That’s the reason I don’t order online stuff from them anymore. Two personal experiences and a few stories here on the forum.

Steve

@Michael Hokkanen  Have to laugh at the iron horse enthusiast - quite clever. Anything I've gotten from Menards has been store shipped where I picked up, Everything was in a cardboard box which would have survived shipping. Odd.   I have a package actively being lost by the USPS, Looks like they are up to their old games of losing packages. Have a notice they have it and no updates for a week. I am sure Menards will take proper care of you.

@RideTheRails  99% of what I have has been ordered on line. Can't imagine doing this hobby without auction houses, auction sites and various on-line purveyors. LHS is not so local for me. I have relatively few bad experiences, one I got a full refund and kept the engine, another was Atlas track damaged due to really poor packaging from the seller, the last was a sale shipped through USPS, I got a refund and 3 months later the buyer received the package - which ended up free to him.

Keep in mind that just because you insure a package above and beyond the initial $100 value, that the shipper will just fork over $500. You need to provide some documentation of worth, such as a bill of sale. For trains you bought 15 years ago, and are now selling, most sales receipts aren’t available. And, if you do have the sales slip, and the item has increased in value, you will be paid only what the sales receipt is for. And you won't see a penny until you do. A letter from a train/hobby shop owner, that explains how he vets his expertise, and why he considers what the lost item(s) is/are currently worth, will usually suffice.

@Mark V. Spadaro posted:

Keep in mind that just because you insure a package above and beyond the initial $100 value, that the shipper will just fork over $500. You need to provide some documentation of worth, such as a bill of sale.

Actually, in this case, they likely won't pay anything.  The caveat for shipping damage is the item has to be packed according to the shipper's requirements.  Few would even try to argue that wrapping an item in paper and slapping a label on it meet those requirements.

I'm a USPS carrier and I find it annoying how poorly some items are packed.  Some times the shipper just slaps a label on the package.  Also, some times things are obviously rattling around loose in a box. 

I purchased 2 reefers from a seller on Ebay recently.  They were in their boxes, but the 2 boxes were in a bigger box with nothing to prevent them from rattling around in the bigger box.  Fortunately nothing was broken.

Was this something ordered directly from Menard's or a private seller ? That should have been made clear in the original post.

If Menard's did it, okay - they deserve the criticism, but don't want to see them blamed if this was a secondary sale.

It was ordered directly from Menards.

One day down and I have not heard from them.

Menards ("Ray") has been outstanding replacing items that were broken in shipping or in factory packaging. They typically will ask for a photo and then make arrangements for you to either keep the item or send it back to them.

Business day 1 1/2. Got an email from Ray saying that they will send a new one. He said to keep the old one and use it any way that is suitable. Much appreciated. The only other time I had a problem with Menards is when I got an HO building instead of O. The quickly agreed to swap them paying postage for both.

FedEx recently changed their shipping requirement to all packages must be able to withstand a 4 ft drop.  Take a look at youtubes of shipping centers to see the abuse a package goes through.  If you actually look at the document you fill out at FedEx or UPS, it says, 'new boxes, minimum of 4 inches of shock absorbing material'  and they mean all 6 sides.  If you put the item in a box, and cover it with packing peanuts on 5 sides, and many commercial places that send stuff do this, you are asking for trouble.  If you use house foam insulation panels and cut it to fit, you might as well use sheets of plywood, that stuff has no give.  You want something that will allow what ever is in the box to have its sudden stop, like a drop from 4ft, to not have an immediate stop, but the packing to crush to take up the shock.  I always take pics of the packing process, if you have to make a claim they want you to prove you packed it properly, and pictures expedite that process.  My best denial of 'who done it' was a UPS retort that delivered a flat box with dual tire tracks across it that contained $2K Icom radio I had repaired and sent back the owner, and they said I did it.  They did finally pay, but they kept the flat radio.

My strangest shipping was about 5 years ago when I purchased a pair of Williams PRR BUDD-RDC Cars from a seller on a popular auction site. He wrapped each car individually in several padded USPS priority mail envelopes and packed them both into a padded USPS priority mail envelope. Then shipped them just like that via USPS Priority Mail.  After more than 30 minutes of carefully cutting the tape and unwrapping them to my shock, there was not a bit of damage and both units were ex plus lol. I was at least broken trim pieces. I bet the sellers ears were smoking as I was unwrapping them lol. I never gave it a thought to take photos of the surgery.

Insurance against damage is knocking on the door to useless for most shipment methods.  Only in extreme cases will they pay for damage.  Usually, they just say "not packed properly" and deny the claim.

I had a problem with a brass locomotive.  It was packed in the manufacturer's shipping box and then padded all around with 2" of Styrofoam in a larger box.  FedEx said it wasn't packed correctly.

@CALNNC posted:

FedEx recently changed their shipping requirement to all packages must be able to withstand a 4 ft drop...  If you actually look at the document you fill out at FedEx or UPS, it says, 'new boxes, minimum of 4 inches of shock absorbing material'  and they mean all 6 sides.  If you put the item in a box, and cover it with packing peanuts on 5 sides, and many commercial places that send stuff do this, you are asking for trouble.  If you use house foam insulation panels and cut it to fit, you might as well use sheets of plywood, that stuff has no give.  You want something that will allow what ever is in the box to have its sudden stop, like a drop from 4ft, to not have an immediate stop, but the packing to crush to take up the shock....

This is an excellent description of how to pack. I've never understood why so often  the merchandise is placed in the bottom of the carton with zero cushioning underneath.

Hmm - MTH Engines ship in a hard foam enclosure, surrounding by thin cardboard, and then in a card board box, Have to assume their shipping packages are designed to handle a 4 foot drop. ???

Some package delivery drivers like to put deliveries in the front of our garage door rather than on the porch. After backing out the car and crushing a whole bunch of cat food cans one day, I learned to always check behind our cars before pulling them out of the garage. Otherwise, I would have many flattened engines and cars by now.

@Bruce Brown posted:

Some package delivery drivers like to put deliveries in the front of our garage door rather than on the porch. After backing out the car and crushing a whole bunch of cat food cans one day, I learned to always check behind our cars before pulling them out of the garage. Otherwise, I would have many flattened engines and cars by now.

I did the same. I backed over a shipment of peanuts. Good thing it wasn't a train. If you create a fedex and ups account. You can tell them where to leave your packages. I did this a year or so ago and have had no problems getting them to use my front porch only.

Brad

@Bruce Brown posted:

Some package delivery drivers like to put deliveries in the front of our garage door rather than on the porch....

I have a 100ft gravel drive and a circle at the end.  for light packages, especially in bubble envelopes, both FedEx and UPS drivers are like paper boys, they toss it out of the truck onto the porch as they go around the circle.  Nothing delivered like that has ever arrived broken though.

@Bruce Brown posted:

Some package delivery drivers like to put deliveries in the front of our garage door rather than on the porch. After backing out the car and crushing a whole bunch of cat food cans one day, I learned to always check behind our cars before pulling them out of the garage. Otherwise, I would have many flattened engines and cars by now.

Yep, both UPS and FedEx frequently lean packages against the garage door.  When you open the door, the package falls across the sill of the doorway.  When you close the door, it comes down on the package!

That's if you don't run over the package first!

@ScoutingDad posted:

Hmm - MTH Engines ship in a hard foam enclosure, surrounding by thin cardboard, and then in a card board box, Have to assume their shipping packages are designed to handle a 4 foot drop. ???

That is a puzzle, why they don't arrive damaged.  There is nothing really loose in them that would move on impact and break off, and they are quite tight in their cocoon, maybe that is the issue, they are inherently safe.   I did ship a large item in its original cocoon, and original box, outwardly it was a solid aluminum box, but within were many things installed on standoffs.  FedEx dropped it, and inside the unit, every single component on a plastic or ceramic standoff was snapped off.  FedEx initially said it was not packed properly, but my pics showing an undamaged box, and the receiving ends pics of the deeply flattened corner,  got my 600 bucks back, but they only refunded half of the cost of shipping.  Some of the problems are generated by crooked folks that send damaged goods and then claim the shipper broke them,  I learned this when sending a large item, and the pack and ship place notified me that if they pack and ship it, if anything goes wrong, I will immediately receive a refund, and they deal with the shipper.  There is some kind of inherent understanding that these pack and ship places have with commercial shippers that they know what they are doing, but to be honest, some of the worst packing jobs I have seen have come from such places.

@Gene H posted:

My strangest shipping was about 5 years ago when I purchased a pair of Williams PRR BUDD-RDC Cars from a seller on a popular auction site. He wrapped each car individually in several padded USPS priority mail envelopes and packed them both into a padded USPS priority mail envelope. Then shipped them just like that via USPS Priority Mail.  After more than 30 minutes of carefully cutting the tape and unwrapping them to my shock, there was not a bit of damage and both units were ex plus lol. I was at least broken trim pieces. I bet the sellers ears were smoking as I was unwrapping them lol. I never gave it a thought to take photos of the surgery.

I had one like that   One of my recent chrome tankers sourced via ebay arrived inside a pair of Priority Mail bubble mailers packing-taped end-to-end to make a longer envelope. By some miracle the box wasn't even dented.

---PCJ

Several years ago I sent some packages via UPS. I took them to the UPS Store and had THEM PACK THE TRAINS. When they got there they were all damaged. Luckily the went to Gary Schrader who was able to fix all the damage. I no longer use UPS for shipping. I have NEVER had a problem with USPS. That is who I use now.

@B rad posted:

I did the same. I backed over a shipment of peanuts. Good thing it wasn't a train. If you create a fedex and ups account. You can tell them where to leave your packages. I did this a year or so ago and have had no problems getting them to use my front porch only.

Brad

I use both the UPS and FedEx APPs to hold packages at a local access point rather than leaving them outside the house if no one will be home.

In my experience the quality of the packing has been the crucial variable, rather than the identity of the carrier. I always pack trains for shipment myself and nothing I have packed has ever arrived damaged, regardless of the carrier (FedEx, UPS, or USPS).  This includes delicate and heavy O-scale models.

@B Smith posted:

In my experience the quality of the packing has been the crucial variable, rather than the identity of the carrier. I always pack trains for shipment myself and nothing I have packed has ever arrived damaged, regardless of the carrier (FedEx, UPS, or USPS).  This includes delicate and heavy O-scale models.

So you're telling us, even if we pack better than the OEM packaging it's our fault that it gets damaged in shipping?

No, that is not a logical deduction from what I said.

@RailRide posted:

I had one like that   One of my recent chrome tankers sourced via ebay arrived inside a pair of Priority Mail bubble mailers packing-taped end-to-end to make a longer envelope. By some miracle the box wasn't even dented.

---PCJ

Mine were packed without no original box or packaging. Not a bit of damage. We might have bought from the same seller lol.

We try hard to guide our delivery drivers. This one almost got it right. We've had FedEx drivers leave packages right under the sign on more than one occasion.

Bob

Looks like a no toaster sign to me.

Bob; I’ve had “front door” specified in my FedEx delivery instructions for years. Apparently we got a new driver on our route several months ago and either he is unaware such as thing as delivery instructions in account profiles exist or he chooses to ignore them. He constantly places packages by our garage door in full view of the street - rain or shine. I have left negative feedback with FedEx each time yet, the driver continues to leave them by the garage door.

I was going to create a sign similar to the one you have in the photo but, find it discouraging the drivers can’t even grasp that! Geez! 🤷

Curt

@bobfett posted:

We try hard to guide our delivery drivers. This one almost got it right. We've had FedEx drivers leave packages right under the sign on more than one occasion.

Bob

I interpret that that you accept no packages.  I would take it back.  How about a sign that starts with the word PLEASE!

@Frank Mulligan posted:

I interpret that that you accept no packages.  I would take it back.  How about a sign that starts with the word PLEASE!

We actually have that on another sign out of the picture, Frank:  "Please deliver packages to the back porch." UPS and USPS follow it but FedEx ignores it

I've set up delivery instructions with all the shipping services, they still dump the packages in the front of the garage.  The only bonus is we're in a gated community and hopefully there are fewer porch pirates wandering around.

Somehow, most of the time Amazon manages to find the front door.

I know that deliveries are not always optimal, but a quick Google search indicates that UPS drivers (for example) delivery an average of 120 packages per day. In my experience -- again this is a subjective observation -- the delivery people employed by the major carriers do a good job. The only problems I have had in the last few years involved USPS -- one lost package and one torn envelope that arrived empty with the Post Office's apologies.

@bobfett posted:

We try hard to guide our delivery drivers. This one almost got it right. We've had FedEx drivers leave packages right under the sign on more than one occasion.

Bob

Absolutely no toasters.

@ScoutingDad posted:

   I have a package actively being lost by the USPS, Looks like they are up to their old games of losing packages. Have a notice they have it and no updates for a week. I am sure Menards will take proper care of you.

I have a package on the way to Denmark, first class USPS. Sent on the 26th of January. First notice was 1 day later, it made it to Kansas City.

There was zero activity other the in route, until today, 11 days later it's in Chicago at the airport.

They can be slow.

It can take a month for packages to go international, depending on where they're going.  I know it took a month to send a small box to Australia.  It got to Australia in a week, but then it circulated around between several locations a couple of times and finally continued onto it's destination.

You think that's bad, I shipped this one on the 22nd of Jan. and it's traveling around the East Coast as we speak.

I am curious if @Michael Hokkanen (OP) opted for the 5.00 concealment charge that is offered during checkout?

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I've set up delivery instructions with all the shipping services, they still dump the packages in the front of the garage.  The only bonus is we're in a gated community and hopefully there are fewer porch pirates wandering around.

Somehow, most of the time Amazon manages to find the front door.

Had FedEx deliver a package while it was raining a few weeks back. Placed it on the wet ground at the porch front in the rain rather then 2 feet farther back where it was dry plus would have been out of sight from the street. They do this because the CEO says it is ok? 😂

One of the bonuses for shipping for me is that the regular USPS guy is really on his game and he tries to make sure the packages delivered to the house are as protected as possible.  That's not that easy at my place as my front "porch" is less that protected.