Drone video of UP train - totally illegal

Wow. That's a long train, and his piloting skills are pretty darn good too.

Ok I’ll play stupid, what did he do that was illegal?  Pretty ballsy, if you ask me, with what must be a very expensive drone.  Did you see the engineer shut the window during the fly by?  Even Trains posted this on their FB page.

Thanks Al,  not very bright of him,  I don't think it would cause an accident, the conductor shut him right out by closing the window on it.  I am not sure how much weight they can carry but if they could carry a explosive charge the JTTF would be interested in him. 

And you're right, it will be filed by law enforcement as things that can be done with a drone.  Not good for the hobbyist or commercial users of drones.

I saw that a couple days ago. Really, really impressive. My favorite part was when he flew it under a moving car, successfully. It did look like he was going down immediately after that, but he caught it. Whether it's legal or not (it's not), it's still really cool. 

Not sure if that's kosher but that was pretty impressive 

Have to watch that again

Wow. I am amazed by his skill of flying, and yet his stupidity. No doubt an incredible pilot, and amazing footage, but this is highly illegal on so many levels. I would love to get @Hot Water or @Rich Melvin's opinions on this. 

Wow, it is a really good show.��

I know it has been posted all over the internet on most of the rail oriented forums, but I could only get about a minute and a half into it. It is WAY TOO busy for me!  Also, just what is illegal about it? 

I don't see where the highly illegal part comes in. I'm reading the FAA regs on both hobby and commercial UAS operation and I've seen nothing that would be considered "highly illegal" or "totally illegal" although some things could fall into question under vague ambiguity. And he's a nuisance to the fireman/conductor but illegal, leave it up to the cops and prosecutors to decide.

Hot Water posted:

I know it has been posted all over the internet on most of the rail oriented forums, but I could only get about a minute and a half into it. It is WAY TOO busy for me!  Also, just what is illegal about it? 

Trespassing, Illegal drone flying, ect... The FAA and Union Pacific has strict laws about where you can fly and where you can't. You can't fly this close to a train, you certianly cant go inside railcars and under a moving train, its common sense too. 

Here's the rules

https://www.faa.gov/uas/media/part_107_summary.pdf

superwarp1 posted:

Ok I’ll play stupid, what did he do that was illegal?  Pretty ballsy, if you ask me, with what must be a very expensive drone.  Did you see the engineer shut the window during the fly by?  Even Trains posted this on their FB page.

Well, under FAA rules, you are not to allowed to fly over people that are not directly involved with the flight. Not allowed to fly beyond line of sight and also not allowed to use FPV goggles unless you have a person as a visual observer keeping track of drone in sky. The pilot also almost crashed several times during his video. At 1:27 he almost clipped a power line and when he flew under the hopper car he hit the door but recovered.

The rules don't say anything about being close to a train and being in the air around the train is not trespassing. I'm pretty sure that Union Pacific does not have laws or make laws, the government does. The rules also state nothing about being inside a moving vehicle. I'll have to look up what the airspace above train tracks are classified as but planes fly over train tracks all the time so I'm faiRly certain it's not restricted.

I didn't see him fly over any people and I don't know where his observer was cuz I wasn't there but I can't make a claim as to whether it was not in his LOS or not. The rules don't say you can't use goggles it just says the don't count for LOS control. 

Does it become Commercial once he accepts monetization (either from youtube or patreon)?

And I thought the rules were different for hobbyist vs commercial photographer.

The action of the conductor makes me think that it is a somewhat common occurrence?

Anyway, I think I would have crashed that thing at about 30 seconds in.  lol

From the FAA website:

"Flying a drone in a reckless manner is a violation of Federal law and FAA regulations and could result in civil fines or criminal action".

From the opinion of someone who deals with the FAA every day, there is an argument for reckless operation.

Just sayin'

EBT Jim posted:

The action of the conductor makes me think that it is a somewhat common occurrence?

Anyway, I think I would have crashed that thing at about 30 seconds in.  lol

Common or not, imagine seeing a robot with a camera attached to it hovering perfectly out the window of a moving vehicle, staring at you. 

Some ought t hire this guy! He can fly that thing!!!

Thanks Al, nice new roof painting ideas to do! 

Hot Water posted:

Also, just what is illegal about it? 

Well, one of the regulations is that you must keep the drone in sight at all times.  I'm pretty sure that rule was seriously violated multiple times.  Although I couldn't find it specifically, landing on that auto carrier was surely trespassing.  It's hard for me to that you actually have to ask if this was violating any laws.

The FAA is pretty hands off (relatively speaking) until they decide it's you whose day they want to ruin. That guy might be in for some interesting times if/when that goes viral. 

While not my area I imagine the relevant railroad/transportation authorities will want a word. 

I wouldn't dare risk my ticket or the legal ramifications flying a drone in that manner. 

Wow!!Very impressive flying and cool music he got going to.As for the law I don,t know about that.Still a heck of a video.

Like fantastic graffiti artist can be among the best artist, though illegal and I don't like it...... Seems to be the same with drones......some real talent operating on the legal fringe. 

What is the trackage seen at the 00:23 mark??? Looks old????

Impressive flying. 

I would find it very hard to believe it is any more legal to land on a moving train (~1:42, I believe) than it would be to land on a moving car or truck on the interstate.  (I didn't check, but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if this guy has that example on his channel too)

I can't help but think what a useful tool this would be to monitor train movements / concerns on the railroad / etc.

Union Pacific should hire this guy 

If it is illegal he should be arrested and prosecuted. Cool shots though. 

This would be a great tool for the railroad cops to use in railyards. Could cover alot of ground in a short time. Bet you can get night vision cameras for them too.

First, what kind of range does his transmitter have /   Second, does the transmitter allow the operator to see, via on board camera, where he is flying ?   Third, if this was illegal, he certainly doesn't seem to care, because he gave his identity up near the end.  

Hot Water posted:

I know it has been posted all over the internet on most of the rail oriented forums, but I could only get about a minute and a half into it. It is WAY TOO busy for me!  Also, just what is illegal about it? 

I agree, I don't see anything illegal. It isn't as if he's endangering the train or crew on this. He's doing some very risky flying, but it's his nickel for the drone, so why should we complain? He's showing the world things they could never see any other way.

Yeah Jack, there is sort of a motion sickness factor with all those rolls. Dizzying, but fun.

Quick search shows the range to be over a mile, but even if it goes beyond range it can be programmed by GPS to return.

I had older technology (non - 2.4ghz) brushless airplanes and they would be out of sight before they would go out of range.

Impressive production quality though sure to raise the hackles of folks who are hypersensitive.

Cool video, but illegal?  Really?  It isn't like the drone was going to do any more damage to the train than a mosquito would do to your windshield.  It's not what you would call a populated area.  What is that washed out track in the foreground at 0.22?

Trespassing?  Can I be guilty of trespassing if I don't set foot on your property?  If my dog runs onto your lawn while I'm playing fetch with him, am I trespassing?  I don't know, I'm asking.

As far as going too far, the whole video is shot around that one bridge across the creek from where he was standing.  I doubt the drone ever traveled more than a half mile from where he was.

As far as needing a spotter when wearing goggles, his spotter is standing right next to him when the drone lands.

As far as the drone pacing the open cab window, that happens to us all the time.  Hell, about ten or so years ago, some guy in a freaking biplane used to pace us like that on a regular basis, I could have hit him with a lump of coal more than once.  For that matter, I believe that it is against RR rules at least to haul a box car with the door open.

I will forward this video to my friends for their entertainment.  In my opinion, a lot of posters here need to take a chill pill.

Does it state "people" be out in the open?

To pass over is one thing, to follow a property line another.

I won't watch it because it supports him; encouragement to continue. There are enough safe flyers to ignore him. (at least let him know he is an idjit in the comments if you "must" watch.

Too bad nobody keeps salt guns in the cabooses anymore.

 That would be some nice target practice right there, lol. 

Beats shooting at kids playing baseball...(yep, and it don't tickle  

I am curious as to where this was shot and what was that set of tracks at 0:22-0:24 seconds into the film. It looks like some sort of long trestle.

He must have used that professional $1400 drone that Steve Barry reviewed in the latest issue of Railfan! 

Pretty spectacular flying - the railroads and the JTTF could use that guy's equipment and piloting skills to catch the

REAL bad guys! 

I have watched that type of FPV flying in the Drone Racing league series that was televised. It's just common sense that this isn't a good thing to do, which of course, is scarce.

Posting it on the net makes him accessible if someone wants to arrest him. Further proof that there is no common sense involved.

I think of drones as 4 small  sword blades spinning around at high speed.   They can cut  your fingers off in a second. I'm not fond of them at the fl;ying club but the big helicopters  are really SCARY.

Yep  that guys is a really good pilot.

But the safety of our nation is at stake...call the TSA, NSA, CIA, FBI, DIA, the national guard, local sheriff, beat cops, and deputy dog...where is Mighty Mouse when you need him — here I come to save the day! 

Operation Life Saver can show you that tens of thousands of people are injured or killed every year when encountering a train (ie being hit by one), this fellow stands to lose a few bucks if his drone goes down — not his life or the life of others. 

Chill out folks there are much bigger fish to fry and even the idea that law enforcement resources would be spent to stop, prosecute, and jail this person is what should have your britches in a twist. I am sure we need to spend the $50,000 or so tax dollars to get this guy locked up!