Skip to main content

Hello, I need help with a pair of Atlas O 7.5 switched configured in a crossover and controlled by a single atlas 6924 circuit board.  I have 2 other sets of Atlas O switches (two 7.5s and two #5s) configured in crossovers and operating correctly with non-derailing and power routing. The problem switches are wired to their 6924 the same way the other crossovers sets are wired. The problem presents when I feed track power through the 3 amp fuses to the power routing connectors on the 6924.  As soon as I add track power the board begins throwing the 2 switches at rapid random intervals.  The behavior continues until I remove track power.  I have been working on this problem for days with no success.  I have swapped the board with another previously working 6924 this board also behaved the same way (so maybe it’s not the board). I took the switches and the board off the layout and connected everything using and old ZW.  They worked correctly for non-derail and power routing.  I did notice that the older 7.5 switch showed a much lower voltage on the other side of the frog.  I thought this might have something to do with this switch because it is an early model 7.5 with ineffective wiring that reportedly does not power all sides of the switch reliably.  I added a connection to the unpowered side and the power was consistent throughout the switch.

Next I put switches and the board back on the layout back connecting and testing one function at a time before connecting other functions:

  1. I connected Board Power (14V). The board lit up.
  2. I connected SW PWR IN (14V). IN A and IN B show 9 Volts (DC I think).
  3. I connected the switch machines to Out A and Out B.  I used a jumper to ground to trigger IN A and then IN B. Both switch machines threw each switch correctly.
  4. I connected track power through the 3 amp fuse to COM2.  It showed correct track voltage on COM2 and correct voltage on C1-2 and C2-2 depending on which direction the switch was set.
  5. I connected track power through the 3 amp fuse to COM1.  It showed correct track voltage on COM1 and correct voltage on C1-1 and C2-1 depending on which direction the switch was set.
  6. I connected C1-2, C2-2, C1-1 and C1-2 to their associated closure rails.  Each rail powered correctly depending on the switch position. (So far so good).
  7. I did note an odd thing on the old 7.5 switch.  There was a voltage on a closure rail that should have been dead. The voltage was low, 4V. I disconnected the feed to the closure rail, but the 4V was still there so it must be leaking from the track power going through the center rails of the switch. I expect this will cause a short when I run a wheel set over it.
  8. Another issue with the old 7.5 switch is there is no way to insulate the switch for non-derailing.  The two entry rails that are normally insulated for non-derailing are hardwired to each other and to the frog, so these rails cannot be used for the non-derailing control.  I had to use an insulated rail on an approach track to the straight side of the switch. The curved side does not need non-derailing because both switches are automatically aligned for crossover using the switch controller button.
  9. I connected the insulated rails of the modern 7.5 switch and the approach rail of the old 7.5 to IN A and IN B.  I applied track power.  The board began its erratic behavior again.  I thought it was the connection of the insulated rails to IN A and IN B so I powered down and disconnected them.  When I power up and apply track power, the problem still persists. 

10. It seems that the non-derail connections triggers the behavior, but once started it continues even if they are disconnected.  I am baffled.   

 

Thanks for reading this convoluted post.

 

6924

Attachments

Images (1)
  • 6924: Wiring for the crossover
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

here is Chessiefan72's tutorial. Perhaps, if you send an email to him he can help sort out the wiring.

 

I didn't see the crossover arrangement in his tutorial, but it would seem that it's two switches wired for non-derail, turn-out to turn-out.

 

Insulating the center rail of the turnouts from one another would be necessary as they are different power blocks. Also keeping the voltage the same in both blocks is needed to prevent bridging the transformers.

I removed the old 7.5 switch and replaced it with a # 5.  I still have the same problem, so it is not the old switch.

Next:

I completely disconnected from that 6924 board and connected to another new 6924.  I hooked up every connection but the IN A and IN B. Everything worked. I tested IN A and IN B with the short 24" leader wires I had coming from the board.  The board acted normally. I can throw the switches and power routing works.  

 

The switches are about 20 feet of wire away from the 6924. Next, I connected the full length of two wires from the vicinity of the switches to IN A and IN B.  I did not connect the wires to any rails, it was just 20 feet of two disconnected wires running from IN A and IN B.  When I power up the track, the new board exhibited the same erratic behavior as the other board. When I disconnect the long wire segments from the 6924, the issue disappears.

 

I think the issue is triggered by the bundled wires.  The power routing wires carry track current.  The non-derail wires carry 9 V DC.  Once they are all powered and bundled together over the 20 foot distance, a current must be somehow induced into both the non-derail wires that trigger the erratic switching.

 

I reran the non-derail wires away from the power routing wires and everything now works perfectly. 

 

I hope this experience will be useful to others.

 

 

Interesting fix. Glad you got it resolved. I was going to use the 6924's myself, but after getting things all hooked up and running it worked so well I never installed any that I had purchased. I am still going to hang on to them just in case.

 

Atlas has some great folks that provide great help when you need it. Steve is one of them that really goes the extra mile to help you out.

Last edited by rtr12

I have 15 of them so far.  I needed them for the #5 and 7.5 switches.  I want to run new and old engines on the layout, but many stalled on those switches.  The boards are engineered very well with a lot of features.  They make operation of all my engines smooth over  the switches. I also wanted to avoid the switch machine burnouts that others have experienced.  

I have no old engines and run command control only. Everything I have was purchased new in the last 4 years or so. I thought I would also need the 6924's for the reasons you stated, but so far everything has been fine, no problems. I have a few 6924's that I bought to try out, so if the need arises I will be ready.

 

The only problems I have had with Atlas switches was with used ones. Some were more 'used' than others. I got parts for them from Atlas and fixed all but one. The rails fell off of that one and I didn't need it so it's on standby for repair or as a parts donor. I probably won't be buying any more used, all new from now on.

I have mostly used switches. Last year I couldn't find new ones. The new engines do alright with the #5 and 7.5 switches, but my pre-command and postwar stuff could not make it thru any of them.  The 6924s require a lot of wiring, but to me they are worth the effort, although this episode made me question that for a few days. You do learn something new all the time in this hobby.

 

Add Reply

Post
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×
×