CPR T1c Selkirk Ugly Duckling or Black Beauty?

Beauty! 

 I forgot to mention that Dieselization was completed by the end of 1952 Between Revelstoke BC and Calgary AB and all the Selkirks 5900-5935 were assigned to freight service at that time

Al

I definitely like these. Canadian locomotives have a distinctly different appearance to US ones, somehow. 

Love the coal loader in the background..

I was aware of the all black repaints, but I don't think I'd ever seen a picture of one and,  given the elegance of the original Tuscan and gray scheme, I definitely didn't expect to I'd like it . I was wrong - it's definitely a Black Beauty!

I've not commented before, but I'm a long time admirer of your CP efforts. Great work!

- Mike 

As usual, exceptional modelling!!  CNR & CPR fan JohnA

Thank you Mike and John! I have been fascinated with the history of these locos especially their service life on the Prairies

  Photos are rather scarce and hard to find but are out there

  Here is a photo of a of another Selkirk in less than pristine appearance 

  Note the boiler tube pilot as opposed to the solid steel standard pilot, originally equipped on the T1b/c class locos

Al

Be nice if Lionel or MTH would finally do one of these. I don't see it though, it looks like they have both given up on new tooling.

They're a pretty good looking locomotive, at least I think so.  I just finished upgrading a pair of 3rd Rail models to ERR electronics and my Super-Chuffer for a customer.  They'll look great double-headed.

Both of these were the gray boiler models.

Excellent paint job Albert! I always liked the big Selkirk engines especially in black. I like that cool cat in the video too. 

Handsome engine in black or CPR gray & maroon.  There are freight in-service photos of #'s 5931 and 5935 at Medicine Hat, AB and Sidewood, SK in Joe G. Collias' book "The Last of Steam". Curiously, or practically (?), the Canadian Pacific had removed the sheet metal pilot on the 5931 and replaced it with a boiler tube type.  Pictures from September 1956, and depict the locomotives pulling "75 cars of Time Freight 980" and a "96 car stock extra".

Beautiful engines and thank you for the history lesson.  Made the trip on Rocky Mountaineer from Banff to Vancouver, back in June.  Passed through Revelstoke on rail, after going through the spiral tunnels earlier in the day.

picked up a reproduction CP poster with one of those engines in it, while in Banff.

Thank you Mark Paul and JSTRAW124!

Mark

The Collias photos have been the only photos of these locos that I have seen published 

 These photos I am posting are the ones you mentioned, however they are from the British publication of LOCO PROFILE #35 circa 1973

 Unfortunately I traded my book “ The Last of Steam” away a few years back

John  I also installed a Super Chuffer into this model that I had laying around and I am currently converting all my rolling stock over to Kadee’s. 
 Just so I can run double headers as well 

Paul   All 4 of my cats like the trains Lol

Al

Albert - A publication I picked up in a 1995 visit to Quebec City, titled "Canadian Pacific in Southern Ontario" by W.H.N. Rossiter (Newt) included an excellent 1949 photo of #5933 breaking in on a freight run between Montreal and Smiths Falls, on the Winchester Subdivision. Unfortunately I do not have the facility to reproduce the photo. David P. Morgan's timeless "Steam's FInest Hour" had pictures of the streamlined Selkirks, too.

Suspect the T1c's, of 1949 construction, were just too new to retire in the mid-'50's, cost accounting-wise. The two CPR 4-8-4's also found new homes out West in freight service until 1957 & '58. Believe that was the retirement time span for the T1c 2-10-4's.

Great to see these great engines 

I just purchased a Weaver Royal Canadian engine. GRAY and Maroon

Looking for the correct passenger cars 

Just big lovely beasts, aren't they? Nice job, Albert! 

Thank you Firewood! 
Yes I would like to see 5931 rebuilt for excursion service don’t think I will see that in my life time lol

Scouter Lynn if you are looking for Heavyweight cars for your Hudson, you have a couple of options

1) Golden Gate Depot have offered 21” long Heavyweight passenger cars that are available on the aftermarket auction sites. There is a 4 car set on the ‘bay when I looked yesterday

 Here is one example of a GGD car

2) MTH issued the 5 18” car Heavyweight sets with lights interiors passengers a few years back

3) Repaint some Lionel Heavyweight cars to CP as I have. I prefer the look of the Lionel cars to the MTH ones

Al

Thanks for the Info on the PC Hudson 

I will scan Ebay 

Blessings 

I wonder if 5911 might qualify as the ugly duckling, with that square cab and snow pilot. 

http://www.trainweb.org/oldtim...tos/cpr_steam/T1.htm

Firewood

  No way!

All the Selkirks looked good with their ploughs except maybe 8000, it had a goofy one that I thought was ugly on the front of that particular loco

  As for the square cab, well that would mean the 3100s are ugly as well lol

Al

All of the semi streamlined CP locos are beauties. Louis Marx would be proud.

I wish someone would make the streamlined 3000, the long wheelbase one.

RoyBoy

  I’m sure Louis Marx made some $$$ of their model of a Bowen streamlined loco. I’m sure there is an interesting story on how Marx developed theirs. I have yet to hear it

 I to would like to see a scale F2a 4-4-4 3000 offered for 3 rail, plus the the lightweight cars

 Here are 2 CP publicity pics from back in the day

Al

Those locos are exactly what I would like to see in scale sized three rail.

I would love to have some in S gauge also.

Great looking engine, definitely not an ugly duckling in any color...like the paint job though :-)

Sumpin wrong if you don't like these.

                                  ♥

Black Beauty Texans, err, Selkirks!

Surprised CPR ordered them so late in the game.

 Dominic

 H B Bowen, who was promoted to Chief Mechanical Engineer in 1929 was an ardent Steam man and designed all the big modern steam for the CPR.

 The newly appointed President was Norris “Buck” Crump, who was a big believer in the Diesel and was in office in 1949 when the T1c class were delivered.

  Canadian Pacific was slow to Dieselize mainline trains while Bowen was in office but once he retired, Crump started to Dieselize with the Mountain divisions first in 1953.

 Its interesting to note that Bowen had preliminary designs for a 4-4-4-4 Duplex, 2-8-4 and a 4-8-4 with Centipede tender on the drawing board! However, this was not to be

Al

there was a 4-4-4 cp pass paint made by weaver and still available on the bay once and awhile.  i now have the weaver princess, royal hudson, 3rd tail selkirk, the mth 2020.  had to add weight to the princess and a traction tire on the front driver, put in a .020 piece of brass on the bearing for the center drivers as they pressed to much on the rail and hurt traction.  also took out the crappy train america system and converted to mth and also mikes smoke unit  and it is know asuper engine.  i;m curious if the 4-4-4 will pull anything as as small and light it is.  also th ta sound and running system.

SteamPunk

  Sounds like a nice collection of CPR steam you have!

   I have done lots of modifications on my locos as well, mainly reducing the spring pressure on the pilot and trailing trucks to increase adhesion on the drivers.

  The 3rd Rail D-10-g was notorious for slipping lol

Al

Steam Punk - I acquired a used Weaver 4-4-4 Jubilee steamer 5 or 6 years ago. In answer to your question, 'yes' it will pull a few plastic freight cars (which I realize may not be prototypical) but I never back the engine up because reverse causes the side rods to bind abit (where they enter the steam chest) and I'm fearful this might bend the rods and cause real problems. So I err on the side of caution and don't run it in reverse (not even the engine and tender by itself), but it's a nice looking little engine steaming forward around my small layout.

albertstrains posted:

Thank you Mike and John! I have been fascinated with the history of these locos especially their service life on the Prairies

  Photos are rather scarce and hard to find but are out there

  Here is a photo of a of another Selkirk in less than pristine appearance 

  Note the boiler tube pilot as opposed to the solid steel standard pilot, originally equipped on the T1b/c class locos

Al

I always liked the shape of these and similar CP steamers, though I tended to find the multi-color paint scheme a bit fussy (it reminds me of the Erie-Lackawanna diesel scheme). I rode behind the so-called "royal" Hudson many years ago on an excursion out of Mobile on the Gulf Coast. 4-6-4's are just inherently balanced-looking, also.

But, back to your Selkirk: black is definitely an improvement over the multi-color, but black and dirty - above - is even better. Also, in this shot, the loco recalls the NYC (P&LE) A-2 Berkshire to me. Must be the spoked drivers, outside-bearing lead truck, enclosed cab and overall smooth outline and proportions. 

D500

  I am a fan of the PL&E Berks as well. I haven’t had the bug to start weathering my rolling stock, yet. But, I can see it happening once I get the layout further along and complete all my conversions to Kadee.

  I am a big fan of the Tuscan/Grey paint scheme but the all black on these locomotives is quite pleasing to the eye as well.

Al