McKeen Car in O Scale

Even a simple one with fixed doors would be fine with me.

Would you make a trailer, too?

What kind of pricing are you projecting?

Madison,

The McKeen car although very cool, does not fit into my roster, but I wanted to say that your attempt to save and restore the original car is very admirable.

I hope that I am wrong, but my opinion is that for 2k, folks would probably expect brass not plastic.

Having fixed doors might lower the price a bit.  Hopefully the price of 3D printing will come down in the near future., allowing the car to be sold at a lower price and still make sure money for your project.

Jim 

Overland or somebody made this in brass, 2 rail, with a shortie 20-30'? RPO/baggage

trailer which I think was used by the Southern Pacific.  I have not seen photos of a trailer as long as 68'.  What did it cost (selling price) per each for the 3rd Rail Budd cars, in brass and then again in plastic, and for the 3rd Rail Pa. gas electric?  Should be comparable to those costs/prices.  Wonder what the original "Overland" version,

not so long ago, sold for?  Lots of cost analysis required to see what is feasible: 

working doors, non-working, etc. etc., to make sure you don't take a bath, but that

is priced so you can actually sell out of a run of them.  I would demand commitments

and deposits, when you get that far.  (MTH did not get enough commitments)

Madison,

Perhaps HO is a better market for the McKeen car?

HO is a much larger segment of the hobby than O gauge.  And, if you are going to 3-D print the car, would only take 1/8 the material to print. I wonder if there would be the possibility to use an existing frame and motor from another HO model?

Jim

I know you have a lot invested in the McKeen car.

do you have any O gauge trains?

please consider joining one or more of the clubs listed below.

feel free to show up and check us out.

when you turn 18 if you join the san digeo 3 railers you can  run what you own on our layout.  lots of fun for low cost.

when you turn 18 if you join the all gauge toy train association when we put up the modular layout you can run what you own.  lots of fun for even lower cost but less time as the modular layout only gets put up a few times a year.

in the mean time you are welcome to be my guest at the san digeo 3-railers any Tuesday except free Tuesday.  I or someone will share a line with you.

Well, in addition to Ken Kidder, there was an expensive brass O scale, two rail Mckeen

car imported.  I will have to look for the ad tomorrow, but there are O scalers on this

forum that are aware of that, and probably own one.  It could be bought, as I remember, with and without that shortie trailer, and lettered for the SP.  With the

price and a needed machine shop conversion to three rail, not much hope in it.

The most accurate model I've seen so far was done my master machinist Cal Tinkham in 1 1/2 inch scale.  It is just a wonderful model.  Russ

You might consider contacting Scott Mann at 3rd Rail.  With your reseach and knowledge of the McKeen cars and with Scott's network of builders in the Far East, the two of you could produce them in brass for a low production run (50 to 150 models) or in ABS for a larger run.

Jan

Who cares if he's 16? He is and will continue to be an asset to this O gauge hobby.It appears this young man has lots to offer. Suggestion to put him in touch with Scott Mann is a good one and hopefully someone will mentor him. Best of luck.

Dave G.

I'm trying to figure out how to contact him, I believe I just found out he owns "3rd Rail."  But I can't find a website, any help?

Madison,

Here is a link to 3rd Rail, http://www.3rdrail.com

Sunset and 3rd Rail is the same company.  They also make passenger cars under the Golden Gate Depot name.

Jim

It would seem very plausible actually to 3D print these.  The body shells and interior details could certainly be done, door that could be applied to be made to function, etc.  In fact, I think that you could even make the truck components as well using brass and ball bearing inserts for the bearings.  Might be able to get Q-car or NWSL components to power it, too.

The O scale trolley world right now is already producing full shell models by 3D printing that are for sale right now through Shapeways and the prices are not all that high for a shell.  The only issue here is that while these look excellent, the surface is still slightly pebbled from the 3D printing process.  It becomes a decision point component when weighing price vs. desire vs. acceptability.  A good price can compensate for a lot for a lot of people.

I'd actually be interested in this if you were to pursue such a project and I would suggest that you follow the lead from the trolley guys on this as well since that pathway forward seems to be working.

On the prior brass imports, Kidder did these in O , S, and HO.  I've seen the shorter O scale one from Kidder a few time and only once the full size longer model.  Not cheap.

Precision Scale did them as well.  These tend to require a visit to your loan officer before approaching them too closely.

Yes, I have seen and gotten outbid in a live auction on the Kidder short version, and have flyers, found this morning, for the Precision Scale version showing a model of a

Virginia and Truckee Mckeen, and a 31 foot Southern Pacific baggage trailer.  I would

jump on a 3rd Rail version (who is NOT hard to find..they sponsor this forum!)  I did

not buy their gas electric because it was one road specific, but McKeens look like

McKeens, and, if road specific, only slightly so.

Another thought...HO ones are relatively common, in brass, as is everything else

unique. I have passed up several chances to buy them in shows.  (never looked for HO on the bay)  Certainly much more so than Kidder or PSC O scale versions, so, be different, do it in O scale.

Friend of mine has one of the HO ones - Kidder.

I would buy one, but you need to have a scale 54 or 60-foot short car because my layout and many others cannot run cars over this length. So consider one 13 to 14 inch long McKeen car.

A generic version with a headlight on each end, 2 classification lanterns in front, 2 red marker lanterns in back, and flag holders in front is all of the details I would ask for. Headlights should be directional.

LEDs for all lighting.

Plastic body with a metal frame.

Use existing MTH or Lionel trucks.

The small ports holes make see passengers difficult, so any interiror passenger details. Include a motorman.

Couplers front and rear.

Traction tires on one truck. Use tires already available from MTH or Lionel. Do not include spare tires to avoid cost.

Maroon in color with no road name or car number.

DCS PS2 or PS3 control.

Generic motor sounds, braking sounds and traction type whistle sound. No cab chatter.

Price for the short version should be no more than $250.

Keep packaging plain and without graphics to avoid cost.

Online downloadable instruction sheet. Do not include a printed sheet to avoid cost.

Well, this one was 30 bucks, and it runs. Wood. Bought it at a train show.

Now, don't get me wrong - this is an "arts and crafts" representation of one - it's even

over-scale; I bought it as a curiosity, but $2000 is not going to fly, or even taxi down the runway (boy, mixing metaphors all over the place, here).

McKeen cars are mostly curiosities; I like them because they are endearingly Jules Verne

ugly, but I would not pay much for one, even the MTH price. If RMT comes out with a downsized McKeen for $199, I'll jump.

However, I do very much admire your imagination and creativity. Keep it up. 

I recently completed an assessment of the collection of a long time O scaler in the Baltimore area who passed away several months ago.

Included in the collection is a brass McKeen car custom painted in PRR livery. This is a very nice model and appears to be of the quality of PSC / OMI / Kidder. I am not sure who imported it but will guess it is a PSC model. It is a shorter car - perhaps 60-70 feet in length.

MWB:

If you have any interest contact me or RRJJF.If you don't have our contact info John Dunn does.

I would agree with some of the list above, since McKeen's were available in 55'

lengths, but maybe even the biggest hassle beyond body forming in scratch building

these is that front truck (and I don't know if the rear truck has been made by truck

sources, past and present, either).   I could build one, except for that front truck...

I might be able to cobble up the rear one out of a coach truck or something.  But

without that front truck, it is not a Mckeen but a caricature.  To save money, make

it conventional, and let the people who do add electronics to a lot of rolling stock, do

that, or have it done.  Unfortunately, $250 may or may not get you a 3-D printed

shell...but hey, I'll take a shell.  To get that price we are going to have to resurrect

Ken Kidder, or maybe Louis Marx.

I have already designed the trucks, I just have to make them work for model use since they were designed like the real ones.  I can have these printed.  My Scale 70' McKeen Car can fit around 036 track, although it doesn't look nice, it works, I am thinking about printing a 55' o scale for myself, as to have a nice model of the Cuyamaca for display. 

I will work on the idea some more and come back, If you guys have any more comments feel free.

Looking forward to seeing these available for purchase through Shapeways or something similar in the future.   Please do post/announce their availability when ready.

I'd also be interested in seeing some of the McKeen freaight cars, too!

Those truck drawings look good!  Uh, McKeen freight cars?  I was imagining a 1/43rd model of that "blimp on wheels" McKeen bus shown in a photo outside the Omaha McKeen plant, but freight cars I am unaware of?

One outta ten ain't bad, for 1906.  You have done your homework.  I had seen photos

of that switcher before, but not the box cars.  Wonder if the switcher was distillate

fueled like the McKeen rail cars?  My books here just address the rail cars.

FWIW, PCS imported a McKeen car and optional trailer years ago.  A nice model with a few minor flaws and a crappy drive.  We've dealt with redoing the drives and we now have the correct flywheel & drivers cast up.

All in all, a fairly nice model.

Jay