakage?

And finally, chipped clinchers - from hammering on them? Or did yours break in a press?

I emailed Jeff for a photo and a description of his ST350-GST

I notice you said you would clamp your "anvil" in your wood vise. I'm guessing your choice of a wood vice is to lessen the chance of tool breakage?

It depends on the "anvil"
If I am using a genuine anvil that is made to go in an arbor press, I actually use a threaded anvil holder to hold the tool, and clamp the threaded anvil holder in the vise.
In any case, the wood vice won't mar the "anvil'.

I have clamped a round punch with a flat end facing upward into my metal vice, then my work on top of that, then smacked a cold chisel from above using a conventional hammer to tighten things up. Not too worried about damaging the cold chisel or punch, I have a lot of them - and I wear safety glasses! But I am wondering what the risk might be to the side frame casting. Have you seen those break using this technique?

I've used punches as anvils too. I have yet to damage any.
I have bent small punches using them as punches.
And I have dulled cold chisels.
I have plenty of chisels and punches. I've modified some of the chisels for special uses by grinding.
Haven't broken a side frame casting yet.
All it takes is a sharp rap with the hammer. Excessive force isn't necessary.

And finally, chipped clinchers - from hammering on them? Or did yours break in a press?

Press. To be specific, it was a splaying clincher. I have yet to damage a rolling clincher, or get one in a lot of tools. I have purchased rolling clinchers (and many other press tools) that have been modified by grinding away parts for clearance.
Knockout punches are commonly broken. I purchased tools that included a broken knockout punch and broken a few myself. Always in a press. I see no reason to use a knockout punch (press tool) outside of the press. I would use a regular pin punch.

Let's see, soft faced mallet in right hand, motor truck assembly in left hand, splaying clincher in .... wait, I ran out of hands!

Part of the setup is supporting the truck.
That is another advantage of using my wood vise.
The top edge of the wood vise is flush with the top of my bench.

I have all sorts of metal shapes to come up with something to support the truck.
I purchase them when I see them at reasonable prices.
Some are just pieces of scrap. Others are machinist things whose original purpose escapes me.
Among this stuff are a few different size / shape V blocks. Some manufactured, some home made.

I guess there is also some experience / practice involved. I've been repairing trains for a long time.
When I first got my press, I thought it should be used for everything. It didn't take long to realize there were many operations that were better done without the press.

When I purchased my first Lionel ST-350 press, the seller would not include to tooling. He told me he would continue to use them with a mallet.

Below is a photo of the Hobby Horse Geep Side Frame anvil.
Note: I don't know for certain that it will work with a 600 series truck.
Also, Hobby Horse does modify tools from time to time. IMGP1320

 

 

 

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  • IMGP1320
Last edited by C W Burfle
C W Burfle posted:

I confess to using this flawed and very awkward technique

By the way, there is nothing flawed or awkward about the technique.
If you prefer, I will cease commenting on your questions.

Ha! Obviously you have not witnessed MY technique!!

I do NOT prefer that you cease commenting, to the contrary. Let's put it this way, when I managed 40+ electro-mechanical repair techs at one point in my career, the people I valued the most were those that not only did their work, but were more than willing to share their knowledge with less experienced techs. The people that I valued the least were those that withheld information ... one even told me one day, when I asked why his trainees didn't know some of the basics, that he didn't share EVERYTHING he knew because then, "...they would be as good as me!" To this day, I still can't believe he said that to my face.

So keep the comments, thoughts and other details coming, that is the biggest benefit to me in this forum ... aside from just the sheer enjoyment of it all!

C W Burfle posted:

Let's see, soft faced mallet in right hand, motor truck assembly in left hand, splaying clincher in .... wait, I ran out of hands!

Part of the setup is supporting the truck.
That is another advantage of using my wood vise.
The top edge of the wood vise is flush with the top of my bench.

This is the part where I have difficulty, supporting the truck.

I have all sorts of metal shapes to come up with something to support the truck.
I purchase them when I see them at reasonable prices.
Some are just pieces of scrap. Others are machinist things whose original purpose escapes me.
Among this stuff are a few different size / shape V blocks. Some manufactured, some home made.

Not sure where I can find any scrap metal pieces, but that sounds like an excellent suggestion!.

I guess there is also some experience / practice involved. I've been repairing trains for a long time.
When I first got my press, I thought it should be used for everything. It didn't take long to realize there were many operations that were better done without the press.

Like everything else worth doing, experience comes at a price, but can be invaluable if you have the knack. As Joseph M. Juran observed, " Some workers consistently outperform others on specific quality tasks. The likely reason is possession of a special “knack.” In such cases, designers should study the methods used by the respective workers to discover the methodologic differences. These differences usually include the knack—a small difference in method that produces a big difference in performance."

Below is a photo of the Hobby Horse Geep Side Frame anvil.
Note: I don't know for certain that it will work with a 600 series truck.

I spoke with Jeff earlier and he advised that tool works ONLY on a Geep in the case where the wheels, axles, truck frame and side frames are all still fastened together, that it would not work with my 601-101 motor unless the top plate had been removed, exposing the staking point supports for the frame sides. 
IMGP1320b

 Thanks C.W., good stuff!!!

 

 

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