Bent Engine Wheel Flange

Ponz....don't know if it's possible...the wheel is zinc alloy,prone to break...if you keep them you may have to replace the wheel....hope this helps...joe

How in the world does one bend an engine wheel flange?  It must have been dropped.  If so, there should have been much more damage - right?

Ponz

The seller is not being very cooperative, so far.

He has offered to refund me EXCEPT for his $21.43 shipping charge - or - refund me $50 to repair it myself. 

So - I lose close to 50 bucks to send it back or take the $50 and try to replace the wheel.

Where would I get one wheel and how is it replaced?

Ponz

Here is the seller / forum member response.  I replied that I'd take the $50 and try to replace the wheel myself.

Who can direct me to a video on engine wheel procurement and replacement

I will refund you $50.00 and you keep the se6t or I 1ill refund you $105.00 and you ship it back post paid.

I would try to file or grind the flange where it is bent in toward the rail.  Then I would add some J B Weld, Devcon or Marine Tex metal filled epoxy putty to fill in the depression on the outside of the flange and file it off and make it blend in with the rest of the flange.

Charlie

Actually replacing that wheel is not a difficult job. The sideframe assembly is removed with one screw to access the wheels. A small punch and ball-peen hammer to remove the wheel. Press the new one on. I have new wheels.

Was this bought on the forum or ebay or ?

It certainly doesn't make excellent or very good that's for sure.

I'm not the norm here and I realize that.  But, if you only paid $105 for those MPC era F3's in the first place and he is offering $50 back, I'd say that's easy.  Take the money and fix it.  You could easily find a proper MPC power truck on ebay for way less than $50 WITH a little patience.  You could probably get the truck block for the same price as replacing the wheel on a good day.  Like Chuck says, the wheel is easy too. 

No brainer for me.  I respect the other views to send it back or what ever, but for me  I would fix it and accept the good overall price you got it for.

aussteve posted:

Was this bought on the forum or ebay or ?

It certainly doesn't make excellent or very good that's for sure.

Forum )-:

Chuck Sartor posted:

Actually replacing that wheel is not a difficult job. The sideframe assembly is removed with one screw to access the wheels. A small punch and ball-peen hammer to remove the wheel. Press the new one on. I have new wheels.

Here's a pic of the 'so called screws' holding the side frame.  They aren't budging

Dennis Holler posted:

I'm not the norm here and I realize that.  But, if you only paid $105 for those MPC era F3's in the first place and he is offering $50 back, I'd say that's easy.  Take the money and fix it.  You could easily find a proper MPC power truck on ebay for way less than $50 WITH a little patience.  You could probably get the truck block for the same price as replacing the wheel on a good day.  Like Chuck says, the wheel is easy too. 

No brainer for me.  I respect the other views to send it back or what ever, but for me  I would fix it and accept the good overall price you got it for.

Dennis,

I paid $125 delivered which I realize is a good price.  However, I didn't realize I bought myself a job.

Ponz

For the best quality job find someone with an arbor press and the proper cups to mount the new wheel.

I think I agree with charlie.

Remove the truck block. Back up the wheel with a flat block, preferably steel. Gently tap out the bend with a punch and medium sized hammer. If that doesn't work out, then replace the wheel. 

I have all sorts of different steel shapes for such uses. I've picked them up at estate sales, garage sales, flea markets, used tool stores, and the like.

I would grind off the part of the flange that is the problem and live with it.  

I have never heard of a successful process for getting the swedged truck side franes back on. 

Keep us posted on your process and progrezs

Ponz posted:

The seller is not being very cooperative, so far.

He has offered to refund me EXCEPT for his $21.43 shipping charge - or - refund me $50 to repair it myself. 

So - I lose close to 50 bucks to send it back or take the $50 and try to replace the wheel.

Where would I get one wheel and how is it replaced?

Ponz

First, fixing it is preferable to anything else; I won't get into the "woulda, shoulda" of buyers and sellers.

Second, this cast metal - zinc, almost certainly - can be bent back into shape, probably only once, with care, patience and moderate expectations.

If the problem is the flange only and the entire wheel does not wobble in any meaningful way (many model train wheels wobble a bit from the factory, especially older vintages, but it cannot be seen in ordinary use), it appears to me that this flange may be coaxed back into nearly correct contour. Heating can help this, but you can't put a torch on this truck. I've never used heat for zinc work, BTW.

Take a pair of pliers - not needle-nose; more blunt - and firmly grasp the flange on the "hump" and near the base of it at the wheel. Don't grasp just the edge of the flange. Attempt to bend it, firmly and gently all along the deformed area, especially at the "peak". Look at it. Keep it up until the profile looks better. Look at it; test it. Keep at it. Don't jerk it. (Small Vice-Grips may be a way to go instead of plain pliers; just proceed carefully and slowly.)

If you get the flange almost straight but you would like to finish it off and the bending is getting uncooperative, dress the flange face a bit with a file.  If the wobble goes away in normal service, it's fixed. Micrometers not needed.

Did I mention patience?  

I tried straightening the wheel.  I made it worse,  It's toast.

Any of you guys looking for a little side job?  Have a wheel and the tools? I'll send you this truck assembly (pic attached).

I'll pay a reasonable price or take you out to a great Kansas City BBQ lunch! 

Ponz

aussteve posted:

I would grind off the part of the flange that is the problem and live with it.  

I have never heard of a successful process for getting the swedged truck side franes back on. 

Keep us posted on your process and progrezs

There is no need to remove the truck sides. They are attached to a plate, which in turn is attached to the truck block by a single screw.

That written, there are multiple ways to reattach a swedged side frame. If one is careful at removal time, you can leave enough material to make a new swedge. Or you can drill and tap for a machine screw or two. I guess I can agree that it would be preferable not to remove the side frame. I try to avoid doing so whenever i can

C W Burfle posted:

aussteve posted:

I would grind off the part of the flange that is the problem and live with it.  

I have never heard of a successful process for getting the swedged truck side franes back on. 

Keep us posted on your process and progrezs

There is no need to remove the truck sides. They are attached to a plate, which in turn is attached to the truck block by a single screw.

That written, there are multiple ways to reattach a swedged side frame. If one is careful at removal time, you can leave enough material to make a new swedge. Or you can drill and tap for a machine screw or two. I guess I can agree that it would be preferable not to remove the side frame. I try to avoid doing so whenever i can

CW,

So that screw near the yellow power lead, when taken out, will lift off the side frames without everything else coming apart?

C W Burfle posted:

aussteve posted:

I would grind off the part of the flange that is the problem and live with it.  

I have never heard of a successful process for getting the swedged truck side franes back on. 

Keep us posted on your process and progrezs

There is no need to remove the truck sides. They are attached to a plate, which in turn is attached to the truck block by a single screw.

That written, there are multiple ways to reattach a swedged side frame. If one is careful at removal time, you can leave enough material to make a new swedge. Or you can drill and tap for a machine screw or two. I guess I can agree that it would be preferable not to remove the side frame. I try to avoid doing so whenever i can

You make it sound like everyone has all the right tools ….

Ponz

Ponz posted:

C W Burfle posted:

aussteve posted:

I would grind off the part of the flange that is the problem and live with it.  

I have never heard of a successful process for getting the swedged truck side franes back on. 

Keep us posted on your process and progrezs

There is no need to remove the truck sides. They are attached to a plate, which in turn is attached to the truck block by a single screw.

That written, there are multiple ways to reattach a swedged side frame. If one is careful at removal time, you can leave enough material to make a new swedge. Or you can drill and tap for a machine screw or two. I guess I can agree that it would be preferable not to remove the side frame. I try to avoid doing so whenever i can

CW,

So that screw near the yellow power lead, when taken out, will lift off the side frames without everything else coming apart?

Take off that little screw. The top plate and sides lift off as one piece.

Ponz posted:

C W Burfle posted:

aussteve posted:

I would grind off the part of the flange that is the problem and live with it.  

I have never heard of a successful process for getting the swedged truck side franes back on. 

Keep us posted on your process and progrezs

There is no need to remove the truck sides. They are attached to a plate, which in turn is attached to the truck block by a single screw.

That written, there are multiple ways to reattach a swedged side frame. If one is careful at removal time, you can leave enough material to make a new swedge. Or you can drill and tap for a machine screw or two. I guess I can agree that it would be preferable not to remove the side frame. I try to avoid doing so whenever i can

You make it sound like everyone has all the right tools ….

Ponz

Most folks don't start out with the right tools.

  Many of us acquire their tools over time. That is how I did it. There are still plenty of tools I'd love to have, but probably never will.

If you need a wheel and someone to install it, drop me a line.

Lou1985 posted:

Ponz posted:

C W Burfle posted:

aussteve posted:

I would grind off the part of the flange that is the problem and live with it.  

I have never heard of a successful process for getting the swedged truck side franes back on. 

Keep us posted on your process and progrezs

There is no need to remove the truck sides. They are attached to a plate, which in turn is attached to the truck block by a single screw.

That written, there are multiple ways to reattach a swedged side frame. If one is careful at removal time, you can leave enough material to make a new swedge. Or you can drill and tap for a machine screw or two. I guess I can agree that it would be preferable not to remove the side frame. I try to avoid doing so whenever i can

CW,

So that screw near the yellow power lead, when taken out, will lift off the side frames without everything else coming apart?

Take off that little screw. The top plate and sides lift off as one piece.

Thanks.  What about the drawbar and knuckle assembly?

Chuck Sartor posted:

Actually replacing that wheel is not a difficult job. The sideframe assembly is removed with one screw to access the wheels. A small punch and ball-peen hammer to remove the wheel. Press the new one on. I have new wheels.

Chuck - I sent you an email.

Ponz

The knuckke assembly is mounted to the top plate. You should not have to do anything to it. Were I in your shoes, I'd contact Chuck and ask him to do the work

Axle and wheels off and new wheels on the way thanks to Chuck.

Ponz

Roll that axle on a flat surface too to check it is true (if you didn't while the wheels turned or got aggressive in removal)

IMO, you did pretty well on price overall Ponz. But regardless, that bend should have been mentioned by the seller. Almost no way they were unaware of it; especially if they run their trains vs display only. I'd be ticked off as well.

Swedges: On other frames I have cut the swedge marks slightly deeper and closed them with vice grips.  Sometimes it failed; sometimes works. I had no issues tapping in trains so far. Lost just oneof 3 or 4, and it ran crappy anyhow. Now the SW sports an F's magnetraction truck and pulls like one too

Adriatic posted:

Roll that axle on a flat surface too to check it is true (if you didn't while the wheels turned or got aggressive in removal)

IMO, you did pretty well on price overall Ponz. But regardless, that bend should have been mentioned by the seller. Almost no way they were unaware of it; especially if they run their trains vs display only. I'd be ticked off as well.

Swedges: On other frames I have cut the swedge marks slightly deeper and closed them with vice grips.  Sometimes it failed; sometimes works. I had no issues tapping in trains so far. Lost just oneof 3 or 4, and it ran crappy anyhow. Now the SW sports an F's magnetraction truck and pulls like one too

I was assured by Chuck that the seller is an OK guy and probably didn't even know about the wheel....

I'm still trying to figure out how the wheel got bent in the first place?!

Ponz

Chucks word works for me.....I said "almost"

Usually they get bent the other way when dropped, but no telling what it hit or the position. If it was lumped in a box for a loong time, good pressure alone can "cold flow" a bend into bodies (used by some to repair bends as well) Could happen to a wheel too I guess...??