Need source for oddball motor

If you can find a double shafted motor on the bay, swapping the nylon gears with some superglue should work.  G

Have you contacted Frank Timko?  You could email a photo to the mfr in HongKong. 

 

I assume you've exhausted google.  I've had some luck lately following google to an images page, and then clicking on what looks like I want.

This is a current Lionel G-gauge dual shaft motor. It goes for $20.00+S&H:

 

8185104521 DC MOTOR / DUAL SHAFT / RS385SH / NO HARDWARE

 

You might have to shorten the shafts a bit, but it should work.

 

 

http://www.gee-gttmotor.com/Ou...GCR336DP_NP_4159.pdf

 

Len, do you know that's the same size? 

 

Obviously, the set isn't worth enough to get something like a Timko motor for it. 

Perhaps the motor can be sourced from the supplier. Worth an e-mail.

 

Larry

Can you pull off the left gear?  Looks like the can is held by tabs you can bend out.  Might get lucky by peeking inside.

I needed two motors for a project. A company sold motors I needed but the were $50!!

So I started looking on ebay. It took a few days on and off of refining my search but I found the exact motors....and they were $8 a pair from China!!! Many sellers on ebay post a spec sheet of some type that gives you all you need to find a replacement. (motor size, shaft size etc)

Stan, I thought of pulling it apart, but I suspect the chances of success are pretty low.

 

I'll take another look on eBay Dave, I just didn't want to spend hours on the search, but it seems I already have!

 

I have done some searches for motors, and normally the manuf sites, or those distributors are looking for orders in the 1000s.  They don't sell individually.

 

So, ebay or the thrift store like shops that buy out obsolete or excess stock are the way to find odd ball motors.  I usually search via the model number, or via a size.  It is hit or miss.

 

I guess the easiest method would have been to e-mail Lionel with the product #, if they had the part they would let you know, even if it wasn't something listed on their website.  G

That is the easiest method, and also one I tried.

 

My Lionel parts guide(76-90?) shows a similar motor in the 0-4-0, 4-4-2 etc. Here are the part numbers:

 

All large scale engines

18-5104-576 0-4-0

18-5102-576 4-4-2

18-5102-576 4-4-2 w/Railsounds

818-5120-576 Thomas the Tank

 

Because of the 576 being the same in all engines, I figure it is the same motor. Hope this helps, maybe you can find a donor engine.

 

The problem with working on stuff is all the time it takes to find things you need!  

True. But even if you can't fix it, you might be able to measure the resistance of one of the armature windings which would help you choose a substitute.  I don't know if it's worth $20 to gamble on the Lionel motor but you might find someone who will measure the terminal resistance for you.  Len's post suggests it's an RS385SH which of course has a boatload of variants.

 

Out of curiousity how does the static terminal resistance vary around 1 revolution?

Any idea of rpm@x volts you need? shaft dia, & what dia of the motor body is. Can any dimensions be fudged to find one. Ive used the Mabuchi site to find a replacement number using good guesses & data supplied, but don't know if they have individual sales through site, found one at a local hobby shop, now gone.

 

They don't give dimensions for it, but when I was still doing repairs I found most of the Lionel G-gauge motors of that type had similar diameters and lengths. What mainly varied was the length of the shafts on the motors..

 

Similar to almost all of the O-gauge starter set motors. Same basic motor with different shaft lengths and gear types, e.g., spur or worm.

 

 

I believe the basic specs of the motor are here. This is the series that the motor was developed from, just with dual shafts. Probably based upon the -14280 motor with the 12volt constant nominal voltage.

 

Larry

Well, I actually do need the motor with the dual shafts.

 

I'll give Lionel one more call and throw in the towel.

 

Here is a picture of the 18-5104-576 dual shaft motor used on the older Large Scale locomotives, as documented by pennsydave, courtesy Brasseur trains.

 

Larry

Since I don't have the parts guide, do you have the part number of the motor?

The worms appear smaller on that one, I'd sure like to know it works before I order one.

 

John,

 

I believe the motors were Mabuchi  RS-385 SH. The different part numbers are for motor with gears, without gears and single shaft with gears and dual shaft with and without. I have  818-5104-521 that are large scale. I use them to replace motors in O scale, I just cut down the shaft. The 818's that I have, have a 1 1/2'' can, 1" dia. and 3 1/4 shaft end to end.

Bill,

 

This motor is 1 1/4" long, 1" in diameter, and 2 3/4" total length to the ends of the shafts.

 

The shafts are .090" in diameter, and the gear is .350 in diameter.  The gear pitch appears to be about .090".

 

Since the place the motor fits is pretty fixed, there's no way the wrong length or diameter are going to fit.  If I had the right size double-shaft motor, I could try to remove the gears from this one.

John,  Those are the motor numbers that I posted.  The Thomas the Tank motor is vertical the other two were horizontal.  Those were the numbers right next to the name of the parts on the diagrams.  The Thomas Tank engine was number 818 5120-001 but the motor with gears is 818 5120-576.  

Thanks, the missing 8 in the first part numbers confused me.

 

I don't think the motor John showed is a RS-385?  He could certainly compare it to one of the MTH versions of the 385 series, or take measurements.   G

Bob, the one I have is 1.080 in diameter and 1.3" long exclusive of the bearing projections.  That one looks close, are the shafts .090 in diameter?

George, if you look back a couple of posts, I did post all the measurements.

John I know you did, I was trying to be diplomatic at point out the motor you need is not a 385.  Lionel G gauge use bigger motors, I think the Christmas express while G gauge is the cheap toy train.  That motor is more like the starter set motors just a little bigger.

 

I think some of those blow out stores have the G Scale PE for about $30 now.  I wouldn't be surprised if it is the same motor you need.   

 

I also noticed Lionel sold most of that G stock to the web based company.  You may try them.  Lima I think.   G

I knew the motor wasn't the 385, it's the wrong size.  Besides, it's a GEE motor, a company I had never heard of before I ran across this one.   However, if the 385 would fit, I'd consider giving it a go.

 

Yes, it's a cheap plastic train, they just want it to run.

 

The parts went to North Lima Train Works but I haven't gotten a reply from them to my query about the motor.

 

A suggestion for what it's worth. If money were no object, and the chances of finding a suitable replacement are low, then possibly you can locate a club or individual in the electric RC car racing hobby. They may be able to rewind the armature for you. They do it for their cars.

 

Larry

Well, money IS an object, that's part of the problem.

 

Lots of companies use the same model # as a standard for can size now.  If you have a Premier MTH diesel you have a 385 motor  So you can measure it and compare to the stock motor for dia and length.  The 365 is also a possibility since it is shorter in height.  Shafts can be cut to fit need.  The 5 motors are 5 pole, if you got a 380 it would be a 3 pole so there are alternatives in those sizes also. G

 

I am sure you have a bad 385 in the junk bin to test fit.  G

There is a whole engine and tender that works with couplers on Ebay for $20 buy it now.  G

Under what category?  I looked in G-gauge locomotives and I didn't find anything that matches that description.

John,

  I threw the 8185104521 motor on the present Lionel parts order. Should be here next week.  Harry

It'll be interesting to see if I can cram that in there.

 

I typed in Lionel Christmas express I believe.  G

So, gunrunnerjohn, did the motor work? I have the same set and all the lights and engine sounds work fine but the motor doesn't do anything. Just curious as anyone I've spoken with has said there are no replacement parts to be had.

Nope, I finally threw in the towel and called it dead.

 

Yours may not be the motor, it could be the board.  I fixed the board, only to find out the motor was really why the board went bad.