I did a favor for someone and he brought me these two beautiful pictures of engines still in service today . He took these photos himself and told me some info about these engines , but unfortunately I can't remember what he told me.lol I'm pretty sure he said something about a narrow gauge line
I will hang these up in my new train room someday , maybe you guys can shed some light on these engines.
Thanks, Alex
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Nice photos, i have seen these Locos in person and in 2 1/2 inch scale
Alex,
Those are ex-Denver & Rio Grande narrow gauge Mikados now running on tourist railroads - Durango & Silverton in Colorado and the Cumbres & Toltec in Arizona. You may have seen them many times on the History Channel or other historical documentaries for 19th century topics.
Just for info, the Cumbres & Toltec is the best train trip we have ever taken. Super friendly folks and great trip. Don
Cumbres & Toltec is a beautiful ride and you can wander around in the shops and yard and it runs in the states of New Mexico and Colorado.
Beautiful engines, love the snow plow/cow catchers.
Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Beautiful engines, love the snow plow/cow catchers.
That is a "Snow Plow Pilot", no catching of cows involved!
scale rail posted:Just for info, the Cumbres & Toltec is the best train trip we have ever taken. Super friendly folks and great trip. Don
Great photo Don; what camera did you use?
Hot Water posted:Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Beautiful engines, love the snow plow/cow catchers.
That is a "Snow Plow Pilot", no catching of cows involved!
On the one engine, yes. The other pictured has a cow catcher, I was speaking about both engines.
Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Hot Water posted:Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Beautiful engines, love the snow plow/cow catchers.
That is a "Snow Plow Pilot", no catching of cows involved!
On the one engine, yes. The other pictured has a cow catcher, I was speaking about both engines.
Still, they are ALL "Pilots". There haven't be "cow catchers" since before the 1860s.
"Cow catcher" is an archaic term generally used by non-railroaders.
J Daddy posted:smd4 posted:"Cow catcher" is an archaic term generally used by non-railroaders.
Odd. My Great Grandfather always called it a Cow Catcher.... He was a conductor on the PRR. before WW2.
Yes, that is certainly ODD.
Pilots are the whole section at the front of the train are they not? Cowcatchers, plows, footboards, whatever. It is a cowcatcher if it looks like one. I am sure that some engines(steam) that were produced overseas(Europe/Asia), still would have the cowcatcher pilot. Found those on the web since I'm at work.
Aside from pilot variations, weren't some snow plows(like the one I have pictured) detachable? I think I remember seeing in either MR a picture of a real steam engine(like the ones Alex posted) that the modeler had made attachable/detachable pilot snowplows(not the big heavy snowplow pushed in front of the engine), ever see that type?
You can all use whatever terms you want. Seriously. You can couple two General engines together in a lashup and drive them (when you pull the accelerator), while pulling some Madison cars as the cow catcher clears the way.
As long as you realize every one who knows anything at all about trains and railroading will be thinking to themselves how to avoid contact with you and your foam, then feel free to throw about the terms that you think are the most accurate.
Growing up here in England it was always a "cow catcher" - it made American engines so cool!
MIKE
smd4 posted:You can all use whatever terms you want. Seriously. You can couple two General engines together in a lashup and drive them (when you pull the accelerator), while pulling some Madison cars as the cow catcher clears the way.
Have you ever seen a detachable plow though Steve? I don't know if the modeler was just making something from nothing so he could attach and detach to his choosing or if it was real.
Yes, there are detachable plows.
(If you search Google Images for "Durango Silverton 481," for example, you will see pictures of this engine number with and without a snow plow).
Kerrigan, Thank you. It was taken with my first digital Nikon, I think it was numbered D70? Not sure. I use a Nikon D7100 now. I took me a long time to switch from film. Don
Sometimes the cow catcher didn't work. Viewer discretion advised!!!
Yeah, I think they really never worked(they don't catch cows, more like brush them aside). Maybe they worked with the very early steam locomotives when they made the impressive speeds of a few miles under or around 10MPH. Odd thing is, older steam engines actually seemed to have longer cowcatchers than those of the early 20th Century. Odd indeed.
A number of years ago when the Grand Canyon RR was still running steam everyday, we hit a cow going back to Williams. The engineer was really letting her run fast. We didn't brush aside a cow, we exploded it. Don
Hi Scalerail, or Don, I can relate to exploded cows. The Conrail section gang I worked with (on the EL side) back in the seventies was called to dispose of two cows hit by a train. The first Black Angus merely got hit on the side of the head and was relatively easy to roll in the clear. Black Angus number two was precisely dissected at the diaphragm and smeared herself for about 50 yards on the main. I found it odd that the only two of us on the gang who were not sickened by it all were not farmers.
An old anecdote from Joseph Noble's book, " From Cab to Caboose" comes to mind. A farmer brought suit to recover damages for his deceased cow, and the train's engineer was called to the stand. Attorney: "When was the first time you saw the cow?" Engineer: " The cow was coming through the alfalfa." Attorney: "When was the next time?" Engineer: "The alfalfa was coming through the Cow!"
On that note, I would say this was a great book otherwise, concerning a man's fifty year career in Maintenance of Way on the Santa Fe. Don Francis
There is a video out there showing a C&TS train encountering a herd of cattle. One of them is actually dragged under the locomotive. Wouldn't have wanted to be a crewman on that train!
"As long as you realize every one who knows anything at all about trains and railroading will be thinking to themselves how to avoid contact with you and your foam,"
Good to know that you modest, thoughtful folks have stringent rules about this.
I just need to know how many rivets are on it.
Landsteiner posted:"As long as you realize every one who knows anything at all about trains and railroading will be thinking to themselves how to avoid contact with you and your foam,"
Good to know that you modest, thoughtful folks have stringent rules about this.
We are thoughtful--thoughtful enough to think about using the right words when talking about a specialized subject.
Why the insistence on using incorrect terminology? Do you like sounding like you don't know what you're talking about? Does using the wrong terms on purpose make you feel superior?
All I'm saying is that if you engage in conversation with a real railroader, and want to come across as knowledgeable, using the wrong term will immediately identify you as someone who is only tangentially interested in the subject. Which seems to possibly be what you want.
There is no need to be a douche nozzle about it, though. The term has been used by someone with knowledge on the subject as late as 2016:
"Hubris and the Cowcatcher by John H. White Jr.". Railroad History. Pflugerville, Texas: Railway & Locomotive Historical Society (215): 86–91. Fall–Winter 2016.
Perfect example of Internet idiocy. Alex posts a nice thread about photos and a desire to learn about it, and some of you get into an argument about who knows more about some stupid ****.
Couldn't agree more. BTW, those are really nice photos.
"engage in conversation with a real railroader"
Its nice to be enlightened but not talked down to.... seems the conversation is always terse and short with certain "real railroaders" on this forum.... is that the way all real railroaders treat people who are interested in trains?
I have many of friends and family that work or worked for the railroad... and they never speak to me or our train model club that way.
I'm a noob and I pretty much pester the engineer and conductor at the Manitowoc yard on a fairly regular basis. They have never talked down to me or been anything but kind and generous with their time. They sound the horn for my son and wave in nearly every video I take. I've met other rail fans who have been equally kind and informative. It's only here on the OGR that I've found people that demean others in order to lift themselves up, showing some sort of "superior" knowledge or insight.
smd4 posted:Landsteiner posted:"As long as you realize every one who knows anything at all about trains and railroading will be thinking to themselves how to avoid contact with you and your foam,"
Good to know that you modest, thoughtful folks have stringent rules about this.
We are thoughtful--thoughtful enough to think about using the right words when talking about a specialized subject.
Why the insistence on using incorrect terminology? Do you like sounding like you don't know what you're talking about? Does using the wrong terms on purpose make you feel superior?
All I'm saying is that if you engage in conversation with a real railroader, and want to come across as knowledgeable, using the wrong term will immediately identify you as someone who is only tangentially interested in the subject. Which seems to possibly be what you want.
I think the superiority came in when you referred to "you and your foam." I do not usually comment on these types of posts, but referring to someone's comments as foam is certainly not thoughtful in any way.
AlexM, sorry your thread has gotten so far off topic. That is an awesome gift and will look awesome hanging on the wall some day. My son and I got to tour the Amtrak Office Car the President of the railroad uses for travel. My son received several awesome Amtrak posters that are now hanging in his room!
Back on subject: nice photos ... what camera did you use, Don?
CArolina Shagger posted:Sometimes the cow catcher didn't work. Viewer discretion advised!!!
Caught it pretty good, eh?
Nice Gesture? Sorry, I thought you said Jester. 
scale rail posted:Just for info, the Cumbres & Toltec is the best train trip we have ever taken. Super friendly folks and great trip. Don
We have had the same experience with them, Don. And the C&T is an authentic mountain railroad, with 3% grades. They use retainers coming downgrade.
You won't find as much "real man's railroading" on any other tourist railroad. It is a long ride on no-nonsense narrow gauge equipment with very competent crews.
I had just the opposite experience. Last time I rode the Durango & Silverton I was told that I must remain in my seat while the train was in motion.
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