LC+ Rio Grande RS3 Issues (microstuttering / buzz/humming / shell shaking / slow moving)

Is this a new engine? it appears it's had some very rough handling having nicks on the roof. It could have jolted a wire harness connector loose or a truck/drive gear misalignment. Worst case, the main board is bad.

Hi Carl,

Thanks for the reply, it is, I think I'm going to return it, it's definitely not performing like it should out-of-the-box. With the shipping expense it will cost to repair it, I'm going to buy stuff now on only from Train World in person. From production problems to shipping problems,  to returns / exchanges and paying for return shipping (I find that only ModelTrainStuff is the only dealer that pays for return shipping, but I didn't buy them from them since they were out-of-stock,) it's better in person, even if you're stuck paying taxes on it.

I would get a RA from Lionel, give them a chance to fix.

Since the RS3 is considered a road switcher, is it geared for lower speed more torque? My LC+ AA FT's are fast. A lot faster than my conventional FT's. 

Thanks, I did, I just emailed them earlier this morning, as I just got the replacement truck from Lionel for an out-of-the-box wheel set issue; I'm very impressed with their warranty service. Still waiting on MTH support for another issue, it's been 7 days already and my concern is if they don't get back to me soon, I'll lose my exchange window with the store and be forced to use MTH warranty service.

I know what you're saying, but I'm not sure they did that for the LC+ Switcher Locomotives particularly to match their real world functioning, based on  the premise that all my steamers from them are capable of VERY fast, completely unrealistic speed. The only difference between the switcher and my steamers is that the diesel has dual motors and the steamer, I think, a single motor.

Let me preface by saying this is just conjecture based on my experience, and the only way to know for sure would be to have a tech knowledgable in LionChief engines take a look...

That said, it sounds like there is something binding up in the drive train.  The electronics in a LC+ engine will try to maintain speed, and they adjust the speed by very quickly (hundreds of times per second) turning the motor on and off.  Normally the motor freely spins between pulses of power, coasting along at low speeds with very little power applied.  If the motor is jammed up, However, the electronics would have to apply a lot of power to get the motor turning, then when it switches off would sense the motor slowing, much quicker than it should, and slam on the power again.  In essence you'd have an effect similar to driving a car with the parking brake set.  Full throttle to get moving and jerking to a stop when you let off the gas.  With this happening many times every second it translates into a shaking of the engine... and excessive ware on the motor and electronics.  

I would start by checking that the gear-box was reassembled correctly and that the motor can spin freely.  With the shell off, observe the motor for vibration and jerkiness with the drivetrain fully assembled, then test again with the motor removed from the truck to see if it moves smoothly.  You could have a bent shaft on the motor, or some other problem in the truck that is binding things up.  

JGL

JohnGaltLine posted:

Let me preface by saying this is just conjecture based on my experience, and the only way to know for sure would be to have a tech knowledgable in LionChief engines take a look...

That said, it sounds like there is something binding up in the drive train.  The electronics in a LC+ engine will try to maintain speed, and they adjust the speed by very quickly (hundreds of times per second) turning the motor on and off.  Normally the motor freely spins between pulses of power, coasting along at low speeds with very little power applied.  If the motor is jammed up, However, the electronics would have to apply a lot of power to get the motor turning, then when it switches off would sense the motor slowing, much quicker than it should, and slam on the power again.  In essence you'd have an effect similar to driving a car with the parking brake set.  Full throttle to get moving and jerking to a stop when you let off the gas.  With this happening many times every second it translates into a shaking of the engine... and excessive ware on the motor and electronics.  

I would start by checking that the gear-box was reassembled correctly and that the motor can spin freely.  With the shell off, observe the motor for vibration and jerkiness with the drivetrain fully assembled, then test again with the motor removed from the truck to see if it moves smoothly.  You could have a bent shaft on the motor, or some other problem in the truck that is binding things up.  

JGL

Hi John,

Thank you for taking to the time to describe what looks like my exact situation. Now my concern is now that I've test ran it for 1 hour in each direction, FWD/RVS, I was potentially doing damage to all the parts involved; if that's the case, I think I will return it and get a new one. I would take it apart, but since it's new and I'm new at this hobby, my concern is that I'll do more harm than good, and if I do harm, then I'm out of luck in terms of a return / warranty service.

I thinking maybe mine was used? I ordered it NIB, but why I say that is because it has nicks on top of the cab cab, and the gears were already greased (outside, to the side of the wheels) I know MTH and other LC's don't come pre-greased on the outside gears next to the wheelset, so I was a little thrown off by that. I sent Lionel a email yesterday asking them does it come pre-greased.

Thanks again John, I really appreciate your description of what just could be the issue I'm having with it. Now that's 4 issues in row on all new items This LC+ , and ....

2. Lionel B unit that arc on the center rail sent power over the coupler (tape fixes that -- please see attachments)

3. MTH Christmas Locomotive that intermittently also does the same on the electro-coupler and smells like ozone in the front cab (and now the whole basement) when in reverse pulling a single car consist,

4. Another MTH Locomotive that I haven't tried yet because I was first working on the MTH Locomotive, but that issue is cosmetic so far, with the railings having been popped out and scratched, haven't ran it on the track yet.

Here's an aside note from the main topic of my previous post here, on #4 above, the smoke unit wont turn off -- I looked at this thread, that didn't work: https://ogrforum.com/t...53#70974704583177353 . I tried both clock and counterclockwise to turn it off, but the smoke unit remains on. I'm just going to exchange this one. This was a to relax/de-stress in a hobby, but I'm really finding it counter productive to that goal, I'm finding work more relaxing and model trains very stressful, magnified, when you pay full price for a product and have send it in for work on the first few days of use...I kinda expect maintenance and other issues after a few years of running or buying used, but not out-of-the-box, esp. at the rate I've been having

BUT, I have to mention that I appreciate everyone here because the help and insights I get here have been very thoughtful and friendly, which keeps me going when I feel I just want to give up.

Hi John, hate to bug you, but I exchanged the Rio Grande for another new one, and this time the LC+ stutters on startup/slow speed, but moves / pulls fine at semi-moderate speed. I'm going to try to remove the shell and see if I can find any binding. Would you know with the LC+ RS-3's are they difficult to reassemble?

Here's a video of the issue:

Hi everyone, following-up on this this, could any let me know if this could be the issue and if this is something a novice could repair?

Snippet to Lionel Email CS:

"I think I found the issue, it's with the Axle I think. I have a MTH RS-3 diesel which the wheelset moves left to right correctly which I'm basing my idea on.

On picture 20170221_163458.jpg, I can't push one axle left/right, it has no lateral motion slack, so I assume the wheel is binding against the frame. The other axle on the same truck does have slack. This also happens on the other truck. One axle has left-to-right slack, and the other doesn't.

Picture 20170221_163511.jpg, it shows lateral movement/slack (with a slight gap between the wheel/frame which the other axle has barely any gap and can't move left/right)"

Thanks!