Upgrading the Lionel 6-18009 NYC L3-A Mohawk? | O Gauge Railroading On Line Forum

GGGOGR Forum Member

Originally Posted by northeast:

Some or all of the 18064s had a defective board as issued by Lionel. Lionel provided a replacement board. I have a 18064 with the replacement board and it is a good runner, as good as any non-cruise pullmor loco that I have. Without the new board, it was a total dog. I also connected the loco and tender pickup rollers with a #22 black wire so no more TMCC signal loss going over switches. My 18064 pulls eight of the Commodore Vandy heavies up a 3% grade with only minor wheel slip. Some shops may still have the replacement board.

Allan

Alan, Do you know what board was replaced? The engine ACDR is a common board with very simple design. Not much to it. But the R2LC had an R2IR code which is not standard by any means. I wonder if the R2LC code was bad and it required a R2LC C08? Do you have a record of the change? G

12/19/1410:12 AM

northeastOGR Forum Member

The board is a "ACDR Rev B". It is item 37 in Alex M's diagram further up in this thread.

Allan

12/19/1410:25 AM

GGGOGR Forum Member

I am surprised they are defective. G

12/19/142:44 PM

trnluvrOGR Forum Member

I have one also that I would like to upgrade. I wonder if a call to Frank Timko asking if he could adapt a larger motor to this engine??

Doug

12/19/146:11 PM

gunrunnerjohnOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

The larger motor sticks out the back and looks pretty dumb.

12/19/147:41 PM

NelsonWOGR Forum Member

Back to the original question:

Upgrading the Lionel 6-18009 NYC L3-A Mohawk

What would be the parts list for adding TMCC?

Keeping the existing AC motor and compatible new sound?

Where is the best place to purchase the parts from?

12/19/1411:07 PM

lehighlineOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

This engine uses the same drive train as the early Lionel Reading T-1. I know it suffers from the same issues. I would pull the whole thing apart and repack all the bearings with RedNTacky grease. That works wonders on my T-1, and I plan to do the Mohawk when I find the time.

Chris

LVHR

12/19/1411:15 PM

GGGOGR Forum Member

Originally Posted by NelsonW:

Back to the original question:

Upgrading the Lionel 6-18009 NYC L3-A Mohawk

What would be the parts list for adding TMCC?

Keeping the existing AC motor and compatible new sound?

Where is the best place to purchase the parts from?

I think this would be a ERR candidate. It had a mechanical e -unit and RS 1 in the tender. So you would need to see how the parts would fit inside the engine if they can. If not, it would go into the tender and the tether would be used to control the engine motor smoke. This also has a mechanical smoke unit.

If you opened it and posted some pics that would help. Otherwise you may want to ask Boxcar Bill he may have converted one. G

12/20/149:02 AM

gunrunnerjohnOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

You'd need the ERR AC Commander, and the ERR RailSounds Commander. For that locomotive, I'd probably pick either medium steam or large steam sound sets, it'll depend on which whistle sound you like best. You'll need at least a 4-pin tether between the tender and locomotive, and maybe more pins if you want more control like smoke and headlight from the remote.

12/20/149:46 AM

SURFLINEROGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Originally Posted by northeast:

No one on this thread has reported any problems with the 18009. The problems were with the 18064. I have a 18009 and it is a good runner, as good as any Pullmor steam loco that I have. While it has less detail than the Lionel L2, the most obvious being the lack of valve gear, it projects a massiveness that the L2 does not. Also, it is one of the few Lionel steam locos that have a round boiler, others being the 18064 and the 4-8-4 NYC Niagara. The L2 has a very obvious U shaped boiler. I would like to see Lionel re-issue the 18009 and 18064.

Thank you for your comments - cleared some confusion for me. I don't know why this went from the 18009 to the 18064, but it got a little confusing and you cleared it up.

12/22/142:34 PM

rex desiletsOGR Forum Member

This engine uses the same drive train as the early Lionel Reading T-1. I know it suffers from the same issues. I would pull the whole thing apart and repack all the bearings with RedNTacky grease. That works wonders on my T-1, and I plan to do the Mohawk when I find the time.

Chris
LVHR

I have the T-1 (upgraded to TMCC). Runs fine, sounds like a coffee grinder. Is this part of the issues you mention? What are other issues? Does RedNTacky cure the gear noise issue?

12/22/143:22 PM

CPF3OGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBER

I bought a 6-18009 a couple years ago on an auction for about $120. Beautiful engine, ran sluggishly no matter how much fine tuning. Got a motor from Mr. Timko for $50 - best money I ever spent. Engine pulls 7 scale lenght heavyweights as fast as I want.

Does anyone have (or know the location of) an instruction book for it in digital form??

John

romiller49OGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

I converted mine to a can motor larger than Timko's. I did have to cut into the ash pan to mount it. Can't see it unless turned upside down. Used North West Shortline U- Joints for coupling to worm shaft. Installed ERR and railsounds. Runs like a champ. This is better than leaving as a shelf queen.

Rod Miller

Alfred E NeumanOGR Forum Member

CPF3 posted:
I bought a 6-18009 a couple years ago on an auction for about $120. Beautiful engine, ran sluggishly no matter how much fine tuning. Got a motor from Mr. Timko for $50 - best money I ever spent. Engine pulls 7 scale lenght heavyweights as fast as I want.
Does anyone have (or know the location of) an instruction book for it in digital form??

Here's a link to the 18009 operating and maintenance instructions in pdf format you can download if that's what you are asking for:

https://www.lionelsupport.com/...ents/71-8009-250.pdf.

What, me worry?

7/20/1710:43 PM

MikadoOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBERFORUM SPONSOR

If anyone out there decides to upgrade the AC motored (non TMCC equipped) Mohawk (6-18009) you will need the following components;

AC Commander(ERR)
Railsounds Commander (ERR)
8-position tether (collector, ground, brush 1, brush 2, field winding, smoke unit hot, headlight hot
27 Ohm wirewound element (Lionel) 6108141055 (to replace the existing element in smoke unit)
12V Incandescent grain of wheat lamp (Lionel) (to replace the existing 6V lamp in the headlight)
Coil Coupler (Lionel) use the one for the N&W J Class loco (the Postwar style J) mounts with a pal nut on the truck.

The tender shell will need to be electrically isolated from the frame for the antenna (if the coal load is plastic you do not need to isolate the shell from the frame?

Good luck & have fun!

Mike

gunrunnerjohnOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Gosh Mike, you forgot the Super-Chuffer!

NortonOGR Forum Member

Since this thread was first posted I started to upgrade my Commodore Vanderbilt Hudson which appears to have a similar drivetrain to the Mohawk. I think I better understand why the Timko motor works well is partly due to a well made gearbox with a lower gear ratio (higher numerically) than many steam engines.

Those who found the 18064 doesn't run as well as the 18009 need to check if any of the valve gear is hitting other reciprocating parts. On the CV the whole assembly is pretty sloppy. I found some #1 washers to help shim the eccentric rod. Also the piston guides need to be checked for binding. You can do it by turning the motor flywheel by hand or also connecting an ammeter between your power source and engine and check for current surges as the wheels rotate. Disconnecting the main rod from the driver will allow you to slide it back and forth and feel if its binding too. Clearing up this problem will result in a much smoother running engine.

Pete

MikadoOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBERFORUM SPONSOR

No super chuffer will work on a piston driven smoke unit! LOL

mike

7/22/1712:06 PM

Ted SOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

romiller49 posted:
I converted mine to a can motor larger than Timko's. I did have to cut into the ash pan to mount it. Can't see it unless turned upside down. Used North West Shortline U- Joints for coupling to worm shaft. Runs like a champ.

Rod, any chance you could post some photos of the underside? Also did you take any with the shell off after the conversion?? Thanks!

gunrunnerjohnOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Mikado posted:
No super chuffer will work on a piston driven smoke unit! LOL
mike

Sure, but my first step is to upgrade the smoke unit.

romiller49OGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Ted Sowirka posted:
romiller49 posted:
I converted mine to a can motor larger than Timko's. I did have to cut into the ash pan to mount it. Can't see it unless turned upside down. Used North West Shortline U- Joints for coupling to worm shaft. Runs like a champ.
Rod, any chance you could post some photos of the underside? Also did you take any with the shell off after the conversion?? Thanks!

Here's a picture. You can see where I've cut the ash pan. You can find these engines now for $300.00 so I don't care about cutting the ash pan. The motors I use are 35mm OD x 52mm long. Much stronger than the Timko size. I paid $3.00 each at York. Have been running many many hours with no problems. No heat generated after one hour running with 15 cars. I also got the motor mount at York. I think they are from a Williams motor mount for the semi GG1. I did have to enlarge the hole for the motor bearing portion to 9/16. I've used this set up on all my hudsons and also the Chessie T1.

Rod Miller

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gunrunnerjohnOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Who did you get the motors from?

romiller49OGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

gunrunnerjohn posted:
Who did you get the motors from?

I got them in the members hall. There were 5 motors and I grabbed them up. I have been unable to find more of them. I'll send you an email with actual dimensions and maybe you can help me find them.

Rod Miller

gunrunnerjohnOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Or help me find them.

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