Is anything missing from the new Lionel catalog

An updated iCab app before any of the LCS and LC stuff gets "merged".  The LCS app is horrible for operating trains.  First off it's only 32 speed steps and second is very limiting.  I love it for layout operation though.  The iCab app is a few steps up but really needs an upgrade.  I wish it was able to mimic the Cab2 a little better.

IMO and I know I will get flack but let LC and LC+ be what it's supposed to be a lower cost, less technical option.  LC+2.0 is already borderline but I get the appeal of those.  It give the Bluetooth crowd some higher end locos and the Legacy/TMCC folks some lower cost, smaller options.  Don't muddy the waters with trying to merge the systems.

I'm actually fine with the LCS WiFi module being discrete from the base.

Accessories that do more!  Bring back the Hobo accessories too!  These are some of the best gems in Lionel's past including the water tower.

Quite honestly, yes.   The company for sometime hasn't put out a real unique operating accessory.  There was a time when I'd immediately flip to the back of the catalog looking for what "new" innovative accessory they'd be offering.   

I think its been a decade now since that last happened.   It's sad to be honest as those onetime offerings were really unique in their own right.

Here's something I've been saying for years. Make the starter sets compatible with legacy. Right now you can't. When you buy anything besides a starter set you have to run the set with the remote (dedicated or the universal one) or the app. Do that and then the so called "stair case" will be built that lionel has been talking about for years.

What is missing from this catalog?  Well, something they said they would do but haven’t: complete the AFT set.

My thoought with the catalogue was there was a lot of throw it against the wall and see if we get enough pre-orders.  Without the Acela, and Verandahs, what would have been there?  They filled pages.  You have to wonder what Marketing inpuut was without an MTH catalogue chasing the same customer base.  That will be interesting.  Also interesting, only 2 catalogs per year now.  The next topic will be, "when is Big Book #2 coming out?

Right about the accessories.  Nothing new there for a while.

@Trainlover9943 posted:

Here's something I've been saying for years. Make the starter sets compatible with legacy. Right now you can't. When you buy anything besides a starter set you have to run the set with the remote (dedicated or the universal one) or the app. Do that and then the so called "stair case" will be built that lionel has been talking about for years.

I think they've gone too far down the Bluetooth rabbit hole.  I always felt the same but since they've gone this far, Bluetooth compatibility in Legacy engines is probably as close as it will get.  I always thought the MTH thought process of the same system in both starter sets as in the RK and Premier line was the better approach.  It will always work on a DCS layout.  That being said I think Lionel has done a good job with the Bluetooth control.

IMHO, missing are: Magne-traction, Tubular Track (O and O27 heights)

What did I like the best in the catalog? The building kits

A product they cancelled in 2014:

The American Flyer scale 57' mechanical reefer.

Rusty

Some good ideas here.  And almost no Lionel bashing.  Refreshing.

I have no problem with Lionel's use of B/T.  I can see how it might be an issue for others ....

To add...

Super "O" track

Spy v. Spy series.  Please get this licensed. 

More "hobo" as suggested.  Yes!

New accessories.  There's lots of fertile ground in this area.

Signaling (as suggested).

I want a Vision Line track system.
O72 minimum to O128 sectional curves with accurate tie spacing and thinnest possible center rail (think about MTH's Scaletrax center rail on Atlas ties-less the pre-drilled holes in the ties)
Of course no plastic roadbed like Fastrack. 
5" straight with a discretely embedded LCS sensor
#4 and # 6 Switches with discretely integrated motors that of course would be command control

I want the perfect track system.  MTH, Atlas and Ross all have pros and cons.  I want one system that would take the best elements of each and provide a track system worthy of the Vision Line engines.  Of course that is never going to happen, but wishful thinking

@T4TT

Ya, I thought about tossing a "Quieter version of FT" on the list. lol

Interesting suggestion, I can't argue with it in principle, especially for the folks dropping big $ on Legacy & O Scale equipment.   To me, Atlas O is what Super O could have/should have been.  

Appreciate your thoughts

@rthomps posted:

More "hobo" as suggested.  Yes!

New accessories.  There's lots of fertile ground in this area.

Agree also. The "hobo" series was really well done. I would be ok with a rerun if that was all we could get, but agree, it was a good series.

Charlie

I don’t see any scale cabeese! The 2-10-10-2, Pacific’s, Camelbacks and not one scale caboose to bring up the tail of a freight train! Did I miss them? Even the Nickel Plate Work train is cabooseless! Is that a word?

Yes.  New SUBWAYS now that MTH is gone.

@Trainlover9943 & @MartyE

Yep, I've also wished for years they did it like MTH, oh well, it is what it is.  And ya, we are way down the BT hole.  I wouldn't be surprised if we see more BT enabled items in the future.  

LC.20 is my choice,  I don't have space (or $) for Legacy & O Scale equipment, and LC is way too basic.  I could live with LC's reduced features (no fan smoke, fewer lights, no smoke in Diesels etc)  if it at least had ElectroCouplers and Speed Control and lash-ups.   It's 2021, that should be std, not an upgrade anymore.

And, hmm I had no idea the iCab & LCS apps were in need of some love from Lionel.  I think LCS looks REALLY cool,   So far I could only find 2 other systems/apps that had similar functionality, one was for Lego trains (yep, lego) and the other is the Roco Z21 for DCC (If I was into DCC, I would get this one).

Anyway, appreciate your thoughts/comments

Thanks

What's missing??

Items that are reasonably priced!!

Dave

Lionel needs to come to terms with regard to train control - Between LC, LC+, Legacy and Bluetooth - too many in my opinion.

I would have liked to see:

• Accessories - more 'innovative', functioning accessories.
• Definitely - bring back the hobo series of accessories
• Integrated signals with Fastrack - create a track that signals can 'plug in to'
• Curved Fastrack turnouts

@Casey_Jones posted:

@Trainlover9943 & @MartyE

LC.20 is my choice,  I don't have space (or $) for Legacy & O Scale equipment, and LC is way too basic.  I could live with LC's reduced features (no fan smoke, fewer lights, no smoke in Diesels etc)  if it at least had ElectroCouplers and Speed Control and lash-ups.   It's 2021, that should be std, not an upgrade anymore.

I'm with you and called us "tweeners" on another thread. Space, budget, and an inheritance of O27-sized post-war gear led me to traditional-sized with TMCC about 15 years ago and no change to Legacy when it came out. Didn't fully embrace LC+ when it came out since I already had TMCC, but did buy one Mikado and liked its simplicity, speed control, and that it could be controlled separately while another person used the Cab-1. I don't used many TMCC features like accessory or switch control or even the route running, just engine control. Like you, I DO like lash-ups that LC+ doesn't offer.

Shortly before LC+2 came out, I decided to add DCS to the new layout (that I should be wiring in a week or two). Three things took me to DCS two of which LC+2 might've caused me to avoid: speed control, 4 chuffs,  and great variety of motive power.

I immediately bought a Rail King Berk because I could no longer bear seeing Lionel Junior Berk dwarfed by a Lionel Pacific. Picked up a few more Rail King engines since then but had LC+2 come out 5 years sooner and in a 21-22" Berk, I wouldn't be running DCS or Rail King at all.

Hobo series is nice.

Bring back some reasonably price standard gauge track/engine/cards/accessories.

@Craftech posted:

Yes.  New SUBWAYS now that MTH is gone.

Yes!!! Please!!

@Casey_Jones posted:

@Trainlover9943 & @MartyE

Yep, I've also wished for years they did it like MTH, oh well, it is what it is.  And ya, we are way down the BT hole.  I wouldn't be surprised if we see more BT enabled items in the future.  

LC.20 is my choice,  I don't have space (or $) for Legacy & O Scale equipment, and LC is way too basic.  I could live with LC's reduced features (no fan smoke, fewer lights, no smoke in Diesels etc)  if it at least had ElectroCouplers and Speed Control and lash-ups.   It's 2021, that should be std, not an upgrade anymore.

And, hmm I had no idea the iCab & LCS apps were in need of some love from Lionel.  I think LCS looks REALLY cool,   So far I could only find 2 other systems/apps that had similar functionality, one was for Lego trains (yep, lego) and the other is the Roco Z21 for DCC (If I was into DCC, I would get this one).

Anyway, appreciate your thoughts/comments

Thanks

Yeah, Doesn't look like we'll get to the level of MTH in terms of compatibility but BT is close enough I guess. 

Lionel will never give the customer what is requested if they don't make a huge profit on the item. Mark my words, there days are numbered just like MTH. Except Mike was smart enough to get out.

Yes, 18" streamlined passenger cars sets to match engines offered.  Just like you-know-who!

I would like a set of 21  inch Pennsy congressional passenger cars complete with a stations sounds snack car , some 18 inch LIRR passenger cars from the steam era ,some new subways sets with doors that open and close AND a Bluetooth chip that can broadcast the sound to auxiliary speakers hidden around and under the layout  and to my palm pilot device so I could hear the sound directly in my hearing aids which would mean I could really understand the crew talk and appreciate all the other sound effects

Lionel needs to bring back the Legacy Crane and Boom Cars and sell them as a set instead of separately. I've seen videos, and the cranes/boom cars are probably the coolest cars Lionel ever made.

My other ideas:

-Turntable for Fastrack (w/ TMCC included)

-Command-Control Intermodal Crane

-ATSF Super Chief and El Capitan passenger trains

-Bring back the heritage units with upgraded controls/sounds (UP Heritage SD70ACes, NS Heritage ES44ACs/SD70ACes, CP and CN units, more fictional paint schemes)

                The 40 and 50 foot combination door box cars.

@Casey_Jones posted:

@T4TT

Ya, I thought about tossing a "Quieter version of FT" on the list. lol

Yes. And have it 100% compatible with existing FasTrack.

I am not into the new stuff but I will echo the suggestion on some new and interesting accessories.

Another thing I'd like to see and I think others might also would be a higher end Thomas model. It doesn't need to be over a grand but something with more detail and some basic features. If they offered that I would seriously consider it.

There are plenty of us who grew up watching Shining Time Station and have the desire to have something better than the basic model they have been selling for years. They can test the water with just Thomas and the coaches.

I've also heard a few folks clamor for a better Hogwarts train. Maybe time to try some British models?

And finally my silly suggestion for us MPC era fans - Something MPC era inspired with replicated Sound of Steam/Static...

Agree that Lionel has way too many ways to control engines....absurd.  Keeping my DCS for sure, with Legacy.  Vision pricing getting out of hand for sure.  And so many fantasy items whose resale value will plummet.  Overall, very concerned about the future of O gauge with only Lionel.

An “MTH governor” on their pricing

How about some Scale Flat cars, just plain flat cars.

Tmcc/Legacy   -Subway sets - trolleys - streetcars that are 036 compatible.  ,

My wish list would include ability to run lashup with Bluetooth app and/or universal remote.   I no longer have a permanent layout, instead I created ground level modules that I setup outside (during nice weather) so I can run long trains through sweeping curves and the landscaping.   Since I can't double head a train I'm limited on grades and train length.   And yes I know a Legacy control system allows lash up however I'm beginning to suspect the distances to various parts of the yard would be an issue.

Next would be undecorated/unpainted body shells and with that the ability to change the engine photo when using the Bluetooth control app.   Finally multiple six pack sets of various individually numbered freight cars.

Am I the only one who appreciates the fact that Lionel is using Bluetooth as the one ring to rule them?  The app runs basic starter sets up through Legacy.

Jon

I think Lionel would be wise to consolidate control systems because it can be rough for a new person. But this is really nitpicking and it's probably going to happen regardless. I would prefer to use my CAB1L or CAB2 over a cell phone but I appreciate how I can save my old smart phones for when friends come over and they can run the trains without me having to foot the bill for more controllers. It'll be interesting to see how things go with the control systems in the future. I have really enjoyed Legacy!

I would say I would like to see locomotives with blowdown, cylinder, whistle, dynamo, and smoke effects BUT, I don't know how they already fit that stuff under the boiler to begin with so this is more of a wishlist item. I suspect there's simply not enough space. I especially don't think they will ever do it because I'm learning a lot of people don't care for smoke. Customers have already squawked over the Polar Express Acela. I hate to see how loud the reaction is to an engine that creates a wall of smoke even though it could just be turned off as easy as you could simply not buy the Polar Express Acela

Beyond that, I would like to see more rolling stock variety in terms of the industry specific cars and the road names produced.

@KOOLjock1 posted:

Am I the only one who appreciates the fact that Lionel is using Bluetooth as the one ring to rule them?  The app runs basic starter sets up through Legacy.

Jon

Now if they could get the app to run more than one engine at a time...

A PS1 sound system built into an 86 ft box car

I'm firmly in the 'Traction, Interurban, and subways' camp here.  If bump'n'go is all we have to look forward to now, our streets, sub-lines, and interurban routes are going to be very, very dull.  I think it would be nice if they could offer one from each category (in recolored form) every year with command control, or simply to make them accessible to the market once and a while.  Don't need 6 different fantasy schemes per model, I can repaint if it mattered that much.

Other than that.... when the heck was the last time Lionel made a Canadian National passenger car set??? (google says never)

If they cant do that, give us a nice blue&gold VIA RAIL set with the F-units. (even MTH didn't make that one!!!)

@KOOLjock1 posted:

Am I the only one who appreciates the fact that Lionel is using Bluetooth as the one ring to rule them?  The app runs basic starter sets up through Legacy.

Jon

You aren’t the only one. I wish the app had a little more functionality when controlling legacy engines. But it’s easy for me and my nephew to run trains together with the devices we already have. Plus I like that the engines are connected to each other via Bluetooth (like the recent E8 AA sets) so you can control the set without any setup. The legacy remote is very off putting to me. I have DCS as well but more often than not, we prefer the simplicity of Bluetooth through the app.

Keith, I was just curious since you own Legacy and DCS, Have you used the DCS App also and how do you think the two compare. I do use both but just curious. Sorry for the off this thread.