Looks like we are in store for mostly Alternative history cars in this run.. IMO, what a waste, but I'm sure someone is buying these!
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The 3-railers are probably more interested in the "alternate history" paint schemes than the 2-railers. Atlas has been doing more fantasy schemes to extract as much as they possibly can out of existing tooling. If this is what it takes for Atlas to remain in O scale then they have my blessing.
I'm definitely getting all 4 road #'s of the Chicago Freight Car hoppers. I thought Atlas could've offered maybe one more example in a prototypical look at the expense of a fantasy one.
Mike,
uhhh.....ummm.....wow......well....gee.......This is.....a.....surprise. I'm at a loss here. I thought our comments on my thread gave some pretty clear direction as to what we were hoping for. I wonder who picked these schemes and why???....all I can say is, Atlas...if these don't get many reservations, please look over our comments on Atlas Repaints....Gasp! Is this a "careful what you wish for" moment? Maybe, I dunno. Chicago Freight good in my book, but I'm with Catnap here. Not sure what to think about these specific fantasy picks.
I had eight cars in boxes. 2 different sets. I had the 4 BNSF and the 4 CSX versions. I sold off the CSX because I thought a friend would enjoy them and they were sitting under my layout waiting for conversion to 2 rail. I missed those cars the second I boxed them up for shipping. They were beautiful.
So I said I will get more. Unfortunately when the next CSX version came out, I was broke. They were also beautiful and I think they even had those blue end caps on the roller bearings (HD)? The price had gone up too.
Now I see the next releases here. I'm still broke! So I'm not too upset with Atlas. I'm more upset with myself.
Vote with your $$. I know I am!
All I can say regarding the "fantasy schemes" is that if they don't sell Atlas,don't gripe at us modelers.
I model CSX and yes those cars are BEAUTIFUL. I have 28 of those cars,4 I added reflective stripes from Smokebox Graphics and I also changed a digit on these.
Yes,Engineer-Joe, not to rub salt in the wound,but they do have blue caps on the axles. Don't feel bad,I'm broke too.
Al Hummel
If the Airslide hoppers made the cut, and I didn't think they would since they all were "alternate history" paint schemes, then the Trinity hoppers will have no problem meeting production minimum orders given the fact that they are more popular.
No question the Chicago Freight Car is typical of almost all modern freight cars seen in todays trains, collectors/operators who buy these cars in multiples like the "alternate schemes" and make each new run possible. I like the new online monthly catalog format. JMO
catnap posted:The 3-railers are probably more interested in the "alternate history" paint schemes than the 2-railers. Atlas has been doing more fantasy schemes to extract as much as they possibly can out of existing tooling. If this is what it takes for Atlas to remain in O scale then they have my blessing.
I'm definitely getting all 4 road #'s of the Chicago Freight Car hoppers. I thought Atlas could've offered maybe one more example in a prototypical look at the expense of a fantasy one.
I would have thought with the other prototypical schemes that have been discussed there would be more balance with the alternate history schemes? I hope they sell!
Mike,
Well, I'm not going to play the spoilt brat on this as I did suggest some of my own alternative schemes like BN gray and Cotton Belt gray. Just doing a quick internet search this morning I found some interesting stuff illustrated below. I did consult the ARR website and found two shiny new ARR SD70ACe's pulling a freight. Third car in line was a tired Golden West ACF 3 Bay Hopper (couldn't download that pix). It would seem ARR has no real fleet of these cars. Midwest railroad grain hoppers are barged up to Alaska and turned over to ARR for distribution of loads. Empties are then returned. News to me, but I'm sure that ARR modelers have known that for years. I'm actually a little envious. They can have a number of different railroads on the layout and it's all good.
First up are Pix from Alaska Mill and Feed near Anchorage. Note the BN Hopper next to the silo. Next is a ARR ACF Hopper in gray. This is more along the lines of what I expected, but I can understand that if some might want something more flashy. Finally, here is the only other picture I could quickly find. I'm supposing that these have been retired long since.
My attitude is a little split on this. I want Atlas to succeed, so despite the inference of my earlier comment, I hope these sell. On the other hand I hope that prototype and near-prototype offerings will be considered equally to fantasy schemes. The Conrail scheme is certainly believable so that will make the "resistance" happy. I sometimes think about adding some Conrail, but I'm just too far west.
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I wouldn't mess investing with schemes that never existed if I were Atlas,but rather invest in schemes that exist & sold well as Atlas is doing by rerunning CSX,BNSF,etc. (Just my opinion,of course). As a modeler,I will only buy what I see on the rails today and within the last 30 years. The yellow SCL 4750s Atlas ran are hardly seen on CSX today due to age,for instance. I relettered & numbered a few,but they'd be an exception in a cut of cars,no longer the rule.
Al Hummel
Al,
Well, I tend to agree, but on the other hand the remaining North American railroads are slowly merging into a monochromatic blob that is becoming less appealing. Alternative paints can reach some modelers that otherwise wouldn't purchase the prototype. As has been said, that extends the life of the model run and gives Atlas $$$ to make additional runs that appeal more to our prototype tastes. That is especially why I like the ubiquitous private owner gray paint. Just change the stencil and you can have lots of different prototypes and also feed the alternative paint scheme crowd. The Chicago Freight Car is very representative of that. When I stopped to really think about it, I don't want to narrow the choices if it will help me get the paint schemes I'd like to see, and generate revenue for the next highly detailed, prototype Master Line freight car. I also don't want to throw cold water on people just having a little fun with their trains. After all, it's Christmas.
IMO, most manufacturers look for some variations that carry the run, often it's schemes for the class I railroads since there are more modelers that model those railroads and will often see run through options on just about every other railroad. This run will be interesting because which one(s) will carry the run?
Ultimately it boils down to the successful manufacturers make what sells and what the modelers want, sometimes those aren't exactly the same. 
I think the price will do more to limit the run than the road names. 3 railers will buy the fantasy schemes, color sells..2 railers will not.
Remember 3 rail outsells 2 rail by allot. 2 rail will always be a afterthought when it comes to the manufactures.
Dave
I have seen Atlas in the past drop a particular paint scheme but still bring the remaining listed models in, I have yet to see them bring in a particular model in 3 rail but not 2 rail knowing that the 3 rail market represents the biggest percentage of a typical run, I don't have a problem with paint schemes that help make a run possible, in some cases that is the only way to get a prototypical paint scheme you want and do not foresee the correct model coming out anytime soon [case in point the latest Berwick 60' hy cube in the Railbox paint] interesting that the MTH 50' Railbox hy cube is a rib side and the Berwick is a partial waffle side in the prototype this construction is reversed just saying!
david1 posted:I think the price will do more to limit the run than the road names. 3 railers will buy the fantasy schemes, color sells..2 railers will not.
Remember 3 rail outsells 2 rail by allot. 2 rail will always be a afterthought when it comes to the manufactures.
Dave
More and more 3RS guys are buying 2R scale equipment. Not saying all of them do, but the shift is happening where possible.
You're right, color triggers one of the impulse senses... How much that one trigger impacts the purchase of these cars remains to be seen.
Yes, from the manufacturers perspective, flashy color(s) seemed to be important to sales. I believe this is more of 3-rail thing, which as we are told, is where the predominant market share resides. This need for flashy colors follows a post on one of the OGR forums by a Lionel representative with regards to potential rerun schemes for their new 67’ modern mill gondola. Lionel said that they were sorta at a loss as to what follow-on schemes could be chosen due to the “blandness” of the prototype schemes available for this type of car. Therefore, when the new rerun schemes were revealed, Lionel added “flash” to the paint schemes by integrating graffiti to the paint schemes to jazz them up iin hopes of attracting the need for flashy color crew.
Scott K.
Austin, TX
I don't worry so much about Atlas' releases. If I want something that that isn't made, I dig out my air brush and paint it. I realize that decals can be a problem at times. My disgust comes with the fact that right now Atlas could absolutely own the two rail market in so far as ready to run O scale cars. Most don't find too much fault with their cars or locos.
Dick
Scott Kay posted:Yes, from the manufacturers perspective, flashy color(s) seemed to be important to sales. I believe this is more of 3-rail thing, which as we are told, is where the predominant market share resides. This need for flashy colors follows a post on one of the OGR forums by a Lionel representative with regards to potential rerun schemes for their new 67’ modern mill gondola. Lionel said that they were sorta at a loss as to what follow-on schemes could be chosen due to the “blandness” of the prototype schemes available for this type of car. Therefore, when the new rerun schemes were revealed, Lionel added “flash” to the paint schemes by integrating graffiti to the paint schemes to jazz them up iin hopes of attracting the need for flashy color crew.
Scott K.
Austin, TX
Scott, in other scales, weathered cars and cars with graffiti come out monthly and sell VERY well. I suspect we would start to see a similar trend in O Scale if they were done well. I've ordered all of the new gons with graffiti
The Chessie System, Southern Pacific, and Conrail can be considered HERITAGE schemes.
Andrew
ATLAS has the ACF CENTER FLOW 3560 Cu Ft 3-bay covered hopper produced in N and HO scales for the Trainman line.
Why did they not add the ACF 3560 to the O scale Trainman line?
They can put the real ALASKA scheme on those models.
Andrew
I don't have an issue with companies producing alternate history schemes, my problem comes when that's all they do. I still need more NS and CSX 5161's. I also can't see many people paying over $100 for a fantasy car. Trainman price range would probably do a lot better.
As for the 3 rail vs 2 rail debate, I'm a 3RS guy so now I just order 2 rail freight cars when possible so I don't have to convert down the road. I just don't see the guys who buy something because of paint forking up this kind of cash.
Theres a reason MTH and Lionel put out 2 catalogs a year, 3 rail collectors/operators on average buy lots of product each year and price is not that big a deterrent if they want something. JMO
I might be tempted on a few of the Chicago freight Car ones myself......
Absolutely interested in the CRDX cars
The CSX name came from the Chessie Seaboard merger.
Chessie System makes sense.
Andrew
This is a scheme for a TRINITY 5161 that has not been produced by Atlas O. It is for IMPERIAL SUGAR.
Andrew
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Andrew, Thanks for sharing. Very nice.
Andrew that's a nice car! Thank you for the photos and research.
Al Hummel
I have been trying to sell much of my Atlas Scale cars and find that they are hard to get any value from. I am listing 17,600 tank cars for $45. and no movement. One would think that move fast. I wonder about Atlas staying in O scale as it seems the market saturated.
In my experience from the first Weaver plastic models to the present day Atlas Trinity cars these products are bought to own not for any resale value, with the exception of certain collectables. Weaver cars in most cases on the secondary market sell for less that the price of new Atlas trucks. Atlas in many cases is not that much higher and with ever rising new prices does not even resell for close to "street" prices when new. Obviously Lionel and to a lesser extent MTH see a different secondary market view, 2 rail items in particular are a much tougher sell on this forum I have done much better selling when I can provide the model with 3 rail trucks. JMO
So selling new in box 5161s,would bring no more than $50 per car?
As I been selling my HO items,it seems they sell faster and at better prices than O Scale hard to find items. I thought if it ever came to that,selling my O Scale for whatever reason,most notably,selling our house for a smaller location,that the O Scale would sell fast-am I in for a bad surprise?
Al Hummel
FWIW Maxi-stacks and containers are in at my dealer!
The "fantasy schemes" make sense when there's a market for them,but when Atlas has a tough time selling the Prototype,"In Service," freight cars,why dream about selling what never existed in the 1st place?
Why not spend time & money on what modelers want more of for example the GATX &NAHX cars to name a few prototypes off the top of my head? Is this what Atlas is going to do with the 4750 schemes,put out cars that never ran the rails? How many of the BNSF schemes actually existed?
Just my opinion of course.
Al Hummel
I like the Alaska car, and my three rail track will like it also. 
For the PS-4750 they have have barely scratched the surface for the leased hopper schemes and there are 2 or 3 paint scheme variations for most of the railroads who owned the PS-4750 covered hoppers. Will they all be produced in China?
Andrew
You can preorder them from Muffins trains for $103.00 each.
falconservice posted:For the PS-4750 they have have barely scratched the surface for the leased hopper schemes and there are 2 or 3 paint scheme variations for most of the railroads who owned the PS-4750 covered hoppers. Will they all be produced in China?
Andrew
Where else?
Well here's a can of worms when we start talking about re-sale value, which, of course, is not the heart of this thread, just to be fair to Mike. There are so many factors: Was the car prototype and/or particular paint scheme popular? Is there a shortage of same? Will/are your LHS/individuals pricing based on that scarcity? Will it be a long time before another production run will occur? Is there a buying pool for said item? What is the motivation of the seller? What is the state of the economy at the time of sale? What I may think is a fair price and what you may think is a fair price can be two totally different numbers based on how we individually perceive and interpret these factors. All Atlas cars can't be lumped together because some were extremely popular, others, well, not so much. Nor can they be equally compared to Lionel or MTH based on that Blue/Orange versus Magenta colored box collector's attitude.
As for paying retail, sometimes I do to get the "pick of the litter" as it were and to avoid artificial price inflation and scarcity later if it looks to be a popular item. Other times, I just don't have the money ready to spend. I'll have to risk buying on the after market later. Sometimes that's okay, sometimes not so much. I'm pretty sure we've all experienced this to a certain degree at one time or another.
Al brings up an interesting point about what happens when you need/want to sell. Ultimately, the market factors I've mentioned, at the time of sell, decide.
Finally, O Scale, as has been said, is a smaller market that O Gauge. It's a fact that O Scale hobbyists have to live with or go stark raving insane. So let's hope that Atlas will introduce paint schemes for every taste. Good for their pocket book, great for our hobby. Even with it's imperfections, what a great time to be in the hobby....and as I said on another thread, ....don't like your Atlas Trains? Send me your list cuz' I've got a big shopping list of my own...and Atlas...as Swafford always says "Ready to Buy when you Supply!"
And now, back to our regularly scheduled thread.............
