NYC Classics

Dave,

If I understand your question the current Grand Central Terminal was completed in 1913. Grand Central Depot, which preceded the Terminal was completed in 1871. It was rennovated (enlarged) in 1898 but it did not expand the train capacity and the increase in traffic volume had created a need for more tracks. This need for more tracks, and the requirement to electrify  the tracks coming into Grand Central as a result of the 1902 train crash in the Park Avenue tunnel,  were major factors in the planing and construction of the current Grand Central Terminal. I believe construction began shortly after the city granted the New York Central certain subsurface rights in 1903.

The "Thoroughest of the Thoroughbreds!!!" The J3a 'Super Hudsons' and paraphrasing Al Staufer's book on all of the New York Central Hudsons entitled "Thoroughbreds."

NYC Fan - it looks like you have plenty of switching opportunities on your layout but in the off chance you might want to do something else with all of those M.D.T reefers you could set up a siding for Eastman Kodak.  According to the book The Snowflaker by Kachler, Eastman Kodak loaded  5 to 10 of these cars with film destined for Hollywood every day back in the 1940's and 50's.

@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:

That is beautiful. I know that from listening to the History Channel that the original building Vanderbilt was huge. Thing is I can't remember when the original building was rebuilt to what was refurbished in recent times. Do you know Skip?

This particular photo could not have been taken before late 1912/early 1913.  A photo taken in September 1911 shows the steelwork.  Completing the façade up to where that photo was taken was another year of work.  The official completion and opening of the station was in 1913.   Various parts of the station were opened between 1906 and 1913.

For an accurate history of GCT, see Grand Central, The Wolrd's Greatest Railway Terminal by William D. Middleton in 1977.

Figured I would take some time after yesterday chopping a branch that was nearly separated from the rest of the cedar tree causing mowing problems. I figured today was a good break day. Only thing I did that required any effort was seasoning up some pork chops, drumsticks, and steak. After that, popped into the living room to run 1924 Mogul. Added some smoke fluid in there to get some nice smoke going(on a white background it is hard to see).

@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:

Figured I would take some time after yesterday chopping a branch that was nearly separated from the rest of the cedar tree causing mowing problems. I figured today was a good break day. Only thing I did that required any effort was seasoning up some pork chops, drumsticks, and steak. After that, popped into the living room to run 1924 Mogul. Added some smoke fluid in there to get some nice smoke going(on a white background it is hard to see).

Great little engine. If and when they make a Legacy NYC Mogul, I'm in!!!

@NYC Fan posted:

Great little engine. If and when they make a Legacy NYC Mogul, I'm in!!!

As long as it isn't like the last batch though some fixes were made to only a few. Rest ended up in the scrap heap(the Legacy Mogul fiasco of a few years ago that is)

@Robert S. Butler posted:

NYC Fan - it looks like you have plenty of switching opportunities on your layout but in the off chance you might want to do something else with all of those M.D.T reefers you could set up a siding for Eastman Kodak.  According to the book The Snowflaker by Kachler, Eastman Kodak loaded  5 to 10 of these cars with film destined for Hollywood every day back in the 1940's and 50's.

Hi Robert!  Would that have happened in Rochester, NY?

NYC Fan - yes, it did.  The cars for loading were always first sent to the M.D.T shops in East Rochester for cleaning and painting.  When the cars were painted they had to use paint approved by Kodak because the fumes from drying paint for some types of paint would fog the film.

  By the way, the book by Kachler is all about his experiences working for the NYC in Rochester.  It's a paperback in the shape of a standard magazine - there are about 85 pages of text and 15 pages of photographs.

@NYC Fan posted:

Hi Robert!  Would that have happened in Rochester, NY?

Movie film was always made in Rochester and may be last type of photographic film still made here. Still camera film is made elsewhere, where ????????

Pete

I do recall that in the 50's and 60's there was a Brand B, but I don't recall the name - wasn't seen much

I received this NYC 5344 (700E) last week as a gift from a good friend. The motor had some problems so I just replaced it with a good used original...here’s the first run !!!

HiYa, Bob @taycotrains-

I didn't comment on your original post about this 700E, but I can't resist commenting now. I was with your very "good friend" in Manhattan when he acquired this true Lionel classic a half-century or so ago. It's great to see it all these years later running as originally intended. Treasure it, and enjoy it. And you know what they say about keeping your friends close  . . .

Cheers,

- Mike

Pete - Kodak made both movie film and still camera film in Rochester.  In the case of 35mm film the only difference between the two is the final packaging. A quick check with Google indicates both are still made there.

@Mike Casatelli posted:

HiYa, Bob @taycotrains-

I didn't comment on your original post about this 700E, but I can't resist commenting now. I was with your very "good friend" in Manhattan when he acquired this true Lionel classic a half-century or so ago. It's great to see it all these years later running as originally intended. Treasure it, and enjoy it. And you know what they say about keeping your friends close  . . .

Cheers,

- Mike

Mike .....all I can say is “WOW” !!!

Our freind mentioned your name several times but I never put it together here on the forum...small world !!!

A NYC Classic for tail end Tuesday. J3a Hudson 5413 with PT Tender backing on to the turntable.

Nice backing on to the turntable Skip. Nice coaling tower in the background too. What one is that(the coaling tower that is)?

@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:

Nice backing on to the turntable Skip. Nice coaling tower in the background too. What one is that(the coaling tower that is)?

That is two Bachmann coaling towers kitbashed into one, with a few extra detail parts for the chutes and some external lights added.

Awesome Skip. Now that you have said that, I feel like this has been answered once before on another thread. Maybe it was on the "Let's see your coaling towers" thread. Still very cool. This way everyone who hasn't know before does now. Great detailing.

How about this NYC Classic I got delivered on Thursday? It has been years in the hunting for this lovely masterpiece and I managed to get lucky by making an offer to the seller on Ebay instead of going down to the wire on the auction. I am so pleased to finally get one of these that I have long been searching for. I remember seeing one I think in 2015 at my local train dealer on his shelf when I was just getting back into the hobby. I am so happy for everyone who has been pushing me to get after getting this set since it is one of the best Hudson's ever modeled(from what most have said).

Now since this upcoming weekend will be a free weekend, hopefully I can get to dedicate some time working on getting the treadmill tore up in the back bedroom(maybe on Sunday). Saturday I have plans to pop down to my local train store and put in my order for the new catalog. I am still thinking about some things in there and haven't quite decided on everything I want. I usually am a PITA on deciding some things as I like to know exactly what the piece is(mostly when it comes to rollings stock for what time period it is in). I try not to go past what year I want to model on these things(1949) but have probably made an exception or two that might not all be clear.

Anyway, here is my newest acquisition, the Lionel 50th Anniversary Hudson.

Beautiful - thanks for sharing, I didn't know about that one (a lot I don't know!).  Is it toscale?

@Chuck242 posted:

Beautiful - thanks for sharing, I didn't know about that one (a lot I don't know!).  Is it toscale?

Chuck, you need to look here.

https://ogrforum.com/topic/40849085922032922

This is a topic all about Hudson's from head to toe. I think someone had posted the link to me on another topic(maybe RickO, Pat, or Pete. Having seen that I copied the link and sent it to my email. All you ever want to know about modeled Hudson's(including this scale one) are there.

Also, Pete had sent me a link when I was talking to him about this one I was interested in. I don't know if it is still on ebay, but that one has the SS Diner. Have a look if you are interested, or maybe contact your local dealer(or friends) to see if one can be located. Given the nature of how many times I have seen this pop up on ebay or online stores, there is a good chance you could get one.

I think maybe on this topic, @RickO had posted or mentioned his. Have a look back to see if I'm right or wrong. Maybe Rick will pop a video of his since it is by far the best Hudson Lionel ever modeled.

@Chuck242 posted:

Beautiful - thanks for sharing, I didn't know about that one (a lot I don't know!).  Is it toscale?

That Hudson was part of  a 50TH Anniversary set which Dave has aquired.  Lionel only offered this set back in 2002:

http://www.lionel.com/products...t-loco-5344-6-31705/

Not as graceful out of the gate as the Legacy models, but this is the ONLY version which does not have the class lights on the smokebox front which is more accurate.

I'm not bothered by the occasional Oddyssey lurch common for locos this era. Besides, its a hudson, not a switcher.

Having said that a super solid running and IMO has one of the most robust sound packages Lionel has ever offered, along with possibly the best whistles. The Korean build quality, of locos this vintage is superb.

One day eventually, I may upgrade it to 4 chuffs and fan driven smoke. Even still, I have trouble not sidelining Legacy locos in favor of it.

I purchased the loco separately from a forum member.

Here it is at the beginning of this video pulling some K Line Pacemaker passenger cars:

@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:

How about this NYC Classic I got delivered on Thursday? It has been years in the hunting for this lovely masterpiece and I managed to get lucky by making an offer to the seller on Ebay instead of going down to the wire on the auction.

Anyway, here is my newest acquisition, the Lionel 50th Anniversary Hudson.

Congratulations Dave!  Enjoy!

Better late than never. On top of it between covid, and the market. These older J3a's are becoming much more scarce, and asking prices have nearly doubled.

Thanks Rick. It always great to get what you're after, especially when it is something as solid as this. I would only upgrade to 4 chuffs and smoke unit after I get some other projects out of the way.

That is a great set Dave. One thing that always puzzled me was Lionel's decision not to make the cars New York Central livery. I have never taken the Lionel Lines Madison Cars out of the box.

@NYC Fan posted:

That is a great set Dave. One thing that always puzzled me was Lionel's decision not to make the cars New York Central livery. I have never taken the Lionel Lines Madison Cars out of the box.

Yeah, it's one of those wacky decisions they did along with some other Lionel Lines things. Pete was telling me when we were talking about this set the other day that he prefers the Kline cars because they say New York Central on them. The cars are the same(I guess in almost everyway excluding who made them). Have the same names and everything. I got a bunch of NYC cars here and there including a set of MTH ones I picked up from Mr Muffin in 2019's October York. They're good cars, just won't run underneath the Christmas tree. All the more reason to get that back bedroom clear of stuff to build a layout in there

Harmon at twilight ( photographer unknown) ….mostly cause I suck at taking pictures,….🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Pat

@harmonyards posted:

Harmon at twilight ( photographer unknown) ….mostly cause I suck at taking pictures,….🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Pat

Must have been the great photographer Mathew Brady who got that Pat. Looks dang(I mean the other D-word) to me.

@harmonyards posted:

Harmon at twilight ( photographer unknown) ….mostly cause I suck at taking pictures,….🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Pat

I see a P&LE A-2a hiding there lower left.

Ron

Dave, thank you for sharing the Hudson history link.  Fascinating read, and I enjoyed it thoroughly.  I guess my postwar non-scale collection reign's King on my table because my first engine was a 2046 Hudson.  However my Dad used to tell me about the incredible 'scale' Hudson that Uncle Richie had in the 1940's, he said it was perfect down to the placement and number of rivets on the tender.  We held on to our trains and I am the current guardian of them (prewar, postwar and modern) ...but unfortunately, Uncle Richie was a distant relative, and that beauty is long gone.  My current layout handles 031 track, and a few recent acquisitions (the hobby shop was going out of business) have to be passed along because they are so large (#777 Vanderbilt is boxed; #793 does not have a tender; #773 with tender doesn't have a box either, but it has a crew in the cab..LOL).  Anybody interested just make a fair offer.  Lastly...what does the 'PT' in tender mean?  Thanks again for the history, photo, and great video's - OGR Forum is fantastic!  Be safe everybody, and thanks again.

@Chuck242 posted:

Dave, thank you for sharing the Hudson history link.  Fascinating read, and I enjoyed it thoroughly.  I guess my postwar non-scale collection reign's King on my table because my first engine was a 2046 Hudson.  However my Dad used to tell me about the incredible 'scale' Hudson that Uncle Richie had in the 1940's, he said it was perfect down to the placement and number of rivets on the tender.  We held on to our trains and I am the current guardian of them (prewar, postwar and modern) ...but unfortunately, Uncle Richie was a distant relative, and that beauty is long gone.  My current layout handles 031 track, and a few recent acquisitions (the hobby shop was going out of business) have to be passed along because they are so large (#777 Vanderbilt is boxed; #793 does not have a tender; #773 with tender doesn't have a box either, but it has a crew in the cab..LOL).  Anybody interested just make a fair offer.  Lastly...what does the 'PT' in tender mean?  Thanks again for the history, photo, and great video's - OGR Forum is fantastic!  Be safe everybody, and thanks again.

I have heard but was not able to back up is that PT stood for Passenger Tender. Regardless, it was the Central's term for the large pedestal tenders that also get called centipede tenders.  It's similar to the tenders carried by UP 844 or UP 4014.

@naresar posted:

I have heard but was not able to back up is that PT stood for Passenger Tender. Regardless, it was the Central's term for the large pedestal tenders that also get called centipede tenders.  It's similar to the tenders carried by UP 844 or UP 4014.

For fact the Central proper called them “passenger tenders” as that’s what they were originally designed to do, longer running passenger trains with fewer stops,…….the mainstay being to cut down the time from NY City to Chicago……

Pat

Classic NY Central 10 wheeler (Legacy) passenger train on inner loop and F3 (MTH PS3) oil tanker freight train on the outer loop:

@Chuck242 posted:

Dave, thank you for sharing the Hudson history link.  Fascinating read, and I enjoyed it thoroughly.  I guess my postwar non-scale collection reign's King on my table because my first engine was a 2046 Hudson.  However my Dad used to tell me about the incredible 'scale' Hudson that Uncle Richie had in the 1940's, he said it was perfect down to the placement and number of rivets on the tender.  We held on to our trains and I am the current guardian of them (prewar, postwar and modern) ...but unfortunately, Uncle Richie was a distant relative, and that beauty is long gone.  My current layout handles 031 track, and a few recent acquisitions (the hobby shop was going out of business) have to be passed along because they are so large (#777 Vanderbilt is boxed; #793 does not have a tender; #773 with tender doesn't have a box either, but it has a crew in the cab..LOL).  Anybody interested just make a fair offer.  Lastly...what does the 'PT' in tender mean?  Thanks again for the history, photo, and great video's - OGR Forum is fantastic!  Be safe everybody, and thanks again.

No problem, always great to pass that around. Always learn something. You never know about finding gems. Tony, my local dealer had the original 1937 700E until he sold it to someone who I think posted about it on the forum(a few years ago). Occasionally they show up, not sure how well. I think about 5 or 6 months ago there was a 763E from whatever year that was produced on Ebay.

Picked up a few more NYC Reefers yesterday - a 4-pack of NVOS (New Very Old Stock - 1999). They are really beautiful, and really heavy. According to the boxes, they are “Phenolic Cast Reefers” and there are little tags on the bottom that say they are made in Korea!!!

I actually just bought that caboose you were talking about earlier before I even saw this thread.  Great thread BTW.

Thanks,

John

https://ogrforum.com/...8#156701992354764158

Xplorer

There are 3 NYC steam locomotives that were made by MTH that I would like to see Lionel make with Legacy.

1. Dreyfuss J3a Hudson

2. L4 Mohawks

3 A2a Berkshire