Pulling wheels, Legacy K4; FIXED (almost)

I'd suggest a conversation with Pat @harmonyards as to the technique and tools.  If anyone can point you in the right direction, he's the man.

I’ve designed a non-invasive fix for the Legacy K4’s and similar. To date, all reports from in the field have been 100% positive. I do not pull any wheels, nor mar anything up. The process is employing a brass bar stock with a half moon bushing brazed to the bar stock, positioned for self locking in the gear box, then retained by a screw to maintain the lock. Unfortunately, due to the variances I’ve seen in dimensional differences in the intermediate shaft, this is not a DIY project solution. I have to mill down the bushing for the proper amount of side clearance, so the installed bushing doesn’t act like a brake shoe. It’s a sneak up approach. If you wish to strip down the chassis, ( most techs and handy DIY guys do ) you can send the chassis off to me for the fix installation. You can contact me via profile for more details.

Pat

Hi Pat,

I read about your repair on this forum. I know it will fix the original problem of side to side movement of the worm wheel. This problem is different, as the entire bronze bearing on the right side of the “gear tower” was never installed. Apparently, this part is not (or never was,) available from Lionel. So I’ll have to make one. Lionel used to sell a complete frame for these, but are no longer available. (BTW, this is the back dated Warren G. Harding K4.) The only way I can see to install it is to remove the right center driver to gain access to where the bearing is supposed to reside.

@Robert Davis posted:

Hi Pat,

I read about your repair on this forum. I know it will fix the original problem of side to side movement of the worm wheel. This problem is different, as the entire bronze bearing on the right side of the “gear tower” was never installed. Apparently, this part is not (or never was,) available from Lionel. So I’ll have to make one. Lionel used to sell a complete frame for these, but are no longer available. (BTW, this is the back dated Warren G. Harding K4.) The only way I can see to install it is to remove the right center driver to gain access to where the bearing is supposed to reside.

Well that just sounds yummy, ……boy, these legacy gear boxes are just the gift that keeps on giving!…….If that’s the case, then you have no choice but to pull at least one wheel. If your puller doesn’t want to get behind the driver, I’d suggest getting a wheel puller from Paul Edwards Designs. ( PE Design Manufacturing )  His wheel puller requires a little bit of work to be used on modern locomotives, but once you get one, it’ll be self explanatory on what to do. The Timko puller is no longer available as far as I know with Frank’s sudden and very unexpected passing. I even made a set of jaws and hardened them for use with Paul’s puller,….we’ve been threatening to get together and make a commercially available set of jaws for modern engines, ……I can post a picture of my modified wheel puller jaws if need be,…..Also, be forewarned, Lionel’s overseas vendor barely if it all puts any splines on the axles anymore. Some I’ve seen have zero evidence of ever being staked to begin with. Makes re-quartering a real joy!……

Pat

If it’s no trouble, I would like to see a pic of your puller. Thanks!

I suppose when Pat is not busy and I send all 3 of my K4's, we may find a whole host of issues. I'm waiting for Pat to have more time and more money for myself as it is not just the K4'S. Mikados too boot. I sort of don't remember how many of those I have.

Hi guys, the disasters just keep coming. I think this thing came with a curse. Thanks to GRJ I got a new drive for this engine. Copied Pats fix to eliminate the gear slop, transferred everything to the new frame, re-assembled the engine, and it ran excellent! All functions worked properly. Then I noticed the stack was pushed up slightly, so I pulled it out, and it looked like everything was lined up right so I pushed it back in. When I fired it back up, I got an immediate short. Took it back apart, can’t find any pinched wires. Even with the boiler off and all the associated wires removed, it still shorts. I removed what I believe is the power connector ( with the grey, black, yellow, blue wires ) , short goes away, so I don’t think it’s a primary power problem. Any ideas? (Smoke unit is disconnected.) hopefully, there are pics. Never tried to send pics before, I hope I got it right.

Help!!

Bob

PS, smoke was not running at the time, and I plugged the black grey blue yellow connector into the board and removed the other end from the motor, still shorted.

@Robert Davis posted:

PS, smoke was not running at the time, and I plugged the black grey blue yellow connector into the board and removed the other end from the motor, still shorted.

If pulling the power leads to the RCMC don't clear the short, you're looking at power wiring and/or pickups.

Hi John, thanks for the reply. I assume the grey black yellow blue connector is for the primary power (pickup rollers). If I unplug it from the board the short clears. Plug it into the board, even unplugged from the motor, short returns. Bad board? What do they call this board if I have to order one?

Hi guys, got the paper weight running again! New RCMC did the trick. Everything is normal now, EXCEPT, the smoke volume seems unusually high, especially the whistle steam. Cannot get it to adjust with the remote. Since the problem seemed to start with the smoke unit, I assume I must have another problem there. Any ideas?

Thanks, Bob

@Robert Davis posted:

Hi guys, got the paper weight running again! New RCMC did the trick. Everything is normal now, EXCEPT, the smoke volume seems unusually high, especially the whistle steam. Cannot get it to adjust with the remote. Since the problem seemed to start with the smoke unit, I assume I must have another problem there. Any ideas?

First off, unplug the smoke unit from the board until you figure it out!!!

Check and see if the smoke resistor measures the correct 8 ohms.   Make sure none of the leads going to the smoke unit have any continuity to the frame.