Lionel Niagara Driveshaft Part II

Norton: Thanks for the info on the driveshaft couplings-good to know. 

I have another question about changing the gearbox gears that Lionel just came up with; do you need to remove any drivers to access the gearbox itself, or can the two gears be changed by splitting the gearbox halves  while still installed on the axel?

Thanks for any info you can provide.

You don't have remove the wheels but removing the gearbox is a real PITA. This engine is put together like no other engine I have worked on including brass engines. The boiler is split horizontally and both halves have to be removed from the frame to get to a screw that holds the gearbox bracket in place. This involves removing about 90% of the screws that hold the engine together.

Pete

Can you give me some info on the replacement gears...   I've about this problem and seldom run my Niagara because of it.  

john@attorneynagurney.com

Hi Pete 

great work!!! 

I couldn't agree with you more, if your replacing the original gears with the new Brass gears, it's a must to replace the original plastic driveshaft with a Metal one. I hope I can get to the three Niagara's I have here soon !!!   

Alex 

Pete,

Nice post. Here's my checklist:

bronze gears, new drive shaft, (needs to be shortened), chuffer bd., new apron

Just waiting for it to break. Maybe I'll try 100 of Tom's TOFC's at RIT!

john in western pa posted:

Can you give me some info on the replacement gears...   I've about this problem and seldom run my Niagara because of it.  

john@attorneynagurney.com

I mean no disrespect but I have to ask.   Either you are new to the forum or have you been living under a rock?  

Do a search for the first thread Norton speaks of.  It's like a million pages long.  Also this has been going on for years and all the info about this fix is there.

Thanks guys. 

John, check out this thread for posts from Mike Reagan, forum name Mikado. He shows the part number for the new gears.

https://ogrforum.com/t...d-drive-shaft?page=8

Gary, my post that is closed is referenced above about the Stock Drive Parts driveshaft I did a few years ago before I discovered the metal U joints for a fraction of the cost.

Jim, 100 TOFC would be a feat. Might have to double head to pull those.

I am aiming for 50 Pacemaker Boxcars just like the prototype did back in the day.

Pete

Norton posted:

Thanks guys. 

John, check out this thread for posts from Mike Reagan, forum name Mikado. He shows the part number for the new gears.

https://ogrforum.com/t...d-drive-shaft?page=8

Gary, my post that is closed is referenced above about the Stock Drive Parts driveshaft I did a few years ago before I discovered the metal U joints for a fraction of the cost.

Jim, 100 TOFC would be a feat. Might have to double head to pull those.

I am aiming for 50 Pacemaker Boxcars just like the prototype did back in the day.

Pete

Last I heard your at 44 pacemakers but Tom sold you two, so it looks like your short four! I can bring four of my measly six!

I am up to 47 including the sound car I got at Syracuse. I think between all of us in the club we are well over 100.

Pete

Yesterday I had a chance to run my Niagara with its new gears and driveshaft on the club layout. Due to the relatively short staging yard I was only able to pull 24 Pacemaker cars. Ran for about 45 minutes with no glitches, probably a good break in run. I am not sure the engine will pull double that as hoped but am sure it will be able to handle many more as it showed no signs of straining with this.

I tried taking a video of the train but never got it in focus. The crowd looking on is clear though.

Pete

Good morning

I also wanted to duplicate that photo (above) with my Niagara, then upon looking a little closer its really a Mohawk and 100 cars

Good eye Clem. We have a few Mohawks on the roster too.

Pete

Cant wait until I get mine back on the rails. I have purchased and extra one an need to give it to Alex one of these days.

I have a Niagara, pulled it out of the box for the first time, and it ran over my 9x16 layout about 2 times before failure of the driveshaft.  My consist was  8  heavyweight  Pullmans.  The  easily found repair parts are on the way thanks to this thread, including the new bronze gears. 

off to the locomotive surgery bench I go, 

cheers,

Ed

Good to see this thread up again.  I also replaced the U joints with same as Norton shows in the opening pics.  It failed as I was pulling consist of 12 NYC heavyweights, mix of Lionel and MTH 18" cars.  I acquired new gears from NWS back in 2015, but have not installed yet as the original have not failed..... yet.....   And, knowing what it requires to changed the gears, I am in hopes they never do!

Jesse    TCA   12-68275

I'm the guy that got NWSL to make the gears for the Niagara. Had to pay set up fees to get the job done. After talking to Dave at NWSL he said that bronze gears would work, and he would make them for me if that's what I wanted. But, he went on to say that they would be noisy. Plus the delrin gears he makes are guaranteed for life. I have a reasonable amount of loyalty to Lionel, since that's the only brand I own. But Lionel left us all hung out to dry for sixteen years on this gear problem, and only came out with replacement gears AFTER NWSL offered them. Now that I have crawled out from under the bus, I have learned a lesson about Lionel. When they saw the money might be going some place else, they stepped in to "help". Say/think what you want. I now can adjust the clutch on a bus.

Well said Dukeofnuke.

it’s a shame Lionel ignored its loyal customers when this gear failure issue became a wide spread problem. I sometimes wonder if the Niagara gear debacle was one of the reasons Mike left Lionel. I’m pretty sure Mike had to drag management kicking and screaming along the way in his effort to do the right thing for those of us who spent close to $1K for this engine.

And thanks again  to Alex for being available for us who are not skilled enough to make the gear and U joint repair.

Take care,

Richard

Greywulf4570 posted:

I have a Niagara, pulled it out of the box for the first time, and it ran over my 9x16 layout about 2 times before failure of the driveshaft.  My consist was  8  heavyweight  Pullmans.  The  easily found repair parts are on the way thanks to this thread, including the new bronze gears. 

off to the locomotive surgery bench I go, 

cheers,

Ed

Do you think these things failed during production testing? Do they actually test them as customers would use them? Having an engine running in a circle is much different than one pulling a consist, even without grade changes.

The cars Lionel came out with were five milk cars and a caboose. Not sure if you can run that caboose at 18 volts or not. I ran mine with eight scale heavyweight Lionel Vanderbilt cars.  The gears went south on the second lap around the layout. Close to a thousand dollars for a shelf queen, and then leave the customer hung out to dry for sixteen years sounds like a good deal to me. Then again, I want to get back onto the turnip truck. Beautiful engine, no testing, no customer support. All repaired now. Runs great!

Now collecting all nine of the milk cars. I notice that Lionel mentioned the gearbox was "redesigned" on the Niagara reissue. What more could you ask for?  Almost forgot, it's double the price. Time to put this topic to rest.