Lionel Announces Merger Between The Lionel Railroaders Club and the LCCA

9 times out of 10, the Lionel store sells at MSRP.  and with the newly grossly inflated MSRP's, 10% discount doesn't even get you to the price-points where the big dealers are selling.   Then there's sales tax and what has historically been hefty shipping premiums much higher than the typical shipping costs charged by dealers.

So the 10% benefit doesn't work out to be too much of a benefit upon a closer look at the numbers.  Just sayin...

David

"check on current dual memberships."

I'm assuming they will simply extend the memberships of those who are currently dual members.  Remains to be seen, but anything less will be ill received.  Both LCCA and Lionel have been reasonably responsive to consumer needs/preferences in recent years, so if anyone is worrying about this, I'd be reassured by the integrity of the leadership of these two organizations.

Pretty much true. I mentioned it since it is one of the 4 benefits mentioned on the LRRC web page on the Lionel web site. A benefit is a benefit, so I didn't want to leave it out.

So TCA's permanent toy train museum and archive of literature and photos have no value?

Thanks for the reply to my question about the benefits of belonging to the LCCA.

I don't think I will participate in the "my club is better than your club" dialog.

The various clubs service different, but overlapping groups.

Over the past thirty years I've belonged to the LCCA and LRRC at various times.
I also belonged to the TTOS for a while.

The only organization that I belonged to for the entire time was the TCA. So I guess the TCA is the best organization for me.

The first sentence tells it like it truly is. Lou Caponi was a human dynamo as he gave everything attempting to make LCCA the first class organization that it is today. I honestly think that LCCA will create a tinplate car in his memory.

TrainHead,

"Merge TCA with NMRA" you say? I don't think so. Not now or even in the future. The mission of TCA when it was formed covered one thing, tinplate toy trains. As the mission states before it was watered down time and time again until you you get the paragraph of mumbo-jumbo it is today.

The folks at NMRA are good at what they do. Their standards apply to scale train operation. Let me ask you this. What parts of tinplate toy trains meet prototypical standards. The 700e & 763 are in no way tinplate toy trains. Never been and never will be.                                                                                                                                                

The LRRC has been flailing around for years. Just look at the amazing turnover of its staff over the last few years. Almost every issue has a new editor. I believe this merger is a positive move for the LCCA because they gain (initially) a bunch of new members. Whether they can keep them on-board after the merger is the real question.

This is good news!!

After not being a member of the LCCA for the past few years, as of this morning, I rejoined. I always loved the Lion Roars Magazines and special offers. My favorite is my Halloween Set!

(emphasis added is mine)

I'll not pretend I was active for many years with LRRC, but the one year I did join for a very specific "exclusive" item, the actions by Lionel that followed soured me on ever renewing my membership, so I never did.

I was (still am if they ever make another item) a big fan of the Heritage sets that started with the Best Friend of Charleston and concluded with the DeWitt Clinton set (normal production) or Lincoln Funeral Train (topic of this post, supposedly a LRRC "exclusive").

So the story with the LFT was that it was to be the next set in this series.  When announced, you had to be a member of LRRC to buy one.  No dealers were supposedly going to receive any. 

The LFT was not a low price offering my any means, it was higher than most LCCA offerings (all? - my LCCA history is not stellar).  The engine and tender with one car was $800, the add on pack of 2 cars was $300 (Prices are rounded and to the best of my recollection.  I'm probably off by a penny, nickel, or a dollar on each).

As I was a fan of the series and wanted to continue my collection, I purchased one main set and 2 add on sets from the LRRC directly.  So $1400 plus tax since I'm unfortunate enough to live in one of the 6 states where Lionel collects sales tax.

As many are aware, Lionel did not seemingly get  the demand they had hoped for this set.  As a result, they were blown out to big dealers and then were available at significant discount at the larger dealers.  So we went from "exclusive" to "I just paid a significant premium of several hundred dollars for no benefit".

That made me decide I would never join LRRC again. It's one thing if you see an item command low resale value due to not being popular in the market, it's quite another when it plays out like this.

I understand they did a similar thing with the red Pennsy steamer with passenger cars (may have been called the "Red Arrow set") a year or so later.

I'll admit I never did get into the LCCA in the past, I'm not saying I won't ever.  I am just in a mode of not looking for new "themes" to collect.

I do agree the LRRC Christmas cars were generally very attractive.  I purchased the car the year of the LFT, and I have one earlier one I bought off a dealer's table at York that I really like (I forget the year, but it was the one with a picture of blown glass ornaments on a tree - very nice colors).

-Dave

With these products as with many others, anticipating demand when investing the upfront tooling costs is an inexact science.  So there's almost always the possibility of too many being made, and they languish in stores or warehouses, and eventually are

"blown out."  Howard Hitchcock has been quite clear that he doesn't want this to happen with the higher end products and hence the "build to order" approach.  I'm guessing even that won't prevent occasional times when you pay to be sure to get a product, and it then appears at some dealers for much less.  Just the way of the world, retail wise.  May not feel good, but it's not personal, it's business.

It only happens with Lionel simply because to some fans when the price rises they mistakenly associate the Lionel name with increased collecter value rather then current availability. Its a given it will always adjust downward with future releases. 

Today, nothing Lionel imports is collectable, not special or limited runs, not anything..

As you said.. its a business... Buy it if you like it and never look at future valuations.  

Joe

Joe

because they gain (initially) a bunch of new members. Whether they can keep them on-board after the merger is the real question.

Yep, that will be interesting if the LRRC member will be required to fork over a few more bucks to be in the LCCA. And for LCCA members, will they be required to chip in a few more bucks to get the LRRC publications. Lots of questions for the LCCA.

What might make sense and cents is to add a LRRC type section to the LCCA "The Lion Roars."  Not two publications.  Lionel wants to get out of that business.  They'll provide some content, but the editor of the "The Lion Roars" will put it together.  The LRRC membership will go up in price, but there will be much more in the way of benefits.  Those benefits which were, as I understand it, restricted to the quarterly very brief newsletter, Lionel catalogs and a discount on Lionel website purchases. 

The LCCA adds a much more substantial newsletter, published more frequently, the buy/sell capability and their website/videos/discounts, additional custom items for purchase, the annual convention, the dozens of national special events,  and other stuff that will be worth an additional $15 a year (for the paper based membership). 

I'm assuming the $25 a year electronic membership will be pretty appealing to LRRC members if they're budget constrained.  Only $5 more a year for substantial additional written material/product availability.

Unless this is somehow mishandled, it's hard to see how anyone could be annoyed or lose anything of substance, or even complain about the price .  Lionel will probably continue to make the catalogs available free or at minimal cost to all LCCA members, as I believe they now do.  I wouldn't  be surprised if Lionel provides a subsidy to LCCA to take on this responsibility, which would be a reasonable thing to do.

To LRRC Members - Greetings from the LCCA

The members of the LRRC will be joining the LCCA.  Here are answers to some of the questions and concerns of the current LRRC members; as plans continue to be finalized.  First and foremost, welcome to the Lionel Collectors Club of America (LCCA)!  The goal and LCCA club motto is “A lifetime of happiness collecting Lionel Trains.”  We hope all of you will enjoy your experience with the LCCA, become an active member and achieve a “lifetime of happiness” with Lionel Trains and the LCCA.

We in the LCCA believe the 7-24-2014 announcement made by Lionel President Howard Hitchcock (Read Press Release) is a win-win, win-win situation.  LRRC members, LCCA members, Lionel and the LCCA will all win and everyone will benefit from this new arrangement.  Current LRRC Members will receive more member benefits, additional value and enhanced membership experiences.  Lionel will be able to work closer together with just one club and be more efficient and focused.  All LCCA members (old and new) will receive the 10%  discount on purchases made on the Lionel website, plus benefit from the closer and stronger relationship with Lionel.  The LCCA club will become a larger club and be able to work closer with the team at Lionel to promote and foster an interest in Lionel trains.  We plan to continue providing our members with more new and desirable product club offerings and Lionel cars in the future.     

Lionel has sent out an e-mail, issued public announcements and posted on their website this announcement to the all of the LRRC members.  (Lionel plans to send written communication via US mail with all current LRRC members in the near future).  All current LRRC members will  enjoy an LCCA Regular Membership (RM’s) through at least year end 2014.  Depending on renewal date, LRRC members will have the option to continue on with their membership in the LCCA and renew as a Regular member (RM), or if your are under the age of 18 years as a LCCA Junior Membership (JM), or if you prefer, you can change your membership to our new LCCA Electronic Membership (EM).  More information will be provided in the weeks ahead.  Stay tuned to our website www.lionelcollector.org for updated and most current information.

If you are currently a member of both the LCCA and LRRC, upon the completion of your LRRC membership term, you will experience a cost savings while maintaining the same benefits at a reduced cost.  Additional information will follow as soon as they are available. 

I believe the best reason for being a member of the LCCA is to have FUN!  The Lionel Collectors Club of America (LCCA) has something of interest for the new entry level novice as well as the most serious toy train collector or the operators.  This club can be enjoyed by everyone no matter what level of involvement you prefer.   

For those of you not familiar with the Lionel Collectors Club of America, the LCCA is a not-for-profit, volunteer organization with thousands of men, women and children who have an interest in Lionel trains.  Founded in 1970 by Jim Gates of Perry IA, LCCA members live all around the world, but predominantly in the United States. The purpose of the club is to promote and foster an interest in Lionel trains specifically and toy trains in general and have fun while doing it. If you have an interest in Lionel Trains, this club is a fun organization to belong to. We provide our members with award winning publications, exclusive video productions, an outstanding Website www.lionelcollectors.org, and Facebook accounts (Both for Regular Members (RM) RM Facebook and Junior Members (JM)) JM Facebook as well as an opportunity to purchase limited edition LCCA train products made by Lionel exclusively for our members.  Additional information will follow with details about the numerous benefits for belonging to the LCCA.

If you are a current LRRC member and you have questions or concerns, you can contact me by calling my cell phone 248-709-4137 or via e-mail at agkolis@comcast.net.  We welcome you and invite you to attend and participate in our club activities.  Maybe, you can even host an LCCA Special Event.

We welcome you into the LCCA and know you will find the club to be worthwhile and fun for you.  If you have any questions or need more information please contact me at 248-709-4137 or agkolis@comcast.net.  Our business office is always available at office@lionelcollectors.org

Sincerely,

Al Kolis

President Elect & Special Events Manager

Lionel Collectors Club of America

248-709-4137

agkolis@comcast.net

Al

Thanks for the info and warm welcome.  I just joined the LRRC about 2 weeks ago and this was quite a surprise.  I'm looking forward to seeing what the LCCA has to offer and perhaps what I as a member can give back.

Thanks

Marty Eibeck

Former LRRC member and New LCCA member.

I just renewed by LRRC membership in June and already am a member of the LCCA.  Did I just pay for something I already have?  BigRail

Bigrail,

We will have to check with Lionel to see if they already processed your renewal.  Please send me your contact information an we can investigate with Lionel and get back with you. Thank you.

Al Kolis

President Elect & Special Events Manager

Lionel Collectors Club of America

agkolis@comcast.net

248 709-4137

Here are a couple of points of clarification for my post above:

- All current LRRC Member questions  and correspondence should be sent directly to Lionel.

-  All current LCCA Members will not be eligible to receive the 10% discount on Lionel Website Purchases until sometime after the transition becomes effective.

Please stand by for official communications from the LRRC and  LCCA in the near future.

best regards

Al Kolis

President Elect & Special Events Manager

Lionel Collectors Club Of America

248 709-4137

agkolis@comcast.net

Just my two cents worth, The LCCA is a wonderful organization who do many good and fun things throughout the toy train world. For those who question that please take the time to visit the club web site. As for the LRRC, I belong to that as well and their club offerings have always been well worth the membership fee.

What I see coming out of all of this is much more face time for Lionel and some very cool club offerings. Another plus for we the hobbyist will be ever closer ties with the big L so we can have their ear about products and services.

I too feel that many clubs need to merge in order to better serve the hobby. I would not wont to see the TCA and LCCA merge because the mission statement are different, but continuing down the path of cooperation that we have enjoyed over the past ten years would be a good thing. 

I was an LRRC member since 1987 and joined for the catalogs and inside track issues.

They did get off track at times with the transitions of management but I do have every issue. 

The only reason I did not renew was how long it took to get the new catalogs and Inside Track started to be more of a detailed sales tool than anything Inside Lionel to me anyways.

I beleive this can only be a plus for LRRC members and LCCA members in a whole !

I look forward to future announcements !!

Doug

Ok...this is getting comical.  After renewing my LRRC membership last month, I am now getting notifications to renew my LCCA membership.  I think I will skip this one and see how this shakes out.  BigRail

I presume you are both members of TCA, and know of what you type?  Did anyone ever teach either of you how to praise one club without demeaning another.  Many hold dual memberships in TCA and LCCA, so the previous AARP quip is totally a farce.  Not to mention that Lou Caponi was instrumental BEHIND THE SCENES in TCA for most of his life!  Just printing some facts...not trying to expose anyone. Ron B.

Will LRRC finish the 50th Ann. Set with a cool loco?  Maybe an 0-4-0 Switcher...with a pullmor?  Something we haven't seen over and over.

I have always been a member of LRRC just as an "automatic" action on my part as a Lionel collector.  They could send a 1 page newsletter with an ad on it and I would keep it along with the others.  

This doesn't mean Lionel can't start some other marketing club....they do it with the model car side of the business. I personally wish Lionel would either dump the online store or offer special items through it.  Right now its mainly the stuff we don't want and full MSRP.

I'm sure the organizations will compensate those in some manner for making duplicate renewals. I too renewed LRRC in April thru 11/2015 and LCCA yesterday through 10/2015.  

As a member, is there any way I can request which catalogs I want? I believe the  it is a big waste to send me a tin plate catalog when I do not collect tin plate. I want to save money and paper for Lionel and the club.

The LCCA does not do the actual mailing of the catalogs.  I believe it is is all or none at this time.   Any questions, please call me at 248 709-4137.

Al Kolis

President

Lionel Collectors Club of America

I love the LCCA and was proud to buy their beautiful Goliath and matching passenger cars from Lou at the TCA's York meet.  I was similarly proud to operate my Goliath set on the SGMA layout at Trainfest 2014 in Milwaukee.  I just wish that the LCCA would now offer for sale a matching Goliath baggage car.  You can see my LCCA Goliath in operation again this year at Trainfest 2015 or watch it at 3:20 into this Trainfest 2014 video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...amp;feature=youtu.be

I also love the LRRC, TCA, LOTS, NMRA and any other organization that supports O gauge and/or Standard Gauge model trains.  Unfortunately, while the NMRA does currently have O gauge standards, it doesn't have standards for Standard Gauge so I'm not as big a fan of that organization as I might be.  Now if they simply adopted SGMA's standards for Standard Gauge, that would be a very positive step. 

Bob Nelson 

My italics... emphasis added.

Bob, I endorse your request 1,000%.  I would love to see the typical 4th car add-on as a baggage car.  I recall the late Lou Caponi mentioning that would be highly unlikely, but never received an explanation for that comment.

Al, perhaps now that a couple of years have transpired, the LCCA could re-visit producing an add-on car for the Goliath sets.  I'm sure all 50 Goliath owners would gladly purchase them. 

David

David,

i will check into this.  Give me some time   thank you.

al K. 

Al,

I would buy a Goliath baggage car in a heartbeat.  That said, a combination car (or baggage/RPO car) might be a better choice particularly if the car included an operating mailbag feature.  By that I mean the car would come with a clip-on mailbag retriever/catcher, lead mailbags, and a mailbag hanger, which would be positioned next to the mainline track to hang mailbag for the combo car's mailbag catcher to retrieve.  Conceptually, this feature would be just like the mailbag system made for American Flyer Standard Gauge combination cars and would greatly increase the "play value" for these cars particularly if additional mailbag hangers could be bought separately to allow positioning them along the full length of the mainline.  In operation the system would work exactly like the AF system which closely duplicates the original system seen in the following video:

http://postalmuseum.si.edu/rms/life/mail.html

Bob Nelson