1976

Bill, welcome to Duloc.

Chris S.

An "auto-feed tender"????????

The Tennessee Valley RR put a tender behind the 4501 with an auger to feed the coal to the firebox - no class at all.  The newest tender (third I know of) is also larger.

Odenville Bill posted:

The Tennessee Valley RR put a tender behind the 4501 with an auger to feed the coal to the firebox - no class at all. 

Didn't 4501 have a mechanical stoker in service?  According to Locomotive Wiki the Southern's M class 2-8-2's were given stokers in the 1930's.

If not, then it's a little more complicated than just "putting a tender on with an auger."

I'd be willing to bet the firemen appreciate the mechanical stoker.

It's still not totally "automatic."  You still have to use the shovel to touch up the fire when needed.  The fireman still needs to know what he's doing.

Rusty

Forget where I heard it, but I believe not all of the locomotives in that class received mechanical stokers, and 4501 was one of them.

Rusty Traque posted:

Odenville Bill posted:

The Tennessee Valley RR put a tender behind the 4501 with an auger to feed the coal to the firebox - no class at all. 

Didn't 4501 have a mechanical stoker in service?

Maybe when in "regular service" on the Southern Rwy, but NOT on the Kentucky & Tennessee RR. I remember being down there when Mr. Paul Merman (sp) was purchasing K&T #12, which was originally SRR #4501. I tried my hand at hand firing her quite a number of times, but the crap coal fuel that the K&T was using, made it a truly back breaking job. I really don't know how the K&T regular Fireman/Firemen were able to keep up on the steep ascending grade up into Sterns, KY, where the interchange with the SRR was.  

  According to Locomotive Wiki the Southern's M class 2-8-2's were given stokers in the 1930's.

If not, then it's a little more complicated than just "putting a tender on with an auger."

I'd be willing to bet the firemen appreciate the mechanical stoker.

It's still not totally "automatic."  You still have to use the shovel to touch up the fire when needed.  The fireman still needs to know what he's doing.

Absolutely CORRECT!

Rusty

What it was in the past, what it is today, I cannot say.  When that picture was taken in 1976 two men, including myself, hand stoked that engine from Birmingham to Chattanooga.  I would pay to have that honor again.  My father was the Road Forman of Engines and he personally supervised operations every time the 4501 or NW 611 ran on the Crescent Division tracks of the Southern Railroad.  The 611 had (has) a mechanical stoker.

The 4501 was hand fired back in the seventies when it ran an excursion on our line. They used two firemen on that trip.

Hi Bill: Welcome to the OGR Forum, & sharing your historic photo.

Original:

Color corrected with Adobe Photoshop:

Gary: Rail-fan

Thanks Gary

Odenville Bill posted:

Thanks Gary

Hey Bill: Your welcome. If you want the original file that made this color correction. Please hit me up with an e-mail, found on my profile page. I will e-mail you the file and you can take it any place to get printed on color photo paper. Even Wal-Mart can get it right, sometimes.

Gary: Rail-fan

Mechanical yes, automatic no.

The fireman has to manipulate the stoker controls and adjust the firing rate to match the demand for steam, in addition to touching up the fire by hand.

There is nothing automatic about the process whatsoever.

Bill, Welcome to the O Gauge Railroading Forum!  That is a great photograph you shared of your experience back in '76 when we were lot younger.  You have lived an experience most of us would have liked to have.  Although at 62, I don't want to shovel coal from Birmingham to Chattanooga.    I had American Freedom Train on my mind when I saw the title of your topic.  Silly me!

Bill,

Did you ever fire for an engineer named Howard Spurgeon? He sometimes ran 4501 over the Tennessee Division (Sheffield to Chattanooga) and the Alabama Division (Sheffield to Birmingham). I know he also ran it from Sheffield back to Iuka, Miss. I thought you might have crossed paths. Howard was a great family friend and my earliest mentor about railroading when I was a kid.

George

Rusty Traque posted:

Odenville Bill posted:

The Tennessee Valley RR put a tender behind the 4501 with an auger to feed the coal to the firebox - no class at all. 

Didn't 4501 have a mechanical stoker in service?  According to Locomotive Wiki the Southern's M class 2-8-2's were given stokers in the 1930's.

If not, then it's a little more complicated than just "putting a tender on with an auger."

I'd be willing to bet the firemen appreciate the mechanical stoker.

It's still not totally "automatic."  You still have to use the shovel to touch up the fire when needed.  The fireman still needs to know what he's doing.

Rusty

That's an excellent illustration of how a stocker works.  On the right, in the illustration there are members marked as "Pushers".  I presume they are moving pieces that help move the coal toward the auger pit.  However, I cannot see how or what moved them.

4501 never had a stoker until TVRM added it and a feedwater heater 4(??) years or so ago.

If I remember correctly 4501 currently has a modified tender from a Central of Georgia K class "Big Apple" 4-8-4.  4501's original smaller tender while on the K&T is behind Southern (TVRM) 2-8-0 630.  630's smaller tender is at TVRM not currently being used (or wasn't)

Dan Padova posted:

Rusty Traque posted:

Odenville Bill posted:

The Tennessee Valley RR put a tender behind the 4501 with an auger to feed the coal to the firebox - no class at all. 

Didn't 4501 have a mechanical stoker in service?  According to Locomotive Wiki the Southern's M class 2-8-2's were given stokers in the 1930's.

If not, then it's a little more complicated than just "putting a tender on with an auger."

I'd be willing to bet the firemen appreciate the mechanical stoker.

It's still not totally "automatic."  You still have to use the shovel to touch up the fire when needed.  The fireman still needs to know what he's doing.

Rusty

That's an excellent illustration of how a stocker works.  On the right, in the illustration there are members marked as "Pushers".  I presume they are moving pieces that help move the coal toward the auger pit.  However, I cannot see how or what moved them.

A large compressed air powered cylinder moved the coal pusher, when activated by the Fireman. Many railroads equipped their tender slope sheets with coal pushers.

tncentrr posted:

Bill,

Did you ever fire for an engineer named Howard Spurgeon? He sometimes ran 4501 over the Tennessee Division (Sheffield to Chattanooga) and the Alabama Division (Sheffield to Birmingham). I know he also ran it from Sheffield back to Iuka, Miss. I thought you might have crossed paths. Howard was a great family friend and my earliest mentor about railroading when I was a kid.

George

Hi George,

I only got to fire  on one trip from Birmingham to Chattanooga.  I'm sure my father would know Howard.