PS2.0 battery replacements or BCR2?

The 9V batteries currently supplied are 8.4V NiMh batteries, they are a standard size and places like Harbor Freight sells them.  You can also get them from MTH.  The 3V batteries with the proper connector come from MTH, I don't know of any 3rd party source that has them with the connectors already properly assembled.

You could use BCR replacements for all of them if you plan on keeping the locomotives for a long time.  OTOH, for the 9V batteries, it's quite possible that some of those boards will fail before the next new rechargeable battery dies, so maybe just another battery is a better investment.  I've bought the 9V (8.4V NiMh) batteries from a mail-order place in the past for around $5/ea, and they've all worked properly and none have come back.

Paul, as to the small twin batteries, which are 2.4 volts.  MTH has used 3 sizes of these, 2 AA size, 2 AAA size, and 2 2/3AA size.  All these 3 are interchangeable.  The 2/3AA size is available from China for under $3 each, but doesn't have plugs:  you'd have to clip the wires on your current batteries and solder those plugs to these batteries.  Harbor Freight has a replacement for the 9-volt size (actually 8.4 volts) on sale; see another thread.

There are 2 styles of BCR, one for the 9-volt [8.4) style batteries, and another for the 2.4.  There are NOT interchangeable!  Do not alter plugs.

I agree with GRJ regarding the life expectancy of PS2 boards that use the 8.4 volt batteries

So for the 2.4V style, has the storage capacity technology reached the point where you can "stock" just the 2/3AA size thereby simplifying battery management?  I figure there are smaller engines where size (physical) matters in terms of fit.  For example, at the end of PS2 production, were all engines 2/3AA because the technology had improved over time to being equivalent to the original larger 2AA style?

Paul, I would make a list of either the ones that look like 9 volt batteries and the other ones that look like either AA or AAA size. Then call J & W Electronics (1-717) 417-2820 and place an order for what you need. I would also recommend that you purchase at least two more of each one in case you buy an engine in the future so you can replace the original MTH battery with the J & W Electronics BCR's. The guys in my club replace them as soon as I can get them, and no one has any problems with their engines from dead batteries.

For me,  the BCR is the only way to go.   But that is what I prefer,  many good opinions here.   I have a large amount of engines and only 1 12'x14' loop to run so in rotation,  they sit awhile,  sometimes for years.

To me,  it is no fun understanding if I want to run an engine after sitting for some period I will either have to charge or replace the battery before operating.   Now,  I simple put the train up and go.............   

There are two types of BCR available as others have stated.  If you buy in volume I have generally paid around $18 each in volume.   Batteries,  except when helping others,  are no longer thought about on my RR.

Mark

I have replaced all the batteries in my 15 PS-2 engines with BCRs.  I prefer not worrying about whether a battery is charged or not when I want to run an engine.  BCRs make life simple. 

Joe

Stan, I use the double AAA battery packs for replacements.  They have far more reserve than is needed for the purpose, and they're small enough to fit where other battery packs don't.

Stan, the 2/3AA are labeled 800 mah.  That is more than adequate.

You must do your own cost evaluation to compare the cost of BCR vs battery, considering life expectancy of you and the board, how often you run a loco, how long you expect to keep it, etc.  AT this time, no one has any real data on the life of a supercapacitor, which is a component of the BCR

I have found the AA size last 8-10 years, with locos getting used at least once a month.  For that reason, I would not dump the battery in a brand new loco and replace it with a BCR or supercap.  In another thread, GRJ has recommended charging a new battery or the battery in a new loco.

Note there is an ongoing thread, "rechargeable battery's" which is partially duplicating this.

Right. That stores more than 100 times the energy of the supercap described in the other thread.  I wanted to address the OP's question about managing multiple 2.4V types if he goes the battery route.  A one-size-fits-all device whether it be a battery or a supercap surely has some benefit that ought to have a place at the table.

Given the massive difference in stored energy between battery and supercap, I wonder if it's possible to go even smaller (1/3AAA or whatever they make).  I'm curious if anyone has purposely installed a smaller battery which might (re)charge to a useable voltage faster.  In other words, there's got to be some downside to storing away 100 times more energy than you need.  Just thinking out loud...

As I said Stan, the AAA packs are a lot small than the AA, and they are 700mah, plenty for this task.  You could probably go smaller, these were just convenient to order from MTH.  They're the same rating as the much larger AA NiCad packs.

RJR, when you say China, does that mean you can buy them at WalMart, or where else?

The old = original white 8.4 volt batteries seem like an easy replacement, just unplug and swap them out.

I am still not sure about the BCR2s.

Thanks, John, that's what I need for some small engines, and it helps to know I can order them directly from MTH.

i have also tried triple A's in one of my test engines, and it sit's a lot and has had no problems when i put it on the track. I just sit it non the track and just power up and let it charge before i start it up.

No Problems!!

Alan Mancus

Paul, I upgraded most all locos I had when the upgrade kits came out.  As a result, I have many which are hitting the 10-year old mark.  I ordered 8 2/3AA, 2.4 volt, 800 mah batteries from China, www.lightmalls.com, at $3 each, plus $4.84 shipping.  A picture of one is attached. For info, MTH has 2/3AA with the plug, 700 mah, of which I have 2 installed and work ok.  I forget the MTH price.

A few days after I ordered them, GRJ posted a reference to a Digikey supercap, of which I ordered 15, all of which I have installed.  My remaining locos have batteries about a year old or use 8.4 volt batteries.  So I will not be using these.  If you're interested, I'll sell you the eight for $20 plus $1 postage.  You will have to connect youre own plugs.  Best bet is to cut the plugs and wire leads off your shot batteries, and solder red to red and black to black, using heat shrink tubing.

Stan, I have on my workbench a very small flat Varta NiMH 200 mah battery, and can think of no reason why it would not be adequate.  I got it about a year ago for an upgrade project, not yet commenced, on a real tiny loco

The 2/3AA was used in some upgrade kits when they ran out of AA.  It is not a replacement for AAA, because of thickness.

The AAA are used in places where it requires a thinner battery.  You can't fit a 2/3AA in place of it.

BG-4000003 is the 2.4V NiCad AA

BG-4000004 is the 2.4V NiMh AAA

BG-4000005 is the 8.4V NiHm

BG-4000006 is the 2.4V NiHm AA

Some early PS-2 3V engines did use separate AA batteries in a battery holder.  You can use any 1.2V NiCad or NiHm AA inplace.  Just install 2 of them.  You can get these at the grocery store.  G

G

I agree, GGG, but the 2/3AA is valuable in a loco where the length of a AA presents problems.  I've some upgrades where space is tight and the 2/3AA can fit upright where the AA cannot.   I actually got several from MTH at York last October.

I've haven't found many places where the AAA pack won't fit.  For those couple of instances, I've put one of these in instead.  It that won't fit, you probably aren't going to get a battery into the unit.

I have one engine with a replacement board that a genuine BCR2 cured a lot of issues with. It was missing the watchdog signal for example and now it runs perfectly.

 I have another engine that I also installed the BCR2 inside. It wouldn't change it's stored address? There may have been problems with the board's charging circuit. I put another engines battery inside and it worked much better. It still does.

 I wouldn't claim that BCR's are the only way to go then. I believe it depends on how often you run your engines. I would choose on a case per case decision.

 I can see that for some users, the BCR would be the way to try. For ten years+ of use, many of mine still have the stock batteries.

Thanks for the information, everyone.

RJR, I honestly don't know what are the types of batteries you're describing and which engines they fit. To make it more confusing each engine manual indicates varying battery size and capacities. Your price seems very fair but I am all thumbs with soldering and connecting wires. Because it seems each steamer's battery compartment is different, with the A5 being very small, I think I'll order replacement batteries from MTH. That way, the clips will come already attached and hopefully they'll just drop right in.

Paul,

   I recommend the BCR when a battery finally needs replacing in any P2 Engine, some of mine have been in my engines for a very long time, no problems what so ever, I never worry about storing my engines now, I do not need to remove the BCR and they regenerate in 30 secs after being stored. The P3's actually have their own BCR built right into the Engines.  If you own any P1 engines the BCR is definitely a must.

PCRR/Dave

Paul, you can't go wrong with ordering the MTH batteries.  GGG has posted the part numbers.  In my opinion, and Pine Creek does disagree, the BCR price does not compare favorably with batteries.  Break even point is about 25-30 years, assuming the BCR holds up that long and you get same battery life you have gotten.

RJR,

   You are correct about the cost, they are way to much money, however after the original batteries fails, I replace all my P2 engines batteries with BCR's one at a time, keeping the cash out flow for batteries replacement spread out for years.  I never worry about pay back with my O gauge hobby, just quality longevity and proper running.  

PCRR/Dave