F3 horn kit 6-8190 instructions

I would strongly suggest testing that old board before installing into the loco.

Connections are simple. there are 2 little post terminals- that's the speaker output.

Red wire is 3rd rail pickup roller and black wire is frame ground which = wheels outer rail.

Also, example of an installed version https://ogrforum.com/...c/103636742462714539

Caution- this is my strong opinion (and this isn't just me alone) that is the worst sounding horn board. There's even topics on it https://ogrforum.com/topic/80973530191590278

I suggested you test that board before even trying to install for 2 reasons, first to make sure it even works, and second, you need to decide if you even should install it based on you liking how it sounds.

I think I would sell that kit, and then get my hands on a Diesel Signalsounds board (example Lionel 818-5015-156 Signal Sounds Board Diesel) , and then using this diagram wire that up and have bell and horn that are 100 times better than that early and I do mean early electronic horn.

Thank you!!!

Here's a video and what the MPC era horn kit sounds like https://youtu.be/yEr5w-RqdoY

Also FWIW, the order of sound boards from least featured not ideal sounding to best.

You have that old school digital horn board and later derivatives. They are horn only and basically 2 oscillators creating a beat frequency.

Then next is Signalsounds. These were modular boards used in many TMCC ready engines and thus people did pull them out and often have them in drawer. Signalsounds as the name implies is only bell and horn or bell and whistle for steam. No other sounds, no prime mover, no crew talk.

Next is Trainsounds. This has prime mover for diesel and chuffing for steam. https://ogrforum.com/topic/79142442627636724

Then you get into full blown Railsounds- and that can be a couple if different boards or motherboards plus plug in cards. The newer boards are the ERR Railsounds kit.

I'm sure I'm leaving out tons of competitors. Example Williams True Blast II is another simple conventional sound card, kind of like Signalsounds. One key difference, it always plays the same horn sequence rather than short controlled toot. Then there is the newer True Blast Plus series, they include prime mover sounds and are more advanced. Then there are all kinds of other brands and boards, I could not even begin to list them all.

Ok looking to buy a few of these 818 ones now. Question since there is bell/whistle is the hookup same as indicated and what kind of controller is required?  are the bell & whistle independently controlled or one button and they both operate?  thanks!

I picked up a pair of the 6-8190 diesel horn boards at a train show a few years ago. 2 for $4 with a speaker. One works, meaning it makes a sound that could be broadly interpreted as a horn. 😬  The other doesn’t.  There are what appears to be two potentiometers on the board. One shows clearly in the photo that Vernon Barry posted above. It’s next to the speaker terminals. The board that works has what looks like wax on the potentiometers. The one that doesn’t work has no wax. Are these adjustments to try and tune the sound?  Just curious.

John

                                                                  @Vernon Barry I am not sure how to post to you direct? thank you for the great info. I have a large fleet of postwar F3's . boxes of shells, frames, motors etc. I want to upgrade them to the 818 info you sent. What is the best Whistle controller to use? I have a bunch of the ZW transformers with the whistle slide button. However, i am not sure if that is the best controller to use? your recommendation is greatly appreciated.

thanks George

Yes, they tune the frequency of the 2 oscillator circuits. You can make it sound really obnoxious if you want.

The thing to keep in mind on a lot of these older circuit boards, capacitors have a limited lifetime. Over time they often lose capacitance and worst case, if they had the bad electrolyte formula, they leak and fail. The problem then is, a shorting or failing capacitor puts loads on the semiconductors of the circuit (transistors and diodes) and then they fail too. Some of these boards might be 30 years or more old.

A slightly more modern version of this board (Not in stock )https://www.lionelsupport.com/PCB-ELECTRONIC-HORN

@George10404 posted:

                                                                  @Vernon Barry I am not sure how to post to you direct? thank you for the great info. I have a large fleet of postwar F3's . boxes of shells, frames, motors etc. I want to upgrade them to the 818 info you sent. What is the best Whistle controller to use? I have a bunch of the ZW transformers with the whistle slide button. However, i am not sure if that is the best controller to use? your recommendation is greatly appreciated.

thanks George

Pretty much any normal whistle controller will work that creates the DC offset. So sure, the older copper disk diode style can work. That said, you only have one or the other (Horn VS Bell )depending on polarity.

I personally kind of like some of the K-line add on whistle controllers that went between the transformer and the track. Lionel made some really cheap ones that won't handle much current so either way- always recommend a good circuit breaker or fuse between your transformer and anything connected to the transformer. There are also DIY build yourself versions https://ogrforum.com/...07#76185252841267907

As far as Signalsounds goes, one thing to know is the label on the chip can help you know if it is steam or diesel.

SS3A= Diesel

SS4D= Steam

Note, The 818 board is for DC G scale. It will blow up if you wire it to AC. G scale used a special controller.

@Chuck Sartor posted:

Note, The 818 board is for DC G scale. It will blow up if you wire it to AC. G scale used a special controller.

Fair enough, I was just trying to grab a generic picture. The one I have on hand that came out of a C420 has the same heatsink.

Search for Signalsounds at Lionel parts. https://www.lionelsupport.com/...eywords=signalsounds

Are these 2 AC compatible?

Or is only the 691PCB104A  AC compatible?

@Chuck Sartor posted:

Note, The 818 board is for DC G scale. It will blow up if you wire it to AC. G scale used a special controller.

I depend on you folks who have been doing the longer the I have for some of the historical facts like compatibility that are not obvious or in documentation that I found. So again, I take you on your word and experience.

That said, then there is a conflict in the Lionel Parts breakdown https://www.lionelsupport.com/...20-1900-2000-6-21952

It lists the 818.

I have that engine, and that is where I used the takeout board (I upgraded that engine to full Railsounds and CC) in just such a retrofit  install with AC power to add horn/bell to another conventional engine.

Again, I just want to be giving good advice and correct part numbers, so please don't take me asking as just trying to argue with you, I want to get my answers straight and be providing the best info to others.

The person who took the photographs just grabbed a look alike board for the sound board since it is listed as out of stock. The description list 'LS' Large scale.