I am considering adding an AA pair of Menards F Units to my railroad. Can Menards F Units be run with MTH's DCS or Lionel's TMCC in lieu of the Menards' controller?
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@Bobby Ogage posted:I am considering adding an AA pair of Menards F Units to my railroad. Can Menards F Units be run with MTH's DCS or Lionel's TMCC in lieu of the Menards' controller?
They cannot.
Menards needs to change this.
@jim sutter posted:Menards needs to change this.
Never going to happen. No way Menards is going to get the electronics from Lionel or MTH, and even if they could the cost of the Menards engines would skyrocket. There's also ERR, but the cost of adding that would also wipe out whatever advantage exists in the relatively low purchase price of the Menards units, which is really the only advantage they have.
They could set them to run in conventional mode as an option.
It's reasonable to remove Menard's electronics and replace them with an electronic E unit and horn. The motor design is similar to that of a Williams locomotive.
Their market is not really targeting "modellers" - but I wouldn't be mad if they added bluetooth/app control or another form of upgrade path.
For entry level engines from a building supply store.....not likely.
A option for better command control would be to upgrade them with Lionchief/Bluetooth boards. A pair of matched boards would give you full CC of them with the Cab3 or LC app. Just have to wire the motor outputs on the trailing A so that it started in reverse.
Bob
I don’t know why people keep missing, or forgetting, the fact that Menards’ approach is the same as Lionel initiated with its LionChief line (not LionChief Plus) years ago — an approach that doesn’t exclude operations on any layouts.
The idea for both companies is that people could use an ultra-simple power source (a wall wart) to run a train with a dedicated remote. Or you could substitute your own typical AC transformer and set the power level as you would for DCS or TMCC and use the locomotive’s remote.
So, yes, anyone who has a layout utilizing TMCC or DCS circuitry can operate a Menards locomotive, but not with the controllers themselves.
I have run virtually all my trains (LionChief, LionChief Plus, LionChief Plus 2.0, Lionel TMCC/Legacy, MTH original ProtoSounds/PS2/PS3, Williams conventional, K-Line conventional, etc.) on my home layout in conventional mode or on the club layout (conventionally, TMCC and DCS).
Personally, I prefer the versatility of LionChief Plus, but given the limited locomotive line that Menards has produced so far, the use of a dedicated remote isn’t a dealbreaker, especially at the low price.
I just purchased a PRR AA F-3 from Menards and I run it with my ZW and the controller they provided. It's a snap, I didn't require any changes what so ever to my layout, jut turn on the ZW, run up the voltage, and take command with the controller. It works great and controls everything, speed, horn, bell, voice, from anywhere on the layout. The performance is terrific, it keeps its speed regardless of how slow I set it with the control. By the way, I can still simultaneously run my (isolated) other loop with conventional use of the ZW.
Given Menards with sell you the powered A alone (i.e. you don't need to buy the separately priced non-powered A) for about $175 all up with controller compared to modern locomotives for $1000's its very hard for me to not be enthusiastic.
Don
@Don McErlean posted:Given Menards with sell you the powered A alone (i.e. you don't need to buy the separately priced non-powered A) for about $175 all up with controller compared to modern locomotives for $1000's its very hard for me to not be enthusiastic.
As long as you are willing to live with the limitations of the Menard's diesels, they're certainly not a bad option.
I'm not sure how Menard's manages to keep them running at a constant speed with one remote setting, they clearly don't have cruise control. As they're running along slowly, grab the engine and stall it. If it has cruise control, you'll see the transformer current go up significantly and feel the much greater torque as the engine tries to maintain speed. I did that to I believe the second beta unit, and it just stopped patiently waiting for me to let go. I doubt they've added cruise since them.
@gunrunnerjohn - John I have no illusion that they incorporate a "cruise control" My layout is pretty flat and not very extensive so I was just reporting their performance as I observe it. I have no "modern" locomotives except the Menards and compared with most of my post war F-3's they are remarkably consistent in speed and can throttle down to much lower speeds.
Don
No doubt that the Menard's F3's compare favorably with PW F3's. For a flat layout and not too large a consist, I'm sure that the Menard's perform just fine.
I read all the posts about the electronics, their plusses and minuses, and the problems that turn up with them. I spent a lifetime fixing electronic stuff, so its intersting to me, but I do not participate in this part of the hobby. I do have a couple modern Lionel and MTH locos that can jump through hoops, slice bread, and make Mom's apple pie, but, I am just as exited to find a beat up old Lionel B&O 225 with 2 position E unit, clean, fix it and watch it pull freight around the loop, and that is why the Menards locos are an attractive option to me.
The Menards remote works very well on a TMCC, DCS or other system or conventional layout. The remote has better range then many Lionel blue tooth remote control from the phone. It is a simple basic engine entry level for families to get into the hobby. As mentioned if you wanted a fancier control system you could swap a board for your choice system in. By why? it works well with the included remote, has a volume switch for the sounds on the remote a great feature, on off switch for the engine sounds under the engine and lots of various crew talk dialogues. The lights work great forward or reverse on off.
I would note I have 2 Menards engines from last year, 1 has been used for hundreds of hours at our garden railway for the kids to control; has been working well, had to remove 1 gear that wore out from extensive use, but engine still runs well on 3 powered axles. I bought 2 of the latest releases of the Menards engines and found that both have jack rabbit starts and stops hard to control, at 22 volts they start at about 16 mph compared to an MTH Engine. The older units have a lot of momentum built in to the electronics so they start and stop slowly. If I run them at about 6-7 volts then they do not start as fast.
It’s amazing how a simple question morphs.
My only issues with Menards are finding parts and customer service when ordering by mail. I am trying to decide whether to sell my UP beta F units or keep them due to parts.
@MartyE posted:It’s amazing how a simple question morphs.
I agree Marty. You answered the posters question on the 1st reply.
To my knowledge all the remotes are interchangeable (at least all of them are on mine)
John
