Base 3 will NOT connect to home wifi - HELP!

You can try connecting using the App with these instructions.  That's how I did it.

JOIN to NETWORK Mode (no WPS)

I also had success using the "No WPS" method. I'd been solid since

That worked, thanks guys.

My experience with WPS for a variety of products has been so-so, it's not just Lionel products that have problems with WPS.  Unless there's no other way, I don't use WPS.

@MartyE posted:

You can try connecting using the App with these instructions.  That's how I did it.

JOIN to NETWORK Mode (no WPS)

SO FAR:

Was able to connect CAB2 to BASE3

Was able to connect CAB1L to BASE3

Was able to make a BASE3 Backup Foile on a MOdule from my Computer.

Was able to input Engines Manually into BASE3 from my CAB2

Was able to installl BLUETOOTH App to my Smartphone OK, and it works!!

When I try to connect my App with the New BASE3 on my Smart Phone, it sez:

NO BASE3 UNIT AVAILABLE:  Make sure CAB3 has permission to access Local Network.  When I go into my NETWORKS on my Computer, its there. When I try to Connect, it sez Can't Connect.

HELP. HELP. HELP

FREDSTRAINS

Is your Smart Phone App on the 5 GHz or the 2.4 GHz WiFi band?

They must match or you will not find the BASE 3, it's on the 2.4 GHz band.

@Fredstrains posted:

SO FAR:

When I try to connect my App with the New BASE3 on my Smart Phone, it sez:

NO BASE3 UNIT AVAILABLE:  Make sure CAB3 has permission to access Local Network.  When I go into my NETWORKS on my Computer, its there. When I try to Connect, it sez Can't Connect.

HELP. HELP. HELP

FREDSTRAINS

What type of device are you using and is the Base3 switched to AP or Network?

@AlanRail posted:

Is your Smart Phone App on the 5 GHz or the 2.4 GHz WiFi band?

They must match or you will not find the BASE 3, it's on the 2.4 GHz band.

Where do i find this info?  AND I am on the "AP" on BASE3     The phone is an Apple"XR"

@Fredstrains posted:

Where do i find this info?  AND I am on the "AP" on BASE3

On your smart device make sure you are connected to the "Base3" network.  On an Apple under settings, go to WiFi, and a list of available networks will appear.  Select the “Lionel Base3 – NNNN”.  The “NNNN” represents the last 4 digits of the Base3’s Wi-Fi radio MAC address. This is unique to each Base3.

This should connect you to Base3.  I'm not sure how this works on Android or other devices but I suspect it's very similar.

Access Point Mode

@skantner posted:

I believe the iphone XR is 802.11ac, which is 5Ghz only.  Base3 definitely supports 2.4Ghz, but not sure about 5Ghz.

802.11ac supports both bands. That phone supports AC as well as all of the legacy Wi-Fi protocols (a/b/g/n). It would be a very bad idea to make a phone that doesn't support 2.4GHz as that is still the most used and legacy band used when it comes to Wi-Fi.

OK I just seen that you cannot connect to the home WiFi so follow these instructions...

JOIN to NETWORK Mode (WPS)  or

JOIN to NETWORK Mode (no WPS)

If you're sure the Base3 is connected to the home Wi-Fi and that your phone is also connected to the home Wi-Fi, one thing that some home Wi-Fi routers have is band isolation.

It basically means that devices connected to the 2.4 GHz band can't talk directly to devices on the 5 GHz band. It's meant to increase security but it often gets in the way.

If the phone is connected to the one band and the Base3 is connected to the other, this could be your issue.

You can try to see if you can turn off band isolation. Instructions for this will depend on your Wi-Fi router model.

Another option would be to disable the 5 GHz band on either your phone or on the Wi-Fi router. Since we know the Base3 only talks on the 2.4 GHz band, that should guarantee they are all in the same band and that would rule out band isolation.

@Fredstrains posted:

When I try to connect my App with the New BASE3 on my Smart Phone, it sez:

NO BASE3 UNIT AVAILABLE:  Make sure CAB3 has permission to access Local Network.  When I go into my NETWORKS on my Computer, its there. When I try to Connect, it sez Can't Connect.

HELP. HELP. HELP

FREDSTRAINS

This definitely tells me it's in Access Point mode. At minimum when in AP your phone should find the "Lionel Base3 – NNNN" and be able to connect. If you are using an Apple device, another thing to check is the following...

Settings > scroll down until you see Cab3 listed. Tap to open that menu and make sure "Local Network" is on.

Once you get connected in AP mode follow the instructions to join to the Network.

@Fredstrains posted:

When I try to connect my App with the New BASE3 on my Smart Phone, it sez:

NO BASE3 UNIT AVAILABLE:  Make sure CAB3 has permission to access Local Network.  When I go into my NETWORKS on my Computer, its there. When I try to Connect, it sez Can't Connect.

@MartyE posted:

This definitely tells me it's in Access Point mode.

Marty,

If he can see the Base3 from his computer when browsing the network, would that mean it's successfully connected to the home Wi-Fi?

Is it possible to connect to home wifi  network using usb port on base3

@rplst8 posted:

Marty,

If he can see the Base3 from his computer when browsing the network, would that mean it's successfully connected to the home Wi-Fi?

He said when he looks "my networks" on his computer he sees Base3. This tells me it's in AP mode and showing like any other network AP device generating an SSID.

It's like being on a laptop and seeing available networks on the WiFi.

@MartyE posted:

He said when he looks "my networks" on his computer he sees Base3. This tells me it's in AP mode and showing like any other network AP device generating an SSID.

It's like being on a laptop and seeing available networks on the WiFi.

I see it but when I click on connect it sez; can’t connect!   Playing last nite, it came up & Even saw my new Roster !! However don’t know how I did it.
Now I can’t duplicate it!  One thing I did notice , in the computer WI-FI File it said not connected while it was working??!

@Fredstrains posted:

I see it but when I click on connect it sez; can’t connect!   Playing last nite, it came up & Even saw my new Roster !! However don’t know how I did it.
Now I can’t duplicate it!  One thing I did notice , in the computer WI-FI File it said not connected while it was working??!

What computer are you seeing this on?  A MAC or PC?  I'm a little confused as to why the computer is involved.  Right now there isn't really a reason to have the computer connected.

Do you have an LCS WiFi module installed?  If so remove it.  You might be connecting to it.

I just need some clarification... Are you trying to use the App in Access Point Mode "AP" or "Network" ? 

@rplst8 posted:

If you're sure the Base3 is connected to the home Wi-Fi and that your phone is also connected to the home Wi-Fi, one thing that some home Wi-Fi routers have is band isolation.

It basically means that devices connected to the 2.4 GHz band can't talk directly to devices on the 5 GHz band. It's meant to increase security but it often gets in the way.

If the phone is connected to the one band and the Base3 is connected to the other, this could be your issue.

You can try to see if you can turn off band isolation. Instructions for this will depend on your Wi-Fi router model.

Another option would be to disable the 5 GHz band on either your phone or on the Wi-Fi router. Since we know the Base3 only talks on the 2.4 GHz band, that should guarantee they are all in the same band and that would rule out band isolation.

Band isolation is not a likely scenario. Most consumer routers don't offer it and the ones that do don't turn it on by default to avoid problems as you described. Not to say that it can't be done but doing so (especially for consumer-grade products) would generate many support calls to the manufacturer.

If one follows the out of box instructions to configure their Dlink, Asus, TPlink, etc. router, Devices attached to the 2.4 & 5 GHz bands will communicate with each other seamlessly.

Now AP isolation could be an issue if someone has taken the time to setup a guest wifi network and turned on AP isolation, which will only grant internet access to devices attached to those guest networks and block those devices from communicating with the original primary networks (configured when they purchased the router) and possibly other devices connected to the same guest network (client isolation).

@H1000 posted:

Band isolation is not a likely scenario. Most consumer routers don't offer it and the ones that do don't turn it on by default to avoid problems as you described. Not to say that it can't be done but doing so (especially for consumer-grade products) would generate many support calls to the manufacturer.

If one follows the out of box instructions to configure their Dlink, Asus, TPlink, etc. router, Devices attached to the 2.4 & 5 GHz bands will communicate with each other seamlessly.

Now AP isolation could be an issue if someone has taken the time to setup a guest wifi network and turned on AP isolation, which will only grant internet access to devices attached to those guest networks and block those devices from communicating with the original primary networks (configured when they purchased the router) and possibly other devices connected to the same guest network (client isolation).

How do I find out of my Phone is 2.4 or 5.0.   You are talking to a NON GURU here

I had issues when I first tried to join my home network. I wouldn't even bother trying the WPS as it will just frustrate you, especially if your router is a long distance from your Base3. When I followed the instructions under the No WPS option in the instructions (see Marty's link above) it connected right away. When first playing with the app I did not realize there were multiple pages in the app on my phone. Once I swiped down which took a few tries, the page opened up in the app that let me type in my SSID and my network password. Once the information was typed in, it immediately connected. Follow the instructions and make sure the switch on the front of of the Base3 is switched from AP to Network while completing this.

WOW!!!! You guys sure go through a lot of grief with these things!  Dmc ,tmcc ,cab 1,2,3 just to run trains! I don't have any of these and enjoy just running my trains the "old fashioned" way. Right now I don't even have a layout but still enjoy displaying my trains. To each his own I guess.

@Fredstrains posted:

How do I find out of my Phone is 2.4 or 5.0.   You are talking to a NON GURU here

If your phone was built/purchased within the last 10 years, it's pretty safe to assume it has both 2.4 & 5 GHz capabilities. Multiband (2.4 & 5 GHz) devices are not new technologies, it's been around for quite a while now. My Motorola XT907 from 2014 has both 2.4 & 5 GHz capabilities.

To be sure, look up your phone model on the "GSM Arena" website and look at the "COMMS" information. This will tell about all the different ways your phone can communicate. Below is an example from an iPhone xr:

The WLAN indication 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac. The "a" is only for 5 GHz devices and the "b" is only for 2.4 GHz devices. All of the other letters indicate newer standards that may use either or both bands.
Sidenote: The Bluetooth portion also indicates this device has BLE 5.0 abilities that should make it compatible with the Lioncheif & CAB3-b app.

@MartyE posted:

This definitely tells me it's in Access Point mode. At minimum when in AP your phone should find the "Lionel Base3 – NNNN" and be able to connect. If you are using an Apple device, another thing to check is the following...

Settings > scroll down until you see Cab3 listed. Tap to open that menu and make sure "Local Network" is on.

Once you get connected in AP mode follow the instructions to join to the Network.

Did that, still no luck

@Fredstrains posted:

Did that, still no luck

Was the Local Network off or did it look like above?

OK.  Let's start from the beginning.

Put the Base3 in AP mode.

Under settings of the iPhone go to WiFi and tap it and see if you see the "Lionel Base3 – NNNN" NNNN being a number.  If so tap it.  Don't open the app just see if the phone connects to the Base3. (you get a little wifi indicator near the top right)

Let us know.

@MartyE posted:

What computer are you seeing this on?  A MAC or PC?  I'm a little confused as to why the computer is involved.  Right now there isn't really a reason to have the computer connected.

Do you have an LCS WiFi module installed?  If so remove it.  You might be connecting to it.

I just need some clarification... Are you trying to use the App in Access Point Mode "AP" or "Network" ?

Using Mode AP

No WIFI Module

Using HP PC

@MartyE posted:

This definitely tells me it's in Access Point mode. At minimum when in AP your phone should find the "Lionel Base3 – NNNN" and be able to connect. If you are using an Apple device, another thing to check is the following...

Settings > scroll down until you see Cab3 listed. Tap to open that menu and make sure "Local Network" is on.

Once you get connected in AP mode follow the instructions to join to the Network.

I’m Good here !   Checked it

@Fredstrains posted:

I’m Good here !   Checked it

OK.  Let's start from the beginning.

Put the Base3 in AP mode.

Under settings of the iPhone go to WiFi and tap it and see if you see the "Lionel Base3 – NNNN" NNNN being a number.  If so tap it.  Don't open the app just see if the phone connects to the Base3. (you get a little wifi indicator near the top right)

Let us know.

@James Brown posted:

I am following the instructions EXACTLY as they say...my router does support WPS, I made sure.  I put the Base 3 in Network mode, powered it on, held the WPS button for 2 seconds until the L started blinking alternately, then pushed the WPS button on my router.  I did this like 8 times, waited a couple minutes (per the instructions) and my Cab 3 keeps saying "No Base 3 available".   HELP!!!!

@MartyE posted:

OK.  Let's start from the beginning.

Put the Base3 in AP mode.

Under settings of the iPhone go to WiFi and tap it and see if you see the "Lionel Base3 – NNNN" NNNN being a number.  If so tap it.  Don't open the app just see if the phone connects to the Base3. (you get a little wifi indicator near the top right)

Let us know.

When i do that I get a CHECK MARK off to the left and A WIFI Connect symbol on the same screen (UPPER RIGHT).

@Fredstrains posted:

When i do that I get a CHECK MARK off to the left and A WIFI Connect symbol on the same screen (UPPER RIGHT).

Good.  Does the WiFi symbol appear on the home screen of the phone on the upper right?  Just confirming.  Stay with me, we're almost there.

@MartyE posted:

Good.  Does the WiFi symbol appear on the home screen of the phone on the upper right?  Just confirming.

Yes, exactly

If you get the WiFi indicator on the phone, open the Cab3 App and go to the Base3 side.  See if it connects.

If not swipe down to see this screen. I found swiping in the numeric keypad works best.

Push the WiFi connection settings and get this screen...

Make sure you are set to auto detect. If not push Auto Detect and hit "SET".  You may see some other info in but since I'm at not at home the picture above isn't going to show much. Then back, and back again.

If the App doesn't try to connect, tap the WiFi symbol where the "A" is.  It will try, and hopefully connect.

Also place Base3 inches away from the router for just the setup. (Sean discovered this)

When you type in the SSiD and password, be sure to adhere to the precise use of lower and upper case characters for both entries. If the case is incorrect for even one character, the connection will fail. Unfortunately the CAB3 app doesn’t give you immediate feedback whether or not you have entered the SSiD or password correctly.

@MartyE posted:

If you get the WiFi indicator on the phone, open the Cab3 App and go to the Base3 side.  See if it connects.

If not swipe down to see this screen. I found swiping in the numeric keypad works best.

Push the WiFi connection settings and get this screen...

Make sure you are set to auto detect. If not push Auto Detect and hit "SET".  You may see some other info in but since I'm at not at home the picture above isn't going to show much. Then back, and back again.

If the App doesn't try to connect, tap the WiFi symbol where the "A" is.  It will try, and hopefully connect.

NOPE ,  Still no connection     see under Base Details There is nothing listed in "BASE NAME" , BASE TYPE  or Firmware Rev.

@Fredstrains posted:

NOPE ,  Still no connection     see under Base Details There is nothing listed in "BASE NAME" , BASE TYPE  or Firmware Rev.

While I was typing this the ORANGE Light went on and i'm up!!

What now?  What do I have to do to preserve this???

I'm afraid if I take this Down, I will lose it ?????

Should I shut it down & see if it comes back up??????

NOW IF I GO BACK TO THEBASE DETAILS SCREEN:  I see the Base Name:BASE3 INT,  BASE TYPEBASE3 & Base Firmware Rev.1.22

Am I safe now to shut off the BASE# and try to reconnect?????

Well if you turn off Base3 the iPhone will jump back to the home network. It might even disconnect if the WiFi signal gets too weak by leaving the room or house. When you turn it back on or need to reconnect you will have to go into settings and WiFi and select Lionel Base3 again and let it connect to your phone.

The next step now that we know you can connect is have Base3 join your network so you don’t have to switch the iPhone.

We can work on this next.

@MartyE posted:

Well if you turn off Base3 the iPhone will jump back to the home network. It might even disconnect if the WiFi signal gets too weak by leaving the room or house. When you turn it back on or need to reconnect you will have to go into settings and WiFi and select Lionel Base3 again and let it connect to your phone.

The next step now that we know you can connect is have Base3 join your network so you don’t have to switch the iPhone.

We can work on this next.

Marty ,

I was able to do that and get BASE3 back on my IPHONE!!!    Mission accomplished!!    GOOD JOB!!!!  Couldnt have done it without YOU!  I can't tell you how much this makes me feel.  You are a WONDER COMPUTER GURU!!!!

Sincerely,

FREDSTRAINS

PS.....  Maybe we can tackle the other tomorrow!!!  I am exhausted!!!

@Fredstrains posted:

Marty ,

I was able to do that and get BASE3 back on my IPHONE!!!    Mission accomplished!!    GOOD JOB!!!!  Couldnt have done it without YOU!  I can't tell you how much this makes me feel.  You are a WONDER COMPUTER GURU!!!!

Sincerely,

FREDSTRAINS

PS.....  Maybe we can tackle the other tomorrow!!!  I am exhausted!!!

No offense but I am too.  LOL!

@H1000 posted:

Band isolation is not a likely scenario. Most consumer routers don't offer it and the ones that do don't turn it on by default to avoid problems as you described. Not to say that it can't be done but doing so (especially for consumer-grade products) would generate many support calls to the manufacturer.

I hear ya, but trust me I've run into this numerous times especially with routers from "pre-n" and 802.11n eras. It's not even brand specific because many use the same chip sets and reference drivers.

Most people don't buy new ones that often or update the firmware so early reference firmware will often have bugs like this.

I once ran into a Netgear router that had the setting backwards in the UI. If you enabled it, it turned it off and if you disabled it, it turned it on.

@H1000 posted:

The WLAN indication 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac. The "a" is only for 5 GHz devices and the "b" is only for 2.4 GHz devices. All of the other letters indicate newer standards that may use either or both bands.

802.11 "g" devices are 2.4 GHz only in addition to "b".