Kadees on MTH Scale-wheeled F-units -- a followup

I see that u got North Western F-7 units! Congrats!

Thanks. Now I have to hunt down a second B-unit for it and convert it.

What's your overall impression of these units? Can you post some pictures? I have the NYC coming prob this month and cannot wait

Likes:

• Nicely done side frames on the trucks. Pilots look better than on the FT's I have.
• Smooth operation.
• Good sound
• Good smoke
• Close coupling of the units via dummy scale couplers
• Cab light only on when unit is stopped. Goes out when in motion. Same feature is present on other Proto-3 engines and I love it.
• Operate well on club's "flat-top" three-rail track and most of the turnouts. Oops! Forgot which list I'm on.

Dislikes:

• Tether location. Don't like it on my Hi-rail F-units either. Would be better threaded through the doors/diaphragms.
• Design of the dummy couplers between units. I would have preferred body mounts for Kadees between the units. Still looking at installing them although it may make removing the chassis more complicated. Referencing the thread on modifying the extra B-unit, a fast approach would be to swap one of the couplers from the extra B-unit and have lobster claws between A-B pairs. Have also thought about draw-bar connecting A-B pairs even though this wasn't the case with F7's.

Mixed:

• Mars light effect. The effect with bulbs seems more realistic.
• LED Class lamps. Green on lead unit; red on trailing unit. Bi-color LEDs would work so you could do run-around operation at the end of the line.

Overall:

• Well worth the cost of admission. I now have a passenger F-unit set to go with my freight F-unit set. Still thinking I'd like a E8 A-B-A set so I could convert the B-unit to a Crandall Cab, but then I'd have to get a set of gallery cars.
• Not regretting decision three years ago to go with scale-wheeled diesels even though I'm still running in a 3-rail environment at the club. They're threatening an Intervention -- big time.

Nice summation Matt, thanks.

Like your list Matt. And I agree with all of it!  Except for myself I would add, "not regretting the decision to go to 2 rail on my layout" 

Awesome, thanks for the full reply and video post. Sounds like a great set.

Dave:

Like your review. I had the same feeling about the tether -- should have gone through the doors. Also, if I recall correctly, the CNW F-units don't have the service grabs on the side of the hood, but have them on the top corner. I'll have to pull them out and check again. On the prototypes, there were grabs toward the top of the hood, but not along the sides.

Since my FT's are out of warranty, I'll try the tether relocation and Kadee conversion on them first. 

Wow great information everyone. Where can i find more information on moving the truck side frames in closer? I have several to do.

It's tricky. Mike Pitogo and a couple of others have done it. Basically, you have to drill new new mounting holes closer to the frame, then shave the mounting plate down. That will put the frames and shoes closer to the wheels. Here's the problem: You have to be very precise as you don't want the brake shoes touching the wheels and shorting things out. If done correctly, it does look good. I'm a fan of the 3-foot rule -- if you can't see it from 3 feet away don't worry about it, especially if it's moving.

Dave, thanks for the pics and blog post. Great info altogether! Look forward to the tether upgrade.  

Finally got around to putting the Kadees on my MTH scale-wheeled CNW F7's. Also made some adjustments to the B-units.

First, the Kadees mount using either 1-72 or 2mmx8mm screws, the latter thread in a little better. I cut off the trip pins on the 805's (they're the only pair I had, but I'll replace them with the new 700 series later.)

As to the B-units, the separate-sale CNW B unit is actually set up backwards (at least this particular one was.) Turning the shell around doesn't quite work as the tank would be backward. You have to remove the trucks and the cables and swap them on the chassis (not a real big deal.)

Also, there's the issue of the couplers. I found the most efficient solution was to swap the "socket" end coupler on the front of the separate-sale B-unit with the socket-end coupler on the B-unit that comes with the ABA set. This, with the above modifications on the separate-sale B-unit allows you to use the three-rail couplers to connect the B-units back-to-back, so all the units look like a mirror-image arrangement. They couple closely enough that the diaphragms touch. I'm ordering a set of scale wheels to finish the job, but since they'll run on the club layout as-is right now, I'm good.

Next step is a set of scale wheels Kadees for my passenger cars.

I finally had the chance to take my units as is out of the box and run it last night, I love it.  Like matt, those guys at the factory must have been smoking something, the screws for the couplers were the philips counter sink machine screws normally used for snow ploughs.  The tether location like all their E/F's are horrible.  I only have an ABA set and must look to find another B.  Its not my era but this one snuck in because they were pre-ordered before I became era specific.  I hope you all enjoy yours.

Got mine today, I love it. Two strange issues though, the dispatch mic doesn't go through. And the trailing A unit (shown) has the Interior Light and the Headlight reversed so the interior light is always on and the headlight turns off when I pull. Should be an easy wire fix. Got rid of the dated and awful MU cables and added more prototypical ones. (why does MTH still puts those on when they already have the new ones?)

Beautiful NYC power, thnx for the pic.  I wish they wouldn't use those MU cables, they are so ugly.

 So did they get rid of the cables? I didn't understand you. Could you show us a pic of the new cable used? Is the old one still being used?

The F-unit MU cables are made from a softer material, but they look like they're from the same molds as the thick, stiff plastic ones. On the GP38's, the cables and the air hose appear to be made from Delrin, but they're thin, longer and flexible.

Alas, the tether connections are still located beneath the trucks. When the warranty expires, I'm going to re-route them through the rear doors. I really wish that MTH would just handle ABA's as two separate locomotives to be consisted rather than using the slave-unit with a tether.

Thanks for the photo I wanted those, but information was that they would be grey. Glad to see it's black

If you replace the 805's with a 700 series coupler, you might consider the long shank coupler.  You may not have to cut the trip pin.

That is what I used on this E7.

Had to so something to the cab interior, the mu hoses are atlas o, also did the trick Rich Battista does with the modern diesels to reduce the truck gap.

That is really some nice work..it looks great!

Looking at photo number 5, did you not notice that the forward facing lighting stripes are NOT even parallel?

No I didn't! Thanks for letting me know, I love mistakes like that

Great material here regarding these models.  Thanks to all.

SANTIAGOP23  Several questions if you don't mind:

1.  What MTH catalog do your NYC F Units appear in?

2.  I like your crew members; what is the source for them?

3.  You mention the trick that Rich Battista did to reduce the truck gap.  Did you mean reduce the height (top of the truck to the bottom of the car body)?  And where can I find where this trick is mentioned?

Thanks in advance,

Steve

No problem! It first appeared in the 2012 V 2 catalog, the item number is 20-20265-2. The crew members come with the set and I did not do anything to them (I did remove the crew on the trailing A unit ). This is the link for the lowering diesels thread, I've been doing it on all my diesels and I think it makes a huge difference:

https://ogrforum.com/d...ent/5512461212577417 

Santiago23,

Thanks for this additional information.  I didn't know if that truck lowering tip was on one of Rich Battista's videos or not.

 Steve

Santiago23,

I've been trying to educate myself with regard to these units. You guys have been a tremendous asset.

Another question if you don't mind:

With regard to lowering the body down on the trucks; did you have to grind off a protruding nub or did you put a spacer to hide the gap.  The photos that you posted shows, to me a least, that the body is really snugged down atop the trucks.  It really looks great!

Steve

Steve, there is no lowering needed, they ship snug.  Check out the latest OST with Sethian's review, it pretty much sums it up for me as well.  I enjoy running my set.

Thanks Michael,

I completely overlooked that article by John.  How many of these F units are running at your club?

Steve

Michael is right, there is no need to grind off. I put the spacer to reduce the gap a little bit more. It would be great if someone would post a step by step on how to hide the cable and replace it through the doors. I've never done it so I'm gonna wait and learn it from someone who's done it before. 

Thanks SANTIAGO23,

I can just make out the spacer in one of the photos that you posted.  I would too like to see how to hide the cables.  And is anyone going to try and alter the classification lights so that they change from green to red when changing direction?  Or is this something we'll have to live with?

Steve

DaveJfr0,

I like your idea of changing them to white LEDs.   I like your blog too; lots of good information there.

Steve