Casey Jones 4-6-0 Color Scheme?

@smd4 posted:

As for the photo of 382 Rusty linked to above, the Water Valley Casey Jones Museum website states that "when that engine was delivered to the IC in 1898, it carried the number 382....When returned to service three months [after the accident], it was renumbered to 212. In 1907 it was renumbered to 2012. It was later, in 1922 renumbered to the 5012 and retired in July 1935." So we know the engine Rusty linked to--if it really was Casey's-- wasn't photographed in 1945. But is the number accurate? Certainly the engine is the same class. But does the number on the smokebox number plate seem a little too pronounced, perhaps? Could this engine really be the Casey Jones engine? Or one of the same class that has simply been re-touched to show the original number?

I hadn't given these photo's a second glance until this thread.  It's sort of fun unearthing this stuff...

There are two photo's of the 382 after it was renumbered to 2012 in "Rods Down and Dropped Fires" dated 1907 and 1914.  The locomotive looks virtually identical to prior to the wreck, but was given a larger tender.

The book attributes this famous photo to 1900, shortly after the 382 was repaired at the Water Valley Shops.   Notice the knuckle coupler on the pilot.  The IC Magazine from the 1950's even identified the men:  W.H. Hartwell (in the gangway,) Bob Davis (in the cab,) Engineers John Brown and Bob Moore on the ground,) and firemen Ed Kennedy and Lorin Rogers.

Boy, the more we dig, the greater the mysteries.  I suspect you may be right...  It's most likely the 2012 retouched as 382.  The linked photo shows the larger tender, so it was taken somewhere between 1907 and 1922.

Another photo shows the locomotive after being renumbered to 5012 in 1922.  Here the locomotive was modernized with a new cab, Pyle headlight, piston valve adapters and Walschaerts valve gear.  Also the running boards are no longer one level and ladders were added from the pilot to the running boards.  Sadly, the image isn't on the web, but this one of sister 5041 is similar.

Rusty

@John A posted:

I suspect the lack of photos for 382 is because it didn’t become “famous “ until after it was destroyed. Before that, it was just a run-of-the-mill regular engine. Keep us posted on your progress! JohnA

Definitely was just a run of the mill, very typical 4-6-0. But it was rebuilt and ran another 35 years! Well after the ballad of Casey Jones swept the country.

@Rusty Traque posted:

Another photo shows the locomotive after being renumbered to 5012 in 1922.  Here the locomotive was modernized with a new cab, Pyle headlight, piston valve adapters and Walschaerts valve gear.  Also the running boards are no longer one level and ladders were added from the pilot to the running boards.  Sadly, the image isn't on the web, but this one of sister 5041 is similar.

I think this photo is an example showing why so many people prefer the "as-built" appearance of locomotives. The stepped running boards, compressor cooling pipes, large steam pipe leading from the smokebox to the steam chest, the (what appears to be ) Baker valve gear--inartfully linked to the motion--running board steps to pilot, small headlight, generator mounted lengthwise and ungainly cab with a mundane hatch replacing the graceful clerestory, all detract from the elegant, simple clean lines of the original "Gay Nineties" version of the engine.

Of course, I'm sure there are those who appreciate the efforts made to turn an 1890s product of the Rogers Locomotive Works into a viable piece of "modern" 1930s motive power.

@wjstix posted:

Once railroads switched from wood to coal in the 1880s, fancy colors were quickly phased out.

While it's true "fancy" colors were phased out, that doesn't mean Russia Iron, or even less-fancy colors in general, were gone as well.

Baldwin painted many of their engines in a darker olive green (there's a name for it--I'd have to look it up in one of my books); See Steamtown's No. 26.  Pennsy, of course, is famous for their "DGLE." Of course, these darker greens will certainly look "black" in most B&W photographs, and wouldn't be considered "fancy" the way that engines of the 1860s and 1870s were.

Russia Iron certainly wasn't eliminated, so whether you believe it had a blue cast, or something more of a darker grey, it was still around for many years (indeed, the NYC No. 999 of 1893 had nearly every inch of her boiler--including the smokebox--sheathed in Russia Iron).