ASC and BPC problems

One possibility is that the ASC and BPC lost their programming. Try reprogramming one of them and see if that fixes the problem for that module.

I did reprogram both of them. Same result. The ASC recognizes the address and I here the click of the relay but no power to the block.

When I reprogrammed the BPC and attempted to address it I lost all power to the layout. I could not even address the TPCs toturn track power on. Then after working with it again I was able to restore power to both loops. I’m reluctant to try anything else with it.

Operationally my layout was just fine until now. Everything worked. Now I’m at the point where I just may tear it down and start over again. I suspect that the loose power wire on the BPC had something to do with these problems. When I reconnected it I got a spark.

I wonder if I can remove the BPC and see if the ASC will then work. Will removing the data wires disable it.

You say your hearing the "relays" click but you do not say if you have a meter showing voltages or lack of voltage when you exercise the device(s)?  In other words what is telling you that they are not working?  I use these devices (and I assume you are referring to the TMCC version and not the Legacy version) extensively and I do have a BPC that after using a meter, the relays would click but not demonstrate the voltages I thought they should.  Are you using the ASC as voltage switch and not a Switch operation?

WaynePA posted:

I wonder if I can remove the BPC and see if the ASC will then work. Will removing the data wires disable it.

For purposes of your test, I'd suggest also disconnecting the AC power that powers the relays.

Hi, the relays are inside the devices. A couple of years ago when I had a problem with the ASC I, spoke with Lou Covatch and he said if you can hear the relays there must be a damaged trace on the cab. Sure enough there was and I bridged it with a soldered piece of copper wire and it worked.

I’m guessing this might be the issue. I’ll check this out when I get back to vacation next week.

Loose-Caboose posted:

You say your hearing the "relays" click but you do not say if you have a meter showing voltages or lack of voltage when you exercise the device(s)?  In other words what is telling you that they are not working?  I use these devices (and I assume you are referring to the TMCC version and not the Legacy version) extensively and I do have a BPC that after using a meter, the relays would click but not demonstrate the voltages I thought they should.  Are you using the ASC as voltage switch and not a Switch operation?

I have lighted bumpers on the four way yard tracks that would light up when power was applied. They do not. The products are the TMCC versions being addressed by my CAB1L. However, when I had the Legacy 990 system they worked.

I think the sparking reconnecting the power wires to the BPC is the issue. I can’t believe all the problems that caused. I lost control of my DZ2500 machines, the routes don’t work and one switch stopped altogether. It may also have affected the DZ2001 data wire driver.

WaynePA posted:

Loose-Caboose posted:

You say your hearing the "relays" click but you do not say if you have a meter showing voltages or lack of voltage when you exercise the device(s)?  In other words what is telling you that they are not working?  I use these devices (and I assume you are referring to the TMCC version and not the Legacy version) extensively and I do have a BPC that after using a meter, the relays would click but not demonstrate the voltages I thought they should.  Are you using the ASC as voltage switch and not a Switch operation?

I have lighted bumpers on the four way yard tracks that would light up when power was applied. They do not. The products are the TMCC versions being addressed by my CAB1L. However, when I had the Legacy 990 system they worked.

I think the sparking reconnecting the power wires to the BPC is the issue. I can’t believe all the problems that caused. I lost control of my DZ2500 machines, the routes don’t work and one switch stopped altogether. It may also have affected the DZ2001 data wire driver.

 

Do yourself a favor and go to your local hardware store and get a cheap but good volt meter.  And then measure the voltage output directly on the device.  Looking at devices connected to the track voltage is a long way from adequate trouble shooting.  Start at the device where the trouble is.

The voltage from the sparking can be quite large.  One of the first precautions when disconnecting or connecting devices, remove power for the device.  That board in my picture has a kill switch for all power being fed to the board.  Good insurance to prevent the sequence you relate.

I made a big mistake by not turn off the power. I thought I could just reconnect the wires. That won’t happen again. I’ve got a digital meter but have not used it to check the output. I thought the fact that the bumpers were not lighting up was sufficient.

I have TVS’s on every input and output but it seems they did not prevent the damage.

This is very frustrating to say the least.

Seems like a silly question, but are you sure there is track power going to the relays?  They have relay power and track power going to them, and with the track power off the relay will still work but no power to the track.  Yes, I did this with the Legacy one when I set it up the 1st time.

I have many of these ASC’, BPC’s, the first ones Lionel made after acquiring the patents from Lou Kovach. In my opinion, wire one up, on your work bench, or desk, on a simple piece of track with one switch, do it by the instructions booklet and see if it works.  Yes, you will need a TMCC set up to go with this, but that’s the best way to rest it.  My entire layout is Legacy, using these devices, Atlas O switches, unvouplers, blocks, engines, Lash-Ups, Diesels, Steamers.....I left my phone number for Ed, (Waynepa) It’s a fun hobby.

Things seem to be even worse. The DZ 2001 Data Wire Driver appears to have been damaged. None of the DZ 2500 Switch Machines will go into programming mode and many of them simply stopped working altogether.

All from a single spark and apparent power surge.

I just don’t understand how they could all be interconnected. Is it through the dat and comm terminals on the ASC, BPC or the A/U power terminals. The two TPC’s were not affected.

This is not only going to be expensive but it’s going to be a real pain taking all those switch machines off and sending them to DZ Stuff for replacement. At least Dennis is going to give me a good deal which lessons the blow a little bit.

Installed a new ASC programed it and was able to turn power on and off to my four way yard. Reprogrammed the BPC and it’s working now. Seems the problem was with the ASC. 

Still having an issue with the DZ2500 machines. I need to remove them all and send them back to Z-Stuff for replacement. I’m still concerned that the Data Wire driver may have go bad. I’ll have to wait until I get the replacements to find out.

Anyone know how to diagnose it.

Well I thought everything was finally working when I replaced the ASC but now the BPC does not recognize both of my TPC’s. It only turns power on using one TPC. It was working fine yesterday.

I reprogrammed it for four tracks ACC then #98 then set. Assigned track #’s 1-4 ACC #1then set. Turned power on then attempted to turn power on to the tracks. 

Sometimes it doesn’t work at all, then it turns power on with just a single TPC.

This is very frustrating. I’ve never had so much trouble. I’m ready to give up and just dump everything and get out of the hobby altogether.