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We’re rolling eastbound out of Jefferson City, MO, approaching the Control Point CPM091 at Morrison, MO. mile post 91. Signal displays a restricting, (Flashing red). We had the proper signals in advance, Advance Approach,(reduce speed to 40mph), Approach, (reduce speed to 30mph prepared to stop at next signal).

 

So, with a 6900foot, 15000 ton grain train we proceed past the Restricting Signal doing about 8mph.

 

The definition of Restricted Speed:

“When required to move at restricted speed, movement must be made a speed that allows stopping within half the range of vision short of:

Train, Engine, Railroad Car, Men or Equipment fouling the track, Stop signal or Derail or switch lined improperly.

 

 

When a train or engine is required to move at Restricted Speed, the crew must keep a lookout for broken rail and not exceed 20MPH.

 

Comply with these requirements until leading wheels reach a point where movement at Restricted Speed is no longer required”

 

At mile post 89.4, don't really see a broken rail, I but feel the clucking as each axle rolls over the break. Stop the train. Walk back past the 4 units and 2 head car and there's the break, about a 1 inch gap. Its 1:55AM, report to the dispatch and instructions are to stay put and they call out the track crew. After a long 3 1/2 hour wait and getting runaround by numerous eastbounds, including the circus train heading for St. Louis and a number of westbounds, the track crew arrives. After discussion with the dispatch, the M/W foreman is told that he, (dispatcher), will hold the trains from moving on Main 1 so they can watch us roll over the broken rail on Main 2. Were finally told to take them ahead at walking speed. Only another 6500 feet to pull over the break. So, after 6 AM we are moving on down the road.

 

Notice the rule does not require stopping short of a broken rail. They are very hard to spot on a moving train. I would venture to guess that 80 to 90% are not seen by the crew. Most of the time they are straight breaks and trains will roll right on down the road without seeing it. Usually, a signalman will be called for signal problems and will they will find the break. Sometimes the break will still be touching causing the signals to display a Clear indication and a train will roll at 40-50-or 60MPH over the bad rail. I did that years ago, loaded coal train at 50MPH, first 50 cars made it over then boom, next 28 in a pile and many more that were scrapped because sides bulged out.

 

It was my conductors second week on the job and his first broken rail, so he took an interest in seeing it.  

Dan

 

Here's the break: looks like there was a void of some sort in the head of the rail.  The yellow paint may mean that the rail was ultrasound tested at some time, maybe recently and the rail was scheduled to be replaced.

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Originally Posted by Matt Kirsch:

So what do they do to fix it?

 

I'd be tempted to pull it back together with the come-along and get out the old Lincoln tombstone and burn a bunch of 6010.

 

How would one attach the come-along?  Also, in order to weld it back together, the Thermite Welding process would be used, NOT stick welding. The many times I have seen that type of break repaired, the track gang used fuel oil soaked cotton waste for more than a 1/4 mile either side of the break, then set them on fire. Once the rail expanded back into place, the Thermite Welding kiln was set-up and the job completed, then the fires were extinguished.

 

Is it bolted back together with tie plates (probably not the correct term), or thermite welded, or is a section removed and replaced?

 

Originally Posted by Indybryan:

Pardon my ignorance, but by heating it up and bolting it together...would that not create stress elsewhere for another fracture to occur because of the stress - especially going into the colder weather?

That is what the rail anchors, or "anti-creepers", are designed to do, i.e. keep the rail from moving. That said, broken rails are obviously more common in bitter cold temperatures, due to extreme rail contractions.

I still believe while on the SWC Amtrak in the middle of NM we hit a broken rail. First time riders were at times alarmed at the rough ride we were getting that evening. I knew it was about norm. But during dinner we hit something that made our plates jump and the crew gasp! Whatever it was....it was pretty scary!!! I am glad you were running slow order!

Not sure what type of steel the rail is made of, but I would think it might be similar to steel used in pipe? Anyway if I recall correctly (been a long time since school) carbon steel pipe expands 1 inch per 100 feet per 100 degree F rise in temperature (or close to that). In a piping system an expansion loop is installed to allow for this expansion, if temp rise and length of pipe requires it.

 

In many parts of the country a 100 deg F rise would be pretty common from summer to winter. Rails are quite long (maybe continuious for miles?), how do they compensate for this expansion in the rails. Sounds very tricky, but do they have any kind of expansion joint or equivalent to allow for this? They say the continuous rails are better, but seems like the older non-continuous rails, possibly with a small gap every so often for expansion may have been better for handling this? Keep in mind I know very little about real rail roads so I don't know what small gaps would do to trains or train wheels etc.

Originally Posted by Hot Water:
Originally Posted by Matt Kirsch:

So what do they do to fix it?

 

I'd be tempted to pull it back together with the come-along and get out the old Lincoln tombstone and burn a bunch of 6010.

 

How would one attach the come-along?  Also, in order to weld it back together, the Thermite Welding process would be used, NOT stick welding. The many times I have seen that type of break repaired, the track gang used fuel oil soaked cotton waste for more than a 1/4 mile either side of the break, then set them on fire. Once the rail expanded back into place, the Thermite Welding kiln was set-up and the job completed, then the fires were extinguished.

 

Is it bolted back together with tie plates (probably not the correct term), or thermite welded, or is a section removed and replaced?

 

No sense of humor, eh?

 

That's just the farm boy in me coming out. When something breaks, you pull it back together with the come-along and weld it with the old Lincoln tombstone.

 

Quite frankly I think I could come up with a way to get a come-along to grip those rails. It'd just have to be one heck of a come-along.

Originally Posted by Matt Kirsch: 

Quite frankly I think I could come up with a way to get a come-along to grip those rails. It'd just have to be one heck of a come-along.

Without damaging the rails?  Rail metallurgy is quite complicated, and the ball (top or head) of the rail, is unbelievably HARD. So hard, that if a length of rail is propped up on a block at one end, the top of the rail head can then be scored with a top quality chisel. Then using a large sledge hammer, strike the rail away from the score marks, and that short piece will normally break right off, leaving a nice clean break. Of course, now a days, the track folks use those big gasoline powered cut-off discs, to cut rails.

I have forgotten most of my metallurgy college information.  The photo shows an amazing break.  It appears that the track is very brittle to get such a clean break.  I wonder if there was a manufacturing flaw at that point.  

 

At least it shows that the gaps in my model railroad track are prototypical.  We had a break like this on the G&O garden railroad.  The G&O uses Atlas solid rail track.

 

Joe 

Originally Posted by Wyhog:

What part of my previous post above did you fellas not believe...

BNSF MOW have hydraulic "come-alongs" that grip the rails and pull them back together with hydraulic pressure .

I don't know what the maximum size gap is that they can close but I've seen them pull 3" gaps back together in continuous welded rail. The hydraulic "come-along" is powered by connecting hydraulic hoses to the MOW truck's hydraulic system or by using a portable small gasoline engine that powers a hydraulic pump.

 

 120 ton hydraulic rail puller

 

 I also have my own photos of 2 different models laying in Sheridan yard where MOW stores them. 

Thanks for correcting me. The railroads that I covered sure didn't have anything like THAT by the time I retired in late 1998. 

Here's one we found in the middle of the night MP 32, near Gardner, KS a few years ago. We were flagging, and saw it in the headlight, got stopped with it under the 3rd unit. It was over 4", so they had us wait until a track supervisor showed up to walk us over it. We had about 8000' so the head end was at Moon Light crossing before we finally got over it at 5mph or less. This break looks just like the one in the first post, and possibly started from an internal defect also. The temps had dropped about 50 degrees in 12 hrs. Seems like the first big cold snap of the year is the worse for broken rail. I can't imagine the sound that break must make when it finally lets go.

Broken rail MP 32 001

Broken rail MP 32 003

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Last edited by Rich Melvin
Originally Posted by locopilot750:

Here's one we found in the middle of the night MP 32, near Gardner, KS a few years ago. We were flagging, and saw it in the headlight, got stopped with it under the 3rd unit. It was over 4", so they had us wait until a track supervisor showed up to walk us over it. We had about 8000' so the head end was at Moon Light crossing before we finally got over it at 5mph or less. This break looks just like the one in the first post, and possibly started from an internal defect also. The temps had dropped about 50 degrees in 12 hrs. Seems like the first big cold snap of the year is the worse for broken rail. I can't imagine the sound that break must make when it finally lets go.

 

That one was in my neck of the woods, I'm just a little north of that in Lenexa. We lived about 6 blocks from the tracks in old town Lenexa for 35 years. Since you called that MP 32, would that be old Missouri Pacific tracks? I am a rail road novice and still trying to learn the tracks around here. As far as who has what and who's they used to be. Not to get too far off topic here, but any info about the local tracks would be appreciated. My email is in my profile if that would be preferred, if you would be so kind that is.

Last edited by rtr12
Originally Posted by rtr12:
Originally Posted by locopilot750:

Here's one we found in the middle of the night MP 32, near Gardner, KS a few years ago. We were flagging, and saw it in the headlight, got stopped with it under the 3rd unit. It was over 4", so they had us wait until a track supervisor showed up to walk us over it. We had about 8000' so the head end was at Moon Light crossing before we finally got over it at 5mph or less. This break looks just like the one in the first post, and possibly started from an internal defect also. The temps had dropped about 50 degrees in 12 hrs. Seems like the first big cold snap of the year is the worse for broken rail. I can't imagine the sound that break must make when it finally lets go.

 

That one was in my neck of the woods, I'm just a little north of that in Lenexa. We lived about 6 blocks from the tracks in old town Lenexa for 35 years. Since you called that MP 32, would that be old Missouri Pacific tracks? I am a rail road novice and still trying to learn the tracks around here. As far as who has what and who's they used to be. Not to get too far off topic here, but any info about the local tracks would be appreciated. My email is in my profile if that would be preferred, if you would be so kind that is.

Gardner is on the BNSF Emporia sub.  Mile Post 34.  I believe it's the old ATSF main from California to Chicago.

 

Some other locations on that sub.

 

Union Station, KC - MP 0

Olathe - MP 26

Gardner - MP 34

Ottawa - MP 57

Emporia - MP 112

El Dorado - MP 172

Augusta - MP 183

Last edited by KansasMike
Originally Posted by KansasMike:
 

Gardner is on the BNSF Emporia sub.  Mile Post 34.  I believe it's the old ATSF main from California to Chicago.

 

Some other locations on that sub.

 

Union Station, KC - MP 0

Olathe - MP 26

Gardner - MP 34

Ottawa - MP 57

Emporia - MP 112

El Dorado - MP 172

Augusta - MP 183

Thanks, that helps. So I guess MP is Mile Post, not Mo Pacific. Guess I should have known that...

Originally Posted by rtr12:
Originally Posted by KansasMike:
 

Gardner is on the BNSF Emporia sub.  Mile Post 34.  I believe it's the old ATSF main from California to Chicago.

 

Some other locations on that sub.

 

Union Station, KC - MP 0

Olathe - MP 26

Gardner - MP 34

Ottawa - MP 57

Emporia - MP 112

El Dorado - MP 172

Augusta - MP 183

Thanks, that helps. So I guess MP is Mile Post, not Mo Pacific. Guess I should have known that...

The current UP Coffeyville sub was once MoPAC. 

 

Leeds Jct MP 285

Bucyrus MP 312

Wagstaff MP 316

Paola MP 326

Osawatomie MP 333

Originally Posted by KansasMike:
Originally Posted by rtr12:
Originally Posted by KansasMike:
 

Gardner is on the BNSF Emporia sub.  Mile Post 34.  I believe it's the old ATSF main from California to Chicago.

 

Some other locations on that sub.

 

Union Station, KC - MP 0

Olathe - MP 26

Gardner - MP 34

Ottawa - MP 57

Emporia - MP 112

El Dorado - MP 172

Augusta - MP 183

Thanks, that helps. So I guess MP is Mile Post, not Mo Pacific. Guess I should have known that...

The current UP Coffeyville sub was once MoPAC. 

 

Leeds Jct MP 285

Bucyrus MP 312

Wagstaff MP 316

Paola MP 326

Osawatomie MP 333

A double Thank You! Got any more? Like the ones running through old town Lenexa (now BNSF) or the ones through Bonner Springs (now maybe UP)?

Originally Posted by rtr12:
Originally Posted by KansasMike:
Originally Posted by rtr12:
Originally Posted by KansasMike:
 

Gardner is on the BNSF Emporia sub.  Mile Post 34.  I believe it's the old ATSF main from California to Chicago.

 

Some other locations on that sub.

 

Union Station, KC - MP 0

Olathe - MP 26

Gardner - MP 34

Ottawa - MP 57

Emporia - MP 112

El Dorado - MP 172

Augusta - MP 183

Thanks, that helps. So I guess MP is Mile Post, not Mo Pacific. Guess I should have known that...

The current UP Coffeyville sub was once MoPAC. 

 

Leeds Jct MP 285

Bucyrus MP 312

Wagstaff MP 316

Paola MP 326

Osawatomie MP 333

A double Thank You! Got any more? Like the ones running through old town Lenexa (now BNSF) or the ones through Bonner Springs (now maybe UP)?

 

Bonner Springs is MP 17 on the UP Kansas Sub. 

Loring MP 21

Linwood MP 28

Lawrence MP 38

 

Lenexa is on the BNSF Fort Scott Sub,  Ex Frisco.

Bonita MP 26.5

Hillsdale MP 37

Paola MP 43

The dark area of the break is where the fracture initiated. The bright part of the break is recent and occurred when the ultimate tensile strength of the remaining rail section was exceeded.

 

I am surprised that the bright area is such a large part of the cross sectional area. My thinking is that this rail does not have enough margin of safety for the traffic it is exposed to.

 

The crack initiation site indicates that the peak tensile stress in the rail occurs at the upper inside corner of the rail head. My guess is that the crack initiation point was due to a flaw in the rail. The flaw may have been from the foundry or induced by rail traffic.

Last edited by Bobby Ogage
Originally Posted by KansasMike:
Originally Posted by rtr12:
Originally Posted by KansasMike:
Originally Posted by rtr12:
Originally Posted by KansasMike:
 

Gardner is on the BNSF Emporia sub.  Mile Post 34.  I believe it's the old ATSF main from California to Chicago.

 

Some other locations on that sub.

 

Union Station, KC - MP 0

Olathe - MP 26

Gardner - MP 34

Ottawa - MP 57

Emporia - MP 112

El Dorado - MP 172

Augusta - MP 183

Thanks, that helps. So I guess MP is Mile Post, not Mo Pacific. Guess I should have known that...

The current UP Coffeyville sub was once MoPAC. 

 

Leeds Jct MP 285

Bucyrus MP 312

Wagstaff MP 316

Paola MP 326

Osawatomie MP 333

A double Thank You! Got any more? Like the ones running through old town Lenexa (now BNSF) or the ones through Bonner Springs (now maybe UP)?

 

Bonner Springs is MP 17 on the UP Kansas Sub. 

Loring MP 21

Linwood MP 28

Lawrence MP 38

 

Lenexa is on the BNSF Fort Scott Sub,  Ex Frisco.

Bonita MP 26.5

Hillsdale MP 37

Paola MP 43

Thanks again, this is really filling in the info I was looking for. I sent you and email before reading this post, so I think my questions have been answered. Thainks for the added info.

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