What do you think is the BIGGEST obstacle to starting a 3-Rail O Gauge layout?

Space

Money

Time

Kids

When I first got married we lived in a condo with no basement and no room for a layout.  I did build a few Christmas layouts but that was it.  When we moved into our current home I did start a layout but it was very expensive.  That layout only lasted about 2 years and it came down to make room in the basement for the kids to have a play area.

I started  my new layout in an extra bedroom in the basement just a few months ago.  It is much smaller then the pervious but I am doing it right this time.  I am also on a much tighter budget.  I am making this one way more kid friendly so they can run their trains and I can throw on my Legacy locomotives and scale cars on their once in awhile.   

I have friends in HO Scale and they are rivet counters, two RAIL is not real, three rail is TOY...Well, I had a good friend over last week that has a 35' by 50' HO layout that had never seen my layout. He, runs DCC, has several thousand cars, several hundred Diesels, loves his Scale. What he saw different was, mine is totally Lionel Legacy, I could start up any of 15 or so Engines on the track, or lash ups, or program turnouts or even open blocks, it was EASIER....He was amazed at the Quality that LIONEL has achieved over the years....You could actually see the fine Detailing...It was a Wow for him....

So, to Answer your Question, You do need a good bit of space, a modest amount of money, and to help keep your budget in retrospect, model 1 or 2 railroads, maybe 1950 to 1975....If you choose small Steam, or small Diesels, you could get away with 054 or 063 curve diameter...Remember, Railroads start small and Grow.

In comparison, if you Join a Nice Country Club to Play Golf, (Golf Clubs and balls are Expensive) well, that's also costly. If you buy a nice Boat,(Wow, HUGH investment) and lots of fishing Gear, well, that's also Costly...If you look at Model Railroading like that, it's not that costly. 

Yes, we must consider our wives opinion, (Cheaper to Keep HER), but when we are working on our trains, we are at Home....When I am in the basement, I am under her feet, so to speak......For the record, my wife is not into trains, but she supports my love for trains...Actually, I win a lot of trains????....

Lionel, MTH, ATLAS O, 3Rd RAIL, SUNSET MODELS, really hold a good resale Value.

GOOD LUCK, You will me a lot of great people, You will have a lot of Fun..

Old Chinese proverb - Longest journey begins with first small step.  Do something, ACT.  Clean the room, paint the walls, seal the floor.  Buy the wood, sooner or later you will have a few hours (not necessarily together) to work on the frame work.  Lay some track, run a train.  From there add track, scenery and soon you will have a layout.  BUT if you don't act, sure as God made little green apples you will not have a layout.  It doesn't have to be perfect, few ever are.   You can always take it up and start all over. Make decisions, and if one or two are wrong, so what? If you make a few mistakes, so what?  But DO something.    Ten minutes on the Internet is ten minutes not spent joining wood together for part of the frame.  Thirty minutes on the Internet is thirty minutes not spent laying track or wiring the layout.  An hour on the Internet is sixty minutes not spent working on or testing your railroad.  Everyone has the same amount of time.  Your choice how you use it.   John in Lansing, ILL

Me it's space at the moment. I do have about 5' x 8' area but I also have to make it high enough for some things like the laundry baskets and a shelving unit 3' high to fit under there also, among other things she thinks needs to be in here as she doesn't have room for. I need to do a couple of things then I can start working on my new area. ( my garage ) But then money comes in lol. Most of I can do but will need a electrician as I'am going to need to upgrade my panel box in the house to a bigger amp one I think it's like 80 or 110 at present ( yes I know very little about electric. ) I do know how to run and hook up outlets and lights but getting a bigger panel box and rewiring it, is another thing. What I do do thou I will have him recheck all I have done. I hope in the garage to have 2 outlets per breaker. Will also have to run a line from the house to power the panel box in the garage. Closing the garage off I can do. Cutting a doorway into the garage from storage room connected to it so I have access, from what I see I might as well find some to do that as by time I rent the saw and all I won't be saving that much. Especially once I drive about 60 miles each way to get it and return it. 

for me Space Time and Money all factor in here

Power - both Electric and Physical

Most home electric services are 100 Amp 220 volt , an All-Electric home should be 200 amp 220.

My house was built in 1940 with 30 Amp 110 volt service and only two breakers of 15 amp each.

I want to upgrade but so many other things need to be fix also.

If was younger and had the physical stamina I once had i would be done by now.

I only lived in this house since 1986, (30 + years).

Rattler21, "Old Chinese proverb - Longest journey begins with first small step."  You've been watching too many Charlie Chan movies. LOL

Don

For someone just starting out, it's got to be money. I started with Lionel back in the '50's (when there were such things as after-Christmas clearance sales), went H0 in the '60's (BIG mistake, but at least it was cheaper), back to Lionel in the '70's with MPC (and fortunately had always kept my original childhood trains), and on to Williams and MTH in the '80's & '90's. Today, I couldn't afford to start out with the $1k+ engines being made.

For awhile in the '80's & '90's G gauge was affordable to a lot of people starting out, but today it seems that the prices have gone up beyond most budgets as well (except for the really cheap sets with plastic track). 

But enough weeping and wailing for the past. Used trains of any manufacturer or gauge are available at a fraction of original cost, and a layout can be carefully designed to fit almost any space (just look at some layouts here on the forum: mounted on doors / shelves / modules, etc.). Just take it slow and thoughtful.

Space, unless you want a toy train layout. And by that I mean 1/4"/ft. equipment. All other gauges except O are scale or near to scale.

My opinion, space. You never seem to have enough. You are always saying to yourself, boy if I could just ?

Space and Funds to do everything you want to do.

It's a lot easier to buy stuff for that future layout than it is to actually work on it.

Dennis Rempel posted:

It's a lot easier to buy stuff for that future layout than it is to actually work on it.

Now that is some scary truth!

Hmmm.  Biggest obstacle, maybe spending a month trying to figure out whether to use Lionel's or MTH's proprietary command system.....  They kind of force you to take sides don't they?

My biggest obstacle is ME.  We moved into our house 5 yrs ago and I had great plans for my railroad.  WE own the house with  no mortgage payment.  We have no credit card debt, no car payments, just sold my boat and slip at the marina and am retired with nothing but time on my hands.   I have all the trains I'll ever need and have a nice finished 12' X 17' room in the basement that's heated in the winter and a/c in the summer.  To top it off my wife has been on my back to get started on the layout.  I can't use the excuse of not enough money, nor can I say I don't have the time or space so YES, my biggest obstacle is ME.  How do I get past ME? 

]MONEY.......I don't know of ANY kids (and VERY FEW adults) walking the earth who have an extra $400 or $1400 just laying around to buy a new engine.  Even a used one at $200-$300 is spendy.  $50 for a boxcar??  or $100 for a passenger coach??  Get realistic!  Those prices are driving people AWAY from hobbies like this!!!   The train MFGs targeted marketing pool is quickly draining of the 60+ year olds who want the biggest, best, or ???  to re-live their childhood, but this time with a layout of glory!!!  Their 401K's that have been converted into a layout are BIG $$$ losers!!!   If you have a family, there won't be much $$$ left to buy ANY o gauge stuff no matter where you look.  For me, I've bought lots of "used" that others consider "old" ie Proto 1 or conventional.  I don't care to run mine thru the "smart" phone or with a wireless system.  This is extra $$$ I can put into something else on the layout.  Standing by the transformer is OK with me..... 

I still have my original 4X8 from my childhood and finally had enough extra $$$ earned to buy a fully sceniced (sp?) 4X10 from a person who needed it gone (to get space!).  I know they took a big $$ loss on it, but its ready to run and the kids and I have fun with it. (here's a piccy)

http://i454.photobucket.com/al.../001_zpsteeeqk0o.jpg

Future plans are to sell it and build something else in the 14 X 14 train room.  No rush on that yet.

SPACE.........You can always buy space anytime by moving or removing parts of a house.  I'm amazed at how many people on this forum have houses WITHOUT basements....(a GREAT place to put a layout!!)

TIME.....Finding time is just a matter of prioritizing.......REALLY!!!!....just how long ARE you going to keep storing everything???

Probably the biggest obstacle is developing a realistic plan.  You have to weigh your goals against your limitations.  Space, money and time are limitations that can be overcome if you adjust your goals to fit the limitations.  Once a plan is developed things fall into place by themselves.  A well planned layout is fun to build and a joy to operate.

Tom

Space and Location

I would say it is knowing what you want, and then finding it.

First modern railroads and their huge engines also don't help, since manufactures always make the current engines and cars, and today they are huge! How many have the space for a O-54 minimum curve engine? Or the towering auto racks, that Lionel had to boost the height of some of the bridges for? Finding a good looking SW1, NW2, 0-4-0 or 0-6-0 in the road name you want is a pain if you want to stay in a small space. The shear drought of modern O-27 equipment new does not help, particularly good looking engines. Used is great, but parts of the west coast where HO is the norm getting affordable, not Marx (or Mar if the person selling does not know of Marx), engines is trickier if you don't Ebay or online. The Rio Grande Lionchief 0-4-0 comes to mind, (produce number 6-83080 if you want to find it) it may not be scale or from a prototype, but looks great running; perfect for an O-27 switching layout. Many have no idea the level of detail you can cram into a small layout, just finding engines to make it work is a pain, since the tended to be old school starter set types.

In the end availability, space and time, are the issues. SCARM removes the issue of layout design.

Procrastination. 

I think it would be difficult to choose just one. IMHO, there are three major issues: money, space, and time.

Thanks for the great replies. I had forgotten "time" as a consideration. But now, being retired, I do have some.  I especially love the late night sessions when I am on a "mission" to complete the phase of a project. I got to bed tried and happy.

No doubt cost. I shake my head when a piece of rolling stock cost almost $90. Love the hobby, but I really pace myself due to the high expense. 

Trying to do too much too fast. Take your time, stay within budget and enjoy the ride.

Rod Miller

Dewey Trogdon posted:

Procrastination. 

I would say space & money being the biggest factors.  

That being said -

Space - I have a 6 x13 layout - would I like something larger, sure but if I had a 20 x20 layout I would say, I'd like something larger.  I'm satisfied with what I have & make the best of the space I have to work with.

Cost - since I decided  to go full O scale on my new layout, I was blown away by the prices for the scale rolling stock!   With some shopping here on the forum & on the bay, I have been able to get a nice collection of scale engines  & cars at a fraction of the cost if they were new.     This is something to take note of though for the manufacturers - The prices of cars & engines are too high.   Watching auctions over the last few months, I have seen the true street price for $75 cars be around $45 or so, as an example.  Lower prices on new items would help bring more trains into the hands of people who can help grow the hobby through exposure. 

Pine Creek Railroad posted:

Michael,

  IMO the biggest obstacle to building  an O Gauge layout is space, no matter how you cut it, you must have the space to build the layout, if you want it in your home.

This.  It was all I could do to make an 8x6 space for my layout, and I was lucky to get that much.  Not all of us have huge basements.

#Rattler21... I took the step. next hurdle, WIFE and $

lol

my NEXT wife will like trains

I'm really surprised how many active forum members don't have a layout to run their model trains on.  I always thought that was the starting point, then buy what you need to execute your plan.  A lot of guys spend years planning and collecting and never get anywhere.  Just put it together.  Start something and stay on it till it's done.  Like any construction project.   Keep beating the horse till it can't offer a whimper.

William 1 posted:

I'm really surprised how many active forum members don't have a layout to run their model trains on.  I always thought that was the starting point, then buy what you need to execute your plan.  A lot of guys spend years planning and collecting and never get anywhere.  Just put it together.  Start something and stay on it till it's done.  Like any construction project.   Keep beating the horse till it can't offer a whimper.

Hi William, I am one of those with out a layout at this time.
This hobby attracts people in many directions. The direction that I went was purchasing old beat-up tin plate trains, then giving them a second chance rather than seeing them go in the garbage. Basically restoring.
I did this with some post-war and now prewar tin-plate which I love.
Research, hunting for the parts and learning the various revisions of the same loco or rolling stock and meeting the people with the same interest. That is why I m always on this forum/learning.
The only time that I ran my trains last year was around the Christmas tree. I was getting all of the engines and rolling stock that I brought back to life and gave them a whirl, It was fun 1.
So I m looking into a small layout with standard and O gauge to enjoy seeing my work run.
Last layout that I had was about 50 years ago (still have those trains) and the time is right.
God willing, I will have something by the end of the year. May not be perfect but it will be mine.

William 1 posted:

I'm really surprised how many active forum members don't have a layout to run their model trains on.  I always thought that was the starting point, then buy what you need to execute your plan.  A lot of guys spend years planning and collecting and never get anywhere.  Just put it together.  Start something and stay on it till it's done.  Like any construction project.   Keep beating the horse till it can't offer a whimper.

I suspect a fair number of people are of a mind that if they waited till they were well on their way to completing a layout (or at least building one to the point of being operational and/or presentable), much of the equipment they'd like to run on it would be beyond a reasonable level of difficulty to acquire.

Is some of what I own still readily available? Sure.

Are most of the items I own that I really  like to see running still readily available?

Ehhhhhh not so much.

---PCJ

I am similar to you RonH.  I had tear  down my layout when I moved and sold almost all my O stuff.  I gathered some nice prewar standard gauge engines, 500 freights and a few of the smaller passenger sets.  I run them on the floor from time to time and am interested in learning how to maintain my engines in top running condition and tinkering as time goes by.  I have all I need and not interested in gathering a large collection.  What I don't get is the guys with mountains of unopened boxes and nowhere to run them.  Like you said, there are different folks who practice different strokes.  Having built three layouts for other people I do know a lot can be accomplished in a relatively short time if you hammer away at it.  Looking at track plans for years gets you nowhere.  Just dig in and do it.

The biggest obstacle to starting an O gauge layout is the carpentry required for the tablework but in my case I had to first start with the construction of the room in the basement. It has been 13 years to this point but the layout is 95% finished.  Completing the lighting and the hookup of the switches are the only remaining items. For success you need to stay in the game

The biggest factor right now is getting the concrete poured for the garage addition. The doggone weather was great in February when we were not ready. Now we are mid-twenties at night in Tidewater Virginia.

Have a "LONG"  list of "to do" items that is slowly being reduced.

Being really new to this group, and looking in Wide eye Amazement at the collection of layouts that true "Hobbyists" skillfully craft, I have a question. If you belong to a club that has a layout that you contribute time to, does that enable club members to collect Engines and rolling stock, all the while running it at the Club? (and not crafting a layout at home?)

There really are no obstacles, only opportunities. Think of "obstacles" more as challenges that can be overcome with planning and creativity. I doubt that the vast majority of those reading this thread have 100% of what they would like to have in the hobby, be it space, time, money, or a number of other things. But a good many of them are here and reading this because they have developed a liking for what the hobby offers and they have willingly taken the plunge. Never a bad thing! 

These are the 2 biggest factors in my opinion.

Money: Model railroading isn't cheap generally speaking. Many people don't understand that its a hobby you build upon as years go on. If you don't mind buying used items, you can generally find some good deals on the forum, eBay, at shows, ect. if you are patient. I believe that some of the prices now are getting a little ridiculous, as a Lionel scale tractor trailer is $89.99 msrp. 

Space: If you are just into running trains and are more into the postwar/railking sized engines and cars, then you can have even a small layout with a lot of action. If you are more into operating your layout like a real railroad or are into operating scale sized equipment, then you need a lot of space. Even a 8'x15' sized layout is generally small and you might want to limit your equipment to small steam/diesel engines and shorter trains. I like o scale but this might be my biggest issue with o scale with money being a close second.

Also want to note I have never used any Lionel system but have MTH's DCS and NCE Power Cab. I like DCC being universally compatible with all the manufacturers and not having to pick and choose a system and being restricted to that brand. This is just my opinion from my years in the hobby.

Good topic, may I add.."Peace"

Sometimes life is so unsettled that hobbies take a back seat, a way back seat.  Do I have unopened stuff in boxes ? oh yeah, but after starting 3  layouts since 1989 and being job-transferred before they got done, then a divorce, I sought peace before I could relax and "do trains".  I am now re-married, have room, a supportive wife, and yes, peace. Our 5 -yr plan is to move & retire elsewhere but for now I am full speed ahead on building a small fun layout right here.

May peace be with you all.

Great answers and a fun thread. I am reminded by Alan's comments of the joke:

Optimist: glass is half full.

Pessimist: glass is half empty.

Engineer: who made the glass too blanking big?

My biggest issues with O gauge are time and money.  When I have time, I don't have money and when I have money, I don't have time.