tin plate connected to knuckle???

Hi Walt,

no such thing as a dumb question, especially in tinplate.  we spend a good amount of time laughing, but it's mostly at ourselves, having too much fun.

the whole coupler deal with tinplate will keep youi occupied for some time to come.  historically, every manufacturer had their own proprietary coupler, and they were not compatible with each other.  not only that, but each manufacturer went through an evolution and made several different couplers during their history, most of which were not compatible with each other.

but it turns out to be not such a big deal.  tinplate are toys, so there is no need to try to stay scale or realistic-looking.  you can just run like couplers together; or you can replace couplers; or you can make or get adapters from one coupler type to another; or you can hook unlike couplers together with a bit of wire or a twisty-tie!  anything that works!

as a general rule, tinplate couplers are easily swapped out.  in many cases they tend to be attached to the car body rather than the truck, so swapping out trucks isn't usually the issue.  

Walt,

Not a silly question at all. Replacing that lead truck on one gondola with a prewar truck is definitely one way that would work.

I believe that there is also an adapter piece available from the parts dealers that will allow a latch-type coupler to mate with a knuckle.

Another option might be to attach a postwar knuckle coupler plate (photo) to a prewar truck. If the axle spacing is right it should clamp onto the prewar truck just as easily as the postwar trucks for which it was made.

Jim

Walt,

Found that adapter - it's part TS-162.

Jim

Actually, there are two adapters - one for "low rise" couplers and another for "high-rise" couplers.

I have heard that J. L. Cowen could have used knuckle couplers during the Prewar era, but he declined because they weren't compatible with tinplate couplers.

When World War II halted train production from 1943 until late 1945, Mr. Cowen decided to introduce knuckle couplers when train production resumed.

Adapters work but more people seem to prefer a "transition" car with a latch coupler at one end and a knuckle coupler at the other. A cheap gon will work fine.

You are on the right track.

An American Flyer 1938 C shaped or "Sheet Metal Knuckle Coupler" will also connect directly to a Lionel postwar knuckle coupler (assuming it is still in its original shape)

Roland

At an early stage of my O-gauge involvement I had a mix of prewar and postwar items, mostly Lionel. I improvised some alternate couplers, and sometimes switched trucks or added a Postwar knuckle onto a prewar truck.

After I acquired more equipment, I preferred to run the postwar and tinplate items in separate trains, instead of mixing. Decided they looked better that way, and I changed some of my adapted items back to their original configuration. I have some extra tenders with tinplate couplers, so I can use some of the smaller "traditional" Postwar locos to pull tinplate trains.

Later I also acquired different Marx items, and that requires some improvising because Marx themselves had different versions of couplers. Some of them could connect with each other, but some were incompatible. I fabricated my own Marx-style tab-and-slot couplers to replace some Marx knuckle couplers, so I could intermix Marx cars more freely.

Yes !  But they are somewhat rare, the so-called "Q" couplers of 1938. I have just one car with those. 

I guess it depends where you are located. When I was seeking AF gauge 0 all I ever seemed to find was the 1938 sets. My Hudson was a 1938 freight model, my 2-6-4 and 2-4-4 sets were both 1948 (one passenger, one freight) am my switcher is also a 1938 #4321. all picked up in the NW Ohio and Michigan area.

Roland

I'm enjoying learning, albeit slowly, OK very slowly, about tin-plate.  All I knew was that I always liked it and wanted someday to own some.

BTW: I am only looking at NEW Lionel Corporation (by MTH) stuff.  Sets most likely.  I only want 2 trains.  So I think coupler style and compatibility won't be an issue for me - I hope!

Jim, you listed a transition piece and model number - from whom? Lionel?

Also, that adapter looks like it bends downward.  I'm noticing it because the forumite that brought some pieces to my house to show me things warned me of different height couplers - he actually had to bend the shaft of some cars to mate them with his other rolling stock.  I will avoid that at ALL cost!

thanks for the tips guys!

- walt

Walt,

It's available from any good Lionel parts dealer. I would guess that now most of them that you see are repro parts, not original Lionel. In fact, the original Lionel might be collector's ($$$) items. The ones available now are only a buck or two apiece.

Jim

This Lionel document clearly shows how their coupler adapters work. It creates an unsightly gap between the cars IMO, which is why I preferred to make my own arrangements.

Lionel Service Manual - No. TT-100 and TS-162 coupler adapters

Document was previously posted by ReadingFan here:

Coupler conversion cars ...

That service manual page shows it all. I remember the original TT-100 adapter as being very tough to find. Saw one at York for close to $100. But, the $2 repros work just as well, even if they do produce that gap. But, then again we are talking tinplate so many will find the look to be OK.

Jim

thanks guys for following up, and to Ace for the link.

- walt

At an early stage of my O-gauge involvement, I was mixing prewar and postwar cars to make a longer train with the few items that I had. I improvised some knuckle-compatible couplers on the prewar cars.

Walt,

RichArt made to order both O gauge tinplate and Standard Gauge tinplate with knuckle couplers.  I personally own a RichArt Standard Gauge Milwaukee Road BiPolar and six RichArt passenger cars, a RichArt Standard Gauge McKeen Motor Car with two McKeen trailers, and a RichArt O gauge BiPolar all of which have knuckle couplers.  

For the Standard Gauge locos and cars, RichArt grafted the knuckle end of a G gauge coupler to the metal shaft of an Ives coupler. You could similarly do some grafting.  For the O gauge, RichArt used a stock replacement O gauge knuckle coupler, of the type which attaches directly to the frame of the loco or car and is not a permanent part of a truck.  You could also do something similar. 

Bob

Thanks Bob. 

When I head to York soon I'll check around and see what I can pick up.  Several options so far but I like the adapter one the most so far.

Considering I don't even own one piece yet I hope I'm not getting ahead of myself too far!!!!

thanks - walt

Walt,

I don't recall seeing many LCT sets at York. You might consider looking online at some inventory. (Sidetrack Hobbies, Nassau Hobby or Justrains for example) If you see something that interests you, call them and ask them to bring it to York.

Good luck in your search. I know that you are going to love tinplate!

Doc: what is an 'LCT' set????

If that somehow translates to 'tin-plate', then dang, I'm in deep doo-doo!  I was counting HEAVILY on picking up 2 sets.  Right now I do not own a single piece of train equipment but need 2 sets for my Christmas layout.

I don't have the spellings right, I'm sure, but doesn't Grzbowski and Nicolas Smith bring a lot of sets to York?  I've seen a bunch in the past but maybe they were not tin-plate.

thanks - walt

Walt, you might want to check out Just Trains of Delaware.  I was just on their site and found they have quite of few tinplate items on clearance for anywhere between good to very good discounted prices.  You said you are looking for two sets for your Christmas layout, well they have the Christmas 249E set on sale for $349 which is a very good price for a really nice set.  I'll attach a link to their clearance page.

http://www.justrains.com/webst...=index&cPath=612

Hope this helps,

John.

I have made a transition car by taking a Marx car (a flat whose load had been lost), then taking one set of the trucks I replaced the Marx truck with a Lionel set of truck.  Then I added some weight on the converted car to keep it on the track.

Your transition car will let you hook lionel to marx or marx to lionel.

Not a hard thing to do.

Thanks John!  I hope they maintain until after York!  I'd like to see what I'm buying since I'm such a novice.  Note the question on 'LCT', which shows I am just getting started.

Thanks Al.  Maybe I'll look at York and see if I can pick up a car reasonably cheap and see if I can do the same.  You might be hearing from me!

I can't believe I didn't know LCT until someone told me what it was.  Gosh, what a dummy.

- walt