The Current Status of Phone/Tablet Train Operations?

Rod,

I suggest that you acquire the following documents:

• The DCS WiFi Companion 1st Edition will tell you everything that you need to know about operating DCS using the DCS WiFi App.
• The Free TMCC & Legacy Addendum will provide everything required to add TMCC & Legacy control.
• The Lionel WiFi Owner's Manual will provide what you need to know to operate the Lionel LCS WiFi App.

Everything that you need to know about DCS WiFi is all in MTH’s “The DCS WiFi Companion 1st Edition!" This book is available from many fine OGR advertisers and forum sponsors, or as an eBook or a printed book at MTH's web store! Get the free TMCC & Legacy Addendum here!

I run both systems DCS and legacy and love them both, I love the MTH premier app with my phone/tablet because it is so much better than the old remote I can take it any ware on the layout and not loose a signal, I have the LCS app and HI Rail app and Lionel I Cab app and they are all great fun. So good luck and enjoy  

I can tell you from first-hand experience that running your trains with a smart phone or tablet is a very unique and pleasant experience.

MUCH better than using the DCS, Cab 1 or Legacy remotes.

OGR Webmaster posted:

I can tell you from first-hand experience that running your trains with a smart phone or tablet is a very unique and pleasant experience.

MUCH better than using the DCS, Cab 1 or Legacy remotes.

I tend to disagree.  Maybe I need more time on them but I like to feel the controls instead of looking at them.  The DCS app is IMO thought pretty darn good.  The High Rail app is pretty intuitive especially with the 3D Touch features.  Also it allows control of the Sensor Track without touching it.  iCab is pretty good too but I think with the advent of the DCS App needs a little upgrading.

I will say as far as looking for menu items the App is much better.

I like the app much better over the remote. Much easier to navigate. Another nice improvement IMO is, if you have proto3 steamers with quil whistle,  the app does a far superior job creating a smooth sound transition. 

My iPad sits unused and the remote is used everyday.  It works with one hand !! and I don't have to look at it. I watch the train not the remote.

I guess I should mention that I do a lot of switching and freight peddling (car set outs ). My remote for the most part is in one hand down below waist level. The other hand throws the switches and pulls the pin on the couplers (Kadee). Like I said I watch what I'm doing. The app is ok for watching the trains run.

Clem

I tend to use the Remote for the Legacy and DCS Systems, I have used the app a couple of time, but I have a problem with the App not communicating with the WIU sometimes, so I just use the remote. I don't have any way to control Legacy with anything other then the Legacy Remote.

My experience is the Legacy remote I prefer for TMCC and Legacy while the app is my preference for DCS.

I have used the MTH remote, the DCS Wifi app, and the TMCC Cab 1. Of the three, I prefer the Premium app over the DCS remote, and the app over using the TMCC handheld. I'm a fan of the app because it's much easier to find and use certain functions (like softkey lights and sounds) versus the remote. Since I've used smartphones for much of my life, I do find that many of the functions of the remote which were somewhat clunky and hard to operate (for me at least) were much more intuitive when using the app. When I run operating sessions, I do miss the DCS remote's one big direction button (as opposed to the separate F/R buttons in the app). I've been able to use both the app and the remote one-handed, although I've found it much easier to look at the trains I am running and execute commands simultaneously than with the app. There are a few functions that the remote can do that the app currently can't, such as use MTH's "Proto-Dispatch" feature, although I think that can be remedied by plugging a microphone into the Protocast port on the TIU. I will say this though: Since I've installed the DCS Wifi equipment on our club layout, I and the other members have only used our phones to operate trains. 

Edit: I should note that I use my smartphone, and not a tablet, for operations. 

I don't even use my remotes any more. I use a $60 generic Android tablet I got from Walmart.COM which gives my phone a break on battery consumption. I use BlueTrain from Bob Krivacic to operate my TMCC engines through the Legacy WiFi interface (it will also work with BlueTooth under a limited range) and the MTH DCS WiFi Premium version since we have five TIUs on the club layout. Both systems work GREAT and provide a better operating range than the conventional remotes. For iPhone/iPad users, Lionel's Legacy WiFi APP is the way to control TMCC/Legacy equipment.

We were lucky enough to be one of the beta test sites for the Lionel Legacy WiFi and loved it from day 1. Even the technophobes in the club have started using smartphone control of their trains. We jumped in on the MTH DCS WiFi even before the Premium version was released because were were confident in the system after preliminary testing.

We're in a unique position because our building is long (about 100 feet) and narrow, plus there are a couple of walls. This sometimes interferes with the radio communication between TMCC or DCS remotes and their respective receivers. I put in a WiFi router and tied both systems in and we can operate trains from the parking lot if we want to (not particularly smart, but we can). We don't use our WiFi to drive computers or access the Internet (we didn't want to put in the phone lines for it), but personally, I wouldn't want to tie my train layout into the same network I was using my home computers on

Even though there's an additional expense for the hardware and some minor hassle to set up (if you can read the instructions you can do it), the WiFi interface for operation is definitely a winner. If you need more information, get Barry's book.

I prefer the use of the APPs over the dedicated remotes. One of my permanent layouts away from home was (and is still) having great trouble using the handheld remotes due to some unidentifiable interference.  The WiFi apps never miss a beat on this layout and are now the only reliable form of control.

As MARTYE stated above, the feeling of the remote is not there with a touch screen and it is nice to run trains without having to look at the remote, but running trains on the old remote without looking is limited to Speed, Bell, Whistle, & Direction (on DCS remotes). I found that getting a smaller display smart device allowed me to operate my layout with one hand, and eventually I learned well enough to operate these basic functions without looking at the screen.

Keep in mind that the handheld remotes are "one size fits all" and that rearranging the functional layout to your own liking is nearly impossible. I have been experimenting with using PlayStation and Nintendo Wii controllers as alternative input to control my trains with some success via my android tablet. I now have two completely different & customizable controllers that I can use to operate trains.

APPs & technology blows the whole market open to new possibilities of control. What about using Siri or Google voice to verbally issue commands to trains, switches, or accessories? Now that method doesn't need any hands and you are always looking at the layout... just tell it what you want it to do.

Wifi, apps, bluetooth. etc. is definitely the future for remote train controls and I think it certainly might get more young folks interested. It will probably lead to a lot more possibilities for folks to operate their trains as things develop. I am slowly trying to convert, but personally for now I still prefer the remotes. I am usually one to enjoy the new stuff that comes out so it's kind of odd. In fact it was the command control and electronics that got me back in the hobby a few years ago. Might take a while, but I'm pretty sure I'll be converted one of these days.

Not surprised actually, I prefer the remote as well and even with both the phone and pad Legacy ready. It's just easier and more direct some how. I figured the iOS stuff was the future when all these problematic remotes finally go belly up without the generous support the have now. But I somewhat dread that.

Although, I do two finger this iPhone keyboard after decades of computer keyboard, so there's hope.

If you have to stare at your phone to operate your DCS or Legacy, you're doing it wrong. Those of us who use devices in our daily lives, are used to operating (in my case iPads and iPhones).

I look at my trains just fine.  Yeah I look at the screen when changing locos, or calling up a switch; but I do that on the DCS or Legacy remotes as well.

If I want to run trains, I use the remotes.  If I want to play with a gadget and trains are just a sideline, I'll use the app.  I also feel the remote is more reliable.  Press a button; always get the desired result.

H1000 posted:

 

APPs & technology blows the whole market open to new possibilities of control. What about using Siri or Google voice to verbally issue commands to trains, switches, or accessories? Now that method doesn't need any hands and you are always looking at the layout... just tell it what you want it to do.

I don't have the right skills to do this myself but I'm sure it's now conceptually possible for someone to control their layout by voice.  I already control my lightbulbs by voice; the next level for MTH and Lionel should be syncing up Bluetooth- or Wifi-controlled locomotives and turnouts with Alexa or Google Home, etc.  "Alexa: Reverse Challenger 3985 at speed 10.  Alexa: throw Turnout #2.  Alexa: Blow whistle on all engines."

This is going to be really, really awesome.

BC1989 posted:

I don't have the right skills to do this myself but I'm sure it's now conceptually possible for someone to control their layout by voice. ...

Alexa: Blow whistle on all engines."

This is going to be really, really awesome.

What's so exciting about that? My very first train set had a voice activated whistle.

All I had to do was say, Woooo!! Whoooooo!!!! Whooooo!

A remote must be held in your hand to operate it properly. A tablet only needs a finger. I enjoy the premium app and really hope MTH creates a multi throttle screen like the Bachmann app has. I saw 6 displayed on their tablet at York, but I don't know the maximum amount that can fit on the screen or if the whistle and bell were included with each throttle. But to have that capability on the MTH app, instead of having to flip back and forth between engines, would be fantastic. I will stop by the Bachmann stand again at York's next show and take a closer look. I believe if we no longer had to search for, then select an engine to control it,  it would make running multiple engines on a layout much more enjoyable and also be a much faster way to respond to avoid an accident. The response time would even be faster then having to fumble through multiple remotes. Imagine being able to run six engines from one screen with one finger. Hope that day soon arrives with a simple update to the MTH app.

How does one hold a tablet with only a finger, while walking around the layout?

A tablet does not need held in your hand like a remote. It could lay flat or on a stand without the need to be clamped down because of the extremely lite touch to operate it. The heavy touch to operate a remote requires it to be held in place.

Very interesting replies. I kind of figured responses would be decidedly either for or against "app control". It seems however that there is a more or less even split with several who have installed the app equipment who have found that they prefer the handheld devices.

i guess the only way to find out is jump in and try it out! 

Rod

RJR posted:

How does one hold a tablet with only a finger, while walking around the layout?

Two hands and two fingers (thumbs).

I also have an ipad 2 and for me it is awkward to hold and operate trains at the same time. I think this is part of my still preferring my remotes. I have an ipod touch that I need to try as it is a lot easier to hold and operate while walking around (at least so far, I haven't hit any trees, telephone poles, signs or been run over by a car while fiddling with it on my morning walks.) 

I still don't have a smart phone, but this is going to force me into a purchase one of these days. Of course, I have been saying that for at least a year now... Also Barry and I think others have said the ipad mini is better than the full ipad. Easier to hold on to and more manageable to operate while running trains. Also less expensive than iphones! 

the ipad mini is better than the full ipad. Easier to hold on to and more manageable to operate while running trains. Also less expensive than iphones! 

Agreed!

Also, as Dave said above, a stand or something might help with the ipad 2? I don't have anything like that either...

rtr, but that destroys the beauty of having walkaround control--to go where the action is instead of being tied to a control panel location.

Yes, I certainly agree with you here RJR, but I find carrying the ipad 2 around a bit awkward. That takes the fun out if it as well, I'm afraid I am going to drop it. 

RTR12, you need something like this to carry that iPad.

That would certainly make it easier to hold on to and walk around with. Didn't know they had such a thing? So many new devices, so little time! 

With the remotes, I have on occasion carried one in each hand, while I have multiple trains running and am throwing switches.

Which is preferable is a matter of taste.

"'Everyone to his own taste,' the old woman said when she kissed her cow." Wkipedia, Wellerism.

I use this on the back of my iPad mini, pops down flat or two different heights. See I really did try the app, the app just doesn't work for me. I just keep it around for guests they usually don't do switching.

Clem 

Now that's kind of neat Clem. That would allow holding the iPad with one hand and making changes with the other. You would also be able to throw switches etc with the free hand I would guess.

think I'll try it with the iPhone for starters.

Rod

Best part it was less than 5 dollars, I think at best buy.

Your preference of app vs hand-held remote is highly personal and their is substantial room for both. I got caught up in the bluetooth/app scenario two years ago and have found it to be quite interesting. It is one of the best ways of operating effectively on battery power. We cannot ignore the acceptance and use of smartphones and tablets by the younger set. All the toy companies making advanced items like the BB-8 and the CARS model are going this way. Even LEGO has just announced LEGO Boost which uses a tablet app. The robotics schools which are doing very well are not teaching transformer control or TMCC. But, again, it's a personal decision for each of us.

First thanks Barry for the links to the various user manuals that you posted right at the beginning of this topic. I will likely wind up downloading the .pdf version.

Ordered up a DCS wifi interface and it arrived today. Naturally I now have a couple of questions:

Of the two methods of hooking up to the wifi, which works best; MTH network mode, or Home network mode? Of does it matter?

My old rev I3a TIU has no USB socket, so I guess that means I will have to upgrade to my rev L TIU, since I use the 9 pin serial socket on the TIU to interface to my Legacy base. Is there any other way to do this?

Thanks,

Rod

Rod,

Of the two methods of hooking up to the wifi, which works best; MTH network mode, or Home network mode? Of does it matter?

If you don't need Internet access while operating your trains, I suggest that you use MTH mode. It's a bit faster coming up,  and doesn't relie on your home router and network.

My old rev I3a TIU has no USB socket, so I guess that means I will have to upgrade to my rev L TIU, since I use the 9 pin serial socket on the TIU to interface to my Legacy base. Is there any other way to do this?

You can connect simultaneously to both the Legacy Base and the WIU by using a serial to USB adapter cable and a serial Y cable. However, if you want to run Legacy engines via the DCS App, it's more complicated. When you get my book, also get the free Legacy/TMCC AAddendum. (See below).

This and a whole lot more about DCS WiFi is all in MTH’s “The DCS WiFi Companion 1st Edition!" This book is available from many fine OGR advertisers and forum sponsors, or as an eBook or a printed book at MTH's web store! Get the free TMCC & Legacy Addendum here!

Very interesting thread. Question, So, I have a layout, all TMCC/Legacy, and am thinking, Use Wifi and Bluetooth... I use ASC's operating the turnouts, I use BPC's operating the blocks...All power to my layout comes through TPC's....

My question, what components do I need for successful operation of IPad Air and IPhone 6.  Thank you all for your kind help...