Expensive Lionels-Big Boy A Cheapie

Bob:

You make a good point. There are lot of things in our O-Gauge hobby that can be pricy. If the item is important to you, most will spend the bucks if it is on the "must have" list.

I understand what you are saying.  I was surfing the bay last night and saw some Koh's (think I spelled it correctly) engines, $5,400!  Wow, I can't play with them boys! Makes Vision Line stuff seem cheap in that world!

As PTC said, I've spent more than I should on some engines, but it was stuff I really wanted and had been searching for.  Didn't mind paying a little more for those items. I did score one 'bargain' deal recently, and I am really happy about it.

Plus, I now have every Union Pacific steam engine I have ever wanted.  Been a good year.

And let's not forget the most expensive Postwar Lionel, the Boy's set which goes for tens of thousands. IF YOU CAN FIND ONE

Bob C.

Sorry guys, but IMO, apples v oranges.

Collectibles against modern. Only time will tell if the BigBoy becomes a collectible. If it sells well and Lionel offers it again in several years with what will then be more modern electronics, this one will just go down in value. If not, it may become a collectible. Can anyone think of a post 1990 collectible?

Gerry

It's really not a unrealistic price. And you are right about some sought after locos that are collectible: they cost a lot more.  They must be worth it: buyers pay those prices and sellers won't sell for less.

if you are comparing postwar vs modern era,forget it. like gerry said, "apples v oranges". they are two different animals.-jim

This sounds like what happened to the MTH DAP big boy of 2001. Guys were happy to pay full retail of 1395. Now they aren't worth half of that(per ebay prices) I even had mine upgraded to proto 2.

All of mine are...

...TO ME!

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

I doubt that the new Lionel Big Boy will become collectible.  The price may go up on the secondary market just after it is released.  Most likely the price will drop thereafter.  MTH,  Lionel,  or 3rd Rail will probably issue a newer / cooler Big Boy in a few years which will also lower the price.  

How many Big Boys can the market absorb especially since very few 3-rail operators have a layout big enough to run one?  I think that the Big Boy market is already saturated and that people who buy this engine will be getting it for its very cool operating features.  I hope that one of my friends gets one so I can see it run. 

I saw a post on the forum where someone already has 10 Big Boys.   Wow!  Union Pacific only had 25 Big Boys.  I wonder if someone out there has a goal to own a model of all 25.

I couldn't fit 10 of them in my layout room even if I could afford to buy that many.

Joe 

I dunno Joe.  I would tend to think that the market is saturated with Warbonnet F3s, Pennsy GG1s & S2 Turbines, and NYC J-class Hudsons but they still seem to be in demand. (I can understand the Warbonnet but not those eastern road engines, who were they again?)

When Lionel came out in the early 1990's with the Virginian and the Chesapeake &

Ohio articulated steamers, it touted them as Lionel's first issue of an articulated

steam locomotive.  I don't have the catalog handy, but I think the msrp was around

$1300-$1400.  I couldn't afford one at the time and they gradually dropped out of

sight in the magazines (I didn't have a computer then).  In 1999 I saw one in an ad

in CTT (gasp!).  They wanted $2000.  I bought it (the Virginian version), thinking

the value would eventually increase, since it was a Lionel first-of-a-kind.  That

didn't happen and I see it see it advertized now & then between $900-$1100.  I'm

happy I have one, though, and I don't regret buying it.

     Hoppy

Well Joe, now you do, because I don't have any GG1s, S2s, or NYC Hudsons.  I don't model those roads. 

 yes it is his goal and many others,you d be surprised how many guys that are out there that have almost one of everything..

I have been on both sides of this fence....a collector and an operator.  I am joining Gerry Morlitz in his take....and some of the others here.  I don't think very many of the newly produced items are going to be collectible..at least in our lifetimes.  With "limited production" coming back in the form of "produced to order"...it smacks of the 1980's again and a way to stablize / increase price....???  Just take a look at the JLC series, MTH DAP series, and a whole host of others..  So...buy it if you can afford it but realize that if you are not in a hurry, you might just get it for less down the road!

Alan

Just got a letter from Charles Ro, the "official" price of the Big Boy is $1899.95.   Given the inflation between the 1990's and now, it's cheap.

Interesting Lionel is going to produce 7 different Vision Line Big Boys when a few years back there was a current or former employee telling us we did not understand how much it would cost Lionel to produce box cars in a measly TWO different road numbers like the other manufacturers do.

How much is this going to cost Lionel? Guessing not much since the Vision Line Big Boy street price is barely over the older Legacy Big Boys price.

For the asking price, it should include a DELUXE CASE. 

 Barely? .   MSRP on the original Legacy bigboy was $1699, and that included a legacy command set ($300 value)

Pat, the price is for those that pre-ordered.  I'm looking right at the letter, there's no mistake.

Counting all these additional "bells and whistles" on the engine, making more than one road number isn't going to cost them anything and increases the potential sales pool for those guys who just have to have more than one. The trend to follow will be how the current ones retain value in the secondary market, especially when they re-run a cab number.

(Just like they would have increased rolling stock sales exponentially with more than one road number on a box car, hopper or reefer, etc., the FIRST place you'd expect two or more road numbers)

Sorry, Bob.  That line of thinking raises serious questions on a couple of fronts...

First of all...  Folks are buying the new Big Boy upon its initial delivery to the marketplace at $1900 or whatever.  Folks who bought those Lionel postwar FM's typically paid $40-$60 when they first hit the streets.  Any postwar FM's that were purchased for hundreds -- or worse yet, thousands -- of dollars were all done as part of the moment-in-time collector's hype and hysteria.  It would be synonymous to someone getting caught up in the hype and paying $12,000 for a Big Boy 15-20 years from now.  Can you honestly see that happening?  I don't.

Secondly... Color scheme rarity and road-name rarity had a lot to do with the stratospheric prices of some postwar locomotives and rolling stock. Nowadays, I don't think anybody cares about whether a Lackawanna FM has a gray or maroon roof... or which is more rare.  

Of course, I'd probably be more accurate by saying the number of folks who would care is exponentially smaller than it was 30-40 years ago... thereby all but decimating the market that would keep prices at those stratospheric "collector levels".

The only variation we'll see with the newest Big Boy is the road number.  And I seriously doubt that's gonna be enough to sustain higher prices for one Big Boy over another.  In a few years, nobody's gonna give a hoot.  They'll be happy to get ANY Big Boy, and they'll most likely be looking to get one at bargain prices.

Although none of can say with absolute certainty, I'll just trust my "gut feel" that the collectors' ship has sailed a long time ago.  And I don't think it's pulling into port anytime soon.   Operators are an entirely different breed... and they're largely bargain-hunters long before they'll find any joy paying top-dollar for "rare" items to fill out a collection or owning an item that's thought to be highly desirable.

David