Realistic Logging Locos

Perhaps trying to model something similar to this?

Alex

Living in the middle of one of the largest logging areas in the east.....I like to model logging. And I own a number of the Bachmann On30 locos. But almost ALL logging railroads in Pocahontas county were standard gauge. And many of the locos were larger Shays....so these are available though not cheap.  I ended up with a Lionel W&M #6 3 truck Shay model as I have ridden behind her so often. 

Trying to convert On30 to 3 rail standard gauge I do not see working.....the wheels would be way outside frames and just not look right to me. I'd look at the smaller locos offered by Lionel and MTH and make them into a logging type loco. The K-line 2 truck Shay is out there often 2nd hand.....about as small as you will get without going to brass fine scale 2 rail locos. 

Logging railroads in the Pacific Northwest were almost universally standard gauge too.  It is hard to haul 10 foot logs on 3 foot track. 

The Lionel and MTH three and four truck shays are based on 150 tonners, too large for most logging operations where 90 ton three truck shays were the Bulls of the Woods.

The K-Line/Lionel shay is not a 1:48 scale model.  Although based on a 60 ton two truck locomotive it is too large if scale fidelity is important to you.

That leaves the Lionel three truck 90 ton Heisler...

and the MTH 70 ton Climax. 

Both models are very well done.  The prototype for the MTH Climax is running today.

As I have recently commented on another thread, the manufacturers need to make the smaller geared locomotives so they will operate on 027/031 curves. I have several friends who want to add a logging operation to their layout, but the 042 curves are prohibitive.

win86 posted:

As I have recently commented on another thread, the manufacturers need to make the smaller geared locomotives so they will operate on 027/031 curves. I have several friends who want to add a logging operation to their layout, but the 042 curves are prohibitive.

This... is exactly what I've been saying for the last forever. Logging railroads aren't mainlines. These machines were made to follow pretty well the hastiest lines ever laid.

Thanks to all who agree.  I have thought the Heisler would be the cheapest to make in a small geared loco, as it has fewer exposed operating parts (and it is my favorite, anyway, as kind of an underdog).  Of course, many of the small and shortlived logging roads used tank engines, as shown above, and whatever cheap used power they could get.  The Big Two have both built tank engines, so a small geared loco, that might not have room for "all the bells and whistles", would be a no-brainer.

K-Line Porter?  I converted this one to TMCC & chuffing smoke, the electronics are in the coal car.

Gentlemen,

   I like the MTH 70 Ton Climax Engine (Hill Crest Lumber Co), where can I get one and are they P2?  Way cool looking engine.

PCRR/Dave

Yep, MTH has made them several times.  I have one of the earlier PS/2 ones, and I believe there is a PS/3 version as well.

MTH Climax Locomotives

I asked Mike/NTH about a O-27 Shay with a RailKing level of detail and price. 

He said he'd love to do one but the side rods make it impossible.  And after I bought a Lionel W&M #6 and saw how much movement is needed at O-72.....I can see the issue.  Maybe we could push for a Hiesler or Climax in O-27??

Gentlemen,

   Do any of our sponsors have the Hill Crest Lumber Co Engine in stock, or even the entire Train set?  Can't find one!

PCRR/Dave

Ted Hikel posted:

and the MTH 70 ton Climax. 

Both models are very well done.  The prototype for the MTH Climax is running today.

 

The problem with the MTH Climax is that it a model of ONLY that one engine. The steam dome was damaged in service and replaced with that horrible home made looking thing. MTH's choice to make this one is an odd one. 

gunrunnerjohn posted:

K-Line Porter?  I converted this one to TMCC & chuffing smoke, the electronics are in the coal car.

How did you wire it to be TMCC?

GRJ could wire your electric toothbrush for TMCC if you wanted it

But that K-line porter--also too big for scale--is a dandy way to have a small-radius, relatively inexpensive logging engine in O3R.

UPMav#488 posted:

gunrunnerjohn posted:

K-Line Porter?  I converted this one to TMCC & chuffing smoke, the electronics are in the coal car.

How did you wire it to be TMCC?

With some difficulty!   The Porter is a royal PITA to take apart, I can tell you that!  Since I put the electronics in the tender, I just had to wire everything in the locomotive to the tether.  Read all about it here.

K-Line Porter TMCC Conversion Project

Silver Lake posted:

 ...snip...  MTH's choice to make this one is an odd one. 

Maybe because it was readily available to be measured, photographed, and recorded for sound?

I have the MTH Climax, and since 99% of the people that see it have no idea that the steam dome is not "standard", it doesn't lose much in the change.

Since l am sitting here with the smallest, cheapest phone available, which will do everything but vote, and print, and l keep arguing with electronics stores that it should do the latter, and l think HO (to which I have not paid attention) has all this electronics stuff, l see no reason scale models of engines down to the double-hooded Mack could not be offered in O three rail, as well as two?  Way too much of this train marketing seems provincial, to the detriment of sales and lost opportunities.

Phones are manufactured on 99% automated equipment, and each production run at least 10,000 units, and more likely many times that.  The parts are dirt cheap, and for volume production, the unit assembly costs are also dirt cheap.

FWIW, HO does NOT have "all this stuff", and HO production quantities are way larger than O-gauge production.  2-Rail O-gauge production is even smaller...

You're comparing apples to oranges, model trains are puny production runs compared to any consumer electronic device.

AMCDave posted:

Living in the middle of one of the largest logging areas in the east.....I like to model logging. And I own a number of the Bachmann On30 locos. But almost ALL logging railroads in Pocahontas county were standard gauge. And many of the locos were larger Shays....so these are available though not cheap.  I ended up with a Lionel W&M #6 3 truck Shay model as I have ridden behind her so often. 

Trying to convert On30 to 3 rail standard gauge I do not see working.....the wheels would be way outside frames and just not look right to me. I'd look at the smaller locos offered by Lionel and MTH and make them into a logging type loco. The K-line 2 truck Shay is out there often 2nd hand.....about as small as you will get without going to brass fine scale 2 rail locos. 

I tried On30 for a while before making the jump from HO to O three rail.  I owned a Bachman Shay and Climax.  I agree with Dave, I don't think it would work well to try to put O gauge trucks on the On30 variety.  I sold my On30 engines and cars.  I bought the MTH PS2 version of the Western Maryland Shay #6.  It's big, three trucks.  I got a great price from a Forum member used, but barely used.  The prototype was built to haul coal off the mountain at Chaffee, Maryland just across the North Branch of the Potomac from West Virginia.  As Dave said, it fits in nice at Cass Scenic RR.  IT is a sweet locomotive!!  I can't wait to get it on my new layout I am just starting to build.  I do agree with Dave, one of the smaller logging locomotives would be a good way to go.  I bought this, because I am a WM fan.

GRJ missed my point...what l was saying is that O three rail could offer small, yes, tiny, scale sized engines, like they FINALLY did with the 44 tonner,  down to the Mack switcher, because the electronics, for those that want it on their trains, could be tiny AS in a phone.  So nonexistent electronic bulk is no excuse for refusal to offer small, scale, 3-rail engines.  I can get every prototype l want in HO, and, yes, in O scale brass....l have seen them in brass and O scale shows.  Danged nuisance to have to convert everything to three rail, and probably beyond my skills, not considering brass expense.

colorado hirailer posted:

Danged nuisance to have to convert everything to three rail, 

Well, there's a simple solution for this "problem".  

colorado hirailer posted:

GRJ missed my point...what l was saying is that O three rail could offer small, yes, tiny, scale sized engines, like they FINALLY did with the 44 tonner,  down to the Mack switcher, because the electronics, for those that want it on their trains, could be tiny AS in a phone.  So nonexistent electronic bulk is no excuse for refusal to offer small, scale, 3-rail engines.  I can get every prototype l want in HO, and, yes, in O scale brass....l have seen them in brass and O scale shows.  Danged nuisance to have to convert everything to three rail, and probably beyond my skills, not considering brass expense.

It costs nearly as much to get a little loco to market as a big one; cost of raw materials is not a big factor. It's the design, engineering, manufacturing, handling, marketing, repair...but most people won't spend Berkshire money on a small loco. The geared locos do seem to bring big bucks, even though they are small-ish, complicated and often fussy. Must be the weirdness.

Speaking of, not all logging locos were geared - many were rod engines, and there are some 3-rail items that could be customized.

ecd15 posted:

colorado hirailer posted:

Danged nuisance to have to convert everything to three rail, 

Well, there's a simple solution for this "problem".  

Yeah, and definitely the way to go if little equipment is all he wants, but if he wants to still also play in the mainline RR world, especially the steamy one, and still get his layout in something smaller than a barn, it's back to 3-rail. This is why I'm a 3RO'er. Otherwise....