And Another Train Derailment . . .

The way the world is today. You can't help wonder about potential sabotage. Especially when it's tank cars involved.

I presume they investigate for this?

I've been waiting for someone to comment on the runaway out in Calif.

@Big Jim posted:

I've been waiting for someone to comment on the runaway out in Calif.

Right. A portion (55 cars) of a very long & heavy loaded iron ore train, ran away and left the track at something 118 MPH. Reportedly the crew jumped off well in advance.

@RickO posted:

The way the world is today. You can't help wonder about potential sabotage. Especially when it's tank cars involved.

I presume they investigate for this?

Sabotage is a possibility, but for my money, profiteering, cost cutting, and lax maintenance policies are much more likely.

@Number 90 posted:

All I can say about this one is that it was not caused by train handling.  It is not a collision with another train, or with cars fouling the main track, so that points toward possible track mechanical causes.  This line has good track, but winter on the northern prairies is tough.  There have been a lot of lengthy deep freezes in southwestern Minnesota this year, and that kind of an environment can cause steel to become brittle and hidden defects can cause things to break.

Anyway, the town is not on fire and ethanol burns cleanly, so those are fortunately not factors this time.

Tom,

Thanks for posting this today.  I was thinking about this while driving this afternoon and wondered what the folks on the forum would be saying.  I immediately reached the same conclusion regarding ethanol -- pretty safe as far as spill hazards go.  I read something the other day that said derailments happen more often than we think but are usually nothing to worry about. But then others are more concerned.  Is there a real threat to our major cities or is the media making it bigger than it needs to be?  I know in Chicago, for example, this is issue is getting some press.

Mike

@IRON HORSE posted:

Tom,

Is there a real threat to our major cities or is the media making it bigger than it needs to be?  I know in Chicago, for example, this is issue is getting some press.

Mike

My suggestion is to look back to the time before the horrible derailment and chemical fire in Ohio last month.  That was really bad, created a threat to local residents, and was handled very poorly by Norfolk Southern, which, while trying to help affected residents, was almost invisible on media.

But, before that, when was the last time you recall seeing news of a derailment threatening a major city or a small town?

Right now, train derailments are newsworthy, so there are many in media and politics who are reacting, but who have not done anything to learn about train derailments.  There is no 100% foolproof solution to safely handling hazardous materials on any mode of transportation.  Their description -- hazardous -- is an alert that -- if mishandled -- they can create a hazard.  However, cautionary and preventative practices greatly reduce those hazards.  When prudent safeguards are included in regulations and voluntary practices, almost all hazardous material shipments are perfectly executed.  Think of all the truckloads and railroad carloads of hazardous material that pass through your area without incident every day.

"Perfect storm" situations very seldom happen, but they can, even though diligent derailment safeguards are in place.  Still, that is little comfort to citizens who are injured, killed, or must evacuate their homes because of a release of hazardous materials from any carrier or any facility.

@RoyBoy posted:

Sabotage is a possibility, but for my money, profiteering, cost cutting, and lax maintenance policies are much more likely.

On the rare occasions when sabotage has occurred, it is obvious soon after the initial investigation.  It is very, very rare.

RoyBoy, I have to wonder what causes you to generally assume that maintenance policies are lax?  How many railcars are not maintained to Federal Code standards?  How much track is under-maintained?  There are FRA Track and Mechanical Inspectors who make frequent inspections to assure compliance.

Maintenance compliance is better on some railroads than on others.  The railroad I worked for was committed to high maintenance standards, many of which were well in excess of minimum Federal or AAR standards, yet we still had occasional broken rails or broken wheels or failed bearings.  We enforced our rules, and did not tolerate winking at unsafe practices in order to get things done more quickly.  I'm not sure what has formed your opinion, but Penn Central and the 1960's are long in the past.

@Number 90 posted:

But, before that, when was the last time you recall seeing news of a derailment threatening a major city or a small town?

Right now, train derailments are newsworthy, so there are many in media and politics who are reacting, but who have not done anything to learn about train derailments.  

Tom,

I see from your profile that you spent your career in railroading.  Great topic from you.  And thoughtful responses.  This is exactly the kind of commentary I've wanted to hear.  As a business guy, I know it's in the best interest of the rail companies to prevent derailments because of the costs involved and the optics.  I'm sure Norfolk Southern is on high alert to prevent further derailments and fix the situation.  It's the prudent thing for them to do from a pure business standpoint, which includes their impact on the communities they are running trains through.  Moreover, they must realize if they don't do enough, they can surely expect further regulation from the government, which seems likely unavoidable now due to the impact and outrage over the Ohio accident. 

You asked, "when was the last time you recall seeing news of a derailment threatening a major city or a small town?"    This question reminds me of how safe airlines have become considering the sheer volume of planes that are in the sky at any given moment.  Statistically, I would guess trains and planes are significantly safer than our nation's highways and it's probably a huge amount.  That's why pipelines make sense, too. 

Mike

@Number 90 posted:

  I'm not sure what has formed your opinion, but Penn Central and the 1960's are long in the past.

So is Milwaukee road.My favorite railroad, but they did not put as much into maintenance as they could have.

Riding Amtrak's coast starlight a few years back, we pulled onto a siding. The adjacent rail was totally crumbled on the inner edge where the wheel flanges run.

IMO, many corporations run with the minimum of expenditure seeking the maximum of profit.

Do I know about how every corporation operates? No, but I have seen more than enough to form opinions. And they are just that - my opinions which I sometimes express freely and sometimes keep to myself.