To those who operate prewar Lionel

If you lock the reverse unit in forward, will the loco coast through the switch?

#2 The pickups are replaceable.  New ones might solve your problem. The Lionel service manual shows how and maybe that can be found online. Make sure you read it before attempting to remove them yourself. it's easy to wreck the spring.

Check to see if the pick up spacing matches the spacing of insulated parts of the switch.

#4 Prewar came with two different coupler heights, depending on the series of the cars. There is an adapter somewhere that will couple the low and the high. Again, the picture and proper name will be online somewhere.

Thank you ROYBOY.  I'll begin shopping.

Bill

I'm not sure , but this might be an O27 locomotive.  If it is, the spacing of the pickup rollers may be too close together for an O22 switch.  This is a very common problem with O27 engines and O22 switches.  The fix is to put a pickup roller on a truck in the tender and tie that pickup from the tender to the pickups in the engine.  You can put some kind of jack in the wire to disconnect when the engine is taken away from the tender,  Only need to do one wire (positive or center rail).

Bill

Put the E Unit in forward and run it.

ogaugenut,

The 1664 is a prewar O27 engine.  Your idea about tying a tender roller to the engine slider contact sounds very doable.  I have two prewar tenders, a 1689W and a much nicer 2666W.  I prefer the 2666W because it isn't just a black box.  It is O gauge and has two rollers.  That would free the 1689W to evolve into an auxiliary water tender to pull behind my LC+ 4501.  The 4501 used an auxiliary tender between Birmingham and Chattanooga in the 1970's.  That is a young me standing on the primary tender in the attached photo. My Father, an official on the Southern/NS, always ran the 4501 when it was on excursions on the AGS Division.  Don't tell anyone, sometimes he gave me the throttle.

Steamer,

The 1664 stalls regardless of E unit position.

Bill H.

strange...mine never does......

I have a 1666 [similar engine] with slider pick ups. I had to tweak the sliders slightly to the right or left to get it to operate smoothly over 022 switches. I don't remember exactly which way, but it wasn't to difficult to get it to go through in any direction. This should work with your engine unless the spacing between them is too narrow.

Chris

Yep.  The winning suggestion is to add a tether to the tender.  Four pickups are better than two, and easily removable if you want to put it back to original.

The 229 is the same loco with slightly nicer Baldwin disc wheels and roller pickups, which are spaced more widely than the sliding shoes on your 1664.  But if I were going to explore the notion of swapping motors, I would look closely at the motor from a 1656 switcher.  Roller pickups and double-reduction gearing for smoother running, plus no more "fat wheel" syndrome.  (On single-reduction motors like your 1664, the gear cast into the back of the wheel is the same diameter as the wheel tread.  This causes derailments and clunking on some other types of switches.)  Problem is, a 1656 motor isn't a bolt-in swap...  To reuse your side rods, you would probably need to pull and press all four wheels; I don't know whether the axle diameters and gear tooth pitch are the same.  If you managed to succeed, a 1664 with a 1656 motor is pretty much the ultimate 2-4-2!  I love these locos so much, someday I'll buy a bunch of junkers at York and give this a try.

@Steamer your 1664 is a Franken-loco.  It looks like it's been remotored with the chassis of a Postwar large Hudson or 2018 Prairie-type.  Definitely effective but an entirely different beast.

Franken-loco? You betcha! My post was tongue in cheek. I found the shell in a junk box at a show. I added a 2035 Magnatraction motor.

Dave aka Dr. Frankensteen,

  How's that steam switcher doing that you also "brought back to life?"

Tom 

just like an old Lionel should!

or did you mean my 1662? It came back back to life with a different motor after it started smoking one day....unfortunately Prewar Lionel's don't have a factory smoke feature.Been stalled out for the summer, hope to finish it up this winter.

Hey y'all,

   I bought a 1927 prewar set for my birthday.  Pictures below.  Please note the WOT performance of the the engine.  It will not operate in reverse.  I'm waiting to take the shell off until a NOS headlight arrives.  Only 92 years old!!

Have any of y'all seen this?

We need a shorter drawbar and a taller, shorter tender part.  I would like to do something reversible.   I Like the way my Postwar 681 and tender fit.  Who has made a Lionel engine and tender work closer together?

Bill

look at other engines that use the same rear truck...224E,675.My 1666 and 2026 both have shorter drawbars. Pretty sure my 1664 does also, but I customized it with a six drivered motor.Or customize what you have. Cut some out and JB (or tack weld) the pieces where you want them.

My Dad's 1655 with sliders did not like 022 switches.  I swapped them out for the roller style collectors as found on the 1656 switcher that shared the same drive unit.  That solved the problems.  If there is a model that uses rollers instead of collectors on the same mechanism, that would help.   Mike

I have the exact same set with the 252 and the freight cars that was my Dad's. Has a manual reverse lever sticking out of the top. Probably just needs rewiring and looks like it needs a general servicing? How are the wheels? Mine had to be replaced.

I've made new drawbars of machine brass. The hard, not the soft stuff.as.that bends overtime with heavy loads when thin enough to be good as a tab.

If you look close at tender receivers, you'll see some are offset, some straight, etc.

DBar parts have limited bendability; most most can take one good bend. (older seem better; you might get two or three trys. The hardening and gauge changed. (note there are different gauges of drawbar material and slot sizes. (thick for sq. barstock type, and thin like tinplate.)

Or if you go to pin&hole vs tab&slot, you can fabricate both of any type brass. (Pin can be a (harder) shoulder screw w/head cut off.

Watch those 0-27 curves as the tender/cab corners hit pretty quick in them.

Changing the wheelset is how to raise or lower a Talco type truck's coupling height without messing with the fixed shank or adapter etc..also raises body mounted ones if you wanted.

Hi`, i found a beat up 252 with 3 Pullman passenger cars, it ran great but looked like it had been through the mill, after removing all the paint, i repainted it 2 different shades of blue, now it not only runs great but looks great too, there is a lever on top for forward, neutral, reverse, if it won`t go in reverse, try removing that carefully as there are brushes in there that are spring loaded which might need to be replaced, good luck, Phil

Hey, black Apple Barrel craft paint washes off years later (the casting won't rust) Use tiny little brush strokes for a more prototypical paint job

It isn't the toughest paint, but It's cheap and touch up is easy. (glosses are harder shelled than satin, then flats). 80¢ at Wally world last I looked. 

Odenville Bill posted:

Have any of y'all seen this?

We need a shorter drawbar and a taller, shorter tender part.  I would like to do something reversible.   I Like the way my Postwar 681 and tender fit.  Who has made a Lionel engine and tender work closer together?

Bill

This was how they were made as the tender was a universal drawbar for different locos.

Hey Y'all,

I cleaned and lubed my 252.  Now it runs well in both directions.  Video soon.  The complete headlight assembly and whistle are due any day.  It needs wheels but I'll have to save up for that.

My 1938 vintage #1664 now operates correctly everywhere.  I tweaked the sliding pickups in opposing directions.  O22 switches are not a problem anymore.   I'm a fair hand with MIG welding.  I'll put Operation Drawbar on the "To Do" list. 

Gentlemen, thank you for your feedback.

Bill

Steamer, That is not a 1662 you are showing.

eddie g posted:

Steamer, That is not a 1662 you are showing.

yes it is.......reread my previous post.

"or did you mean my 1662? It came back back to life with a different motor after it started smoking one day....unfortunately Prewar Lionel's don't have a factory smoke feature.Been stalled out for the summer, hope to finish it up this winter."

Steamer, a 1662 is a 0-4-0.

Eddie, Steamers loco is a 1662 shell on a 6 wheel motor....  You wanna call it "not" a 1662 fine, but it is built out of a 1662 shell....  As you well know, it's the same shell as used for the 203 although the motor mounting holes and E unit slot are in different spots on the 1662 verus the 203.

eddie g posted:

Steamer, a 1662 is a 0-4-0.

did you not read my post? The original motor on my 1662 burnt up, so I replaced it with a 6 drivered motor. SO, it is a 1662 shell on a six drivered motor like I stated.

Steamer posted:

just like an old Lionel should!

 

Just like this...a 1615 shell on a Prewar 203 motor.

I've got my 252 engine running well.  In the past week, a new headlight. whistle, and couplers have arrived.  The question this evening  is what does a correct coupler/rivet/frame assembly look like?  Pictures are "as found".

Bill

From the big box stores buy a faucet handle puller and a woodworker vise. (See pic#1) On the puller I had to grind down one leg to better fit between the motor frame and the wheel on the O gauge. (See pic#2). Just pull one wheel, remove axel from frame, pull other wheel from axel, punch the gear off of the wheel.

Use the vice to press the gear on new wheel. Then set geared wheel into vice with axel perpendicular to it and press it on. Slide assembly through motor frame and use vice to press other wheel on. Check for spacing between wheel, frame and ensure gear mesh are all smooth. Than repeat and your done.

I have used this on 8s, 10s, 252 and 253 also. Just take your time and you will be fine

I don’t have access to mine at this moment but here is a pic that I had that may help. This was prior to a successful wheel replacement using these tools.

Thank you Rich.

Bill

There was an article in OGR back in the mid-eighties on how to make a wheel puller from a battery puller. I can see if I can find it.

Hey Bill, have you ever welded on top of a block of graphite?  You ground the block and lay a puddle on the block. Once hard, the "puddle" can be lifted right off the graphite.  I'm just thinking with some 19 wire you could draw a part or two easier than tacking tiny stuff that is really "tig work".

Somewhere I still have my "signature puddles"🤔 one is layered 3d lettering 😁

A slide block off a trolley

Changed pickup assembly on 1664 and 1684 do not have any switches on layout but these run wonderful and rollers only get warm after extended run time pulling tender and 4 or 5 cars.

I've got a new question.

If your wife wanted you to add a prewar streamliner set and you are limited to O-31 curves, what would you buy? 

Bill

@Odenville Bill posted:

I've got a new question.

If your wife wanted you to add a prewar streamliner set and you are limited to O-31 curves, what would you buy? 

Bill

One of the Lionel Jr or Marx sets

Steve

@Odenville Bill posted:

I've got a new question.

If your wife wanted you to add a prewar streamliner set and you are limited to O-31 curves, what would you buy? 

Bill

I've done an overhaul on a Flying Yankee and run it on my old O gauge test track with no curve problem.  It's listed in a set with that track in the 1936 Lionel catalog.  It's a reasonably accurate model of a real train - now being restored in Lincoln, NH - see https://flyingyankee.org/  They are expensive, several listed now on eBay around $300-350.

The Lionel Jr. is much cheaper.  #1700 one on eBay for $99.00 said to run.  It's not an actual model of anything.