Fastrak is loud

I suggested to Lionel that they should produce kits of adhesive back acoustic foam pre-cut to fit into the cavities on the underside of FasTrack. Not a perfect solution but one that would be fairly inexpensive to do. I know some people have cut cork and other materials to fit their track but that seems like an extremely time consuming process if you anything more than a basic oval. Having pre-cut pieces would be a pretty simple installation. 

Changing FasTrack to use solid rails is almost certainly not going to happen as the cost to do so would be enormous. You'd need to create entirely new molds for every single different piece of track. 

The idea of track with built-in roadbed has a place in the hobby. My N scale layout is almost all Kato Unitrack and that stuff is fantastic. FasTrack by comparison isn't as flexible and the connectors are not as robust. I was positioning an oval of track on my layout this morning and as I carefully slid it an inch or so several of the connectors started to come apart and I had to go back and mate them back together. The plastic connector on FasTrack is roughly the same size as the connector on Unitrack except Unitrack is N scale! 

All I use is Fastrack. I put it down without sound insulation. When I move my layout I won't make that mistake again. I'll have rubber, cork, or carpet under it.

The switches are utterly reliable. The Fastrack itself can be painted (weathered)

And, in the end, real trains are loud.

It is really a matter of personal preference and taste: one person's noise is another's sound.  Some people like, even treasure the "noise" others like it.  I would still have mine if it were not for Simple Green, but I'm glad I switched to Atlas - it is quieter, and it conducts electricity much better, but it was a pain to ballast and I went to gobs of work to make certain I used Fastrack switches anyway.  Michael Hokkanen is absolutely correct: the switches are utterly reliable - the best made from that standpoint. 

I'd like to re-raise Nuc Tuber's point.

The room it's in has a lot to do with it.  Put the track in a ceramic tile sunroom with glass windows all around and it WILL be loud.  Put the same track on the same surface in a family room with carpet on the floor, some fabric furniture and curtains and it's not loud at all.

I notice this a lot in restaurants.  Acoustically HARD rooms (wood/tile floor, lots of glass/mirrors,  tin ceiling) will make it hard to carry on a conversation.  Same size restaurant with some curtains on the windows, carpet floor, acoustic ceiling tiles) and you can't hear noise from the table next to you.

Even if you were to try and measure the sound level of the Fastrack, the room it's in will play a significant role.

My layout is in a basement bedroom with carpeted floor and acoustic ceiling tile drop ceiling.  Layout is one layer of felt on a plywood base.  as I said earlier, no one has commented on the noise.  I keep the engine sounds set at about 50% (MTH) and everyone seems to enjoy the trains sound and cab talk without an issue.

Bottom line: consider the room and what you can do to absorb some of the sound, and... run your trains a little slower !

Ed

Very good point Ed! I can remember going to a popular restaurant in our area years ago and could not believe the din! My daughter was sitting right next to me and I could barely hear a word she said.

SeattleSUP - Be interesting to see how plain tubular would compare in your noise test. For years I've been using tubular O on indoor/outdoor carpet with carpet padding under it, extremely quiet to say the least.

The fun thing about this discussion, is that being a retired submariner, there's a lot I learned about sound isolation that I will be incorporating when I build permanent benchwork in the playroom for the kids' train layout.

One of the things that can be done, that I don't see mentioned often is the skirt around the base of the benchwork. Hanging heavy cloth off the edge, to hide the view of the legs/wiring will work wonders.

If your mountains/tunnels are large and hollow, they could be functioning as an echo chamber. I plan to line the inside of mine with the "egg carton" foam. I will also be putting this on the UNDER side of my benchwork, with points facing upward. 

Nuc Tuber -

USS GUARDFISH SSN-612

USS ASPRO SSN-648

Cold War - Vietnam - 1967 - 1971

Out of Pearl Harbor, Hi

Steve, Lady and Tex

SSBN-732 USS Alaska (blue) 94-97 for six patrols including a trip from Bangor, WA to Kings Bay, GA for test shot of 4 C4's.

SSN-724 USS Louisville 00-03: Two westpacs including an 8.5 month (85% OpTempo) to support OIF. Shot LOTS of tomahawks

SSN-688 USS Los Angeles 03-05: Another WestPac

SSGN-726 USS Ohio (Gold) 08-12: Six WestPacs, shot tomahawks

Therefore I've shot T-hawks off of all three "classes" of subs in the inventory.

It was great, my favorite port is Singapore, and thru all of it, I never got a tattoo!

I totally agree.  I also have an 'N'-gauge layout.  It is almost 100% quiet.  Nothing like a real train.  When my Lionel trains rumble along on the FasTrack, I can "feel" the power.

Earl

Real trains are noisey :

I agree that real life trains are anything but quiet.  It never occurred to me until today these posts above that we all spend a great deal of time on how to quiet our trains down.  That's an interesting thing.

Two westpac's here and 12 extended patrol opps and 4 special opps off Vietnam.  Favorite ports were Subic Bay and Hong Kong.  We fired SubRoc on various occasions (torpodo tube launch) in test firings.  Left active duty as YN1(SS).

Steve, Lady and Tex

RickO,

Your video on real train noise was very interesting.  Did you notice that you couldn't even hear the signals until the real train had passed by?

Earl

The problem with the "real trains are loud" posts is it ignores any number of the following:

1) Some people might live in town homes, condos or apartments. Safe bet their neighbors don't want to hear their trains.

2) Shocking as it may sound, not everybody on this forum is over 50. REALLY! Some of us still have small children that go to bed at 8:30 and we don't want to wake them up. 

3) Not everybody on this list lives in the suburbs and has an entire basement or garage for their layout. Not all of our spouses/significant others want to listen to trains while they're trying to read or watch TV in the next room. 

4) When you spend $300+ on a locomotive you want to hear the sound effects, not the sound from the track. 

There are people who have legitimate reasons for not wanting to have their trains be too loud. Telling people to get used to it really isn't doing much to help the hobby as a whole. 

I don't think anyone is saying that the FasTrack noise is acceptable to everyone.  If you have command control with cruise, just run your trains slow and the FasTrack noise will be greatly reduced.  If you 'highball' your trains, you will probably wake up sleeping kiddies.

If you want quiet track, choose something else.  It really is quite simple.

Earl

Well the fact of the matter if you think metal wheels rolling on metal track no matter what brand are going to be totally silent you will be disappointed.

I stated in your other post that the "pink foam" worked well for me quieting the fastrack, and I can here all of the sounds of my locomotives.

The fastrack "noise" thing has been beat to death. Sure fastrack directly on plywood is noisey. There are many ways to quiet it with success without "obsessing" over it. More "mountains out of mole hills" as usual.

If all else fails go with another brand.

In this video, you can get an idea of how well the cotton batting deadened the track noise. Luke is running the PE at full speed, track geometry is keeping it from derailing.

I fully agree one person's "noisy" is another's music. But when the noise level is high enough that you can't converse, or your wife gets annoyed (and she LOVES trains), you must take action.

the reason I won't switch product isn't a cost issue, I'm not that deep into FT, but because I like the ability to tear it up and put it back down differently with very little effort. I've already given the kids a bunch of track and said "Go", and then tweaked as necessary to make it function. Once I build the benchwork next month, this concept will be a little more difficult but still fun for the kids.

Also it allows an easier night for  !!

Yes, there are such reasons, including the scenarios you noted in your post.  However, you can't really expect the manufacturer of a track system to list "make the track as quiet as possible" among the specs for a new system they are planning.  They are looking for reliability, durability, versatility, and other factors, including--perhaps at the top--cost of manufacturing.

My layout currently has FasTrack resting, unsecured, on--horror of horrors--bare plywood. That track is soon going to be replaced with GarGraves track and Ross switches on Woodland Scenics foam roadbed, but for the past several years I have operated my trains with the current arrangement without any real "noise" problems worth mentioning.  Of course, I also run my trains at realistically slower speeds, and this greatly reduces the track noise level.  I don't even keep the various locomotive sound levels high, and have no problem hearing all the engine and other sounds.

Is FasTrack "noisier" than some other types?  Yes, probably is.  But it's a fine and widely used track system, and it is what it is.  Lionel certainly isn't going to change it at this point--no chance at all of that happening.  If it doesn't suit your needs, there certainly are a variety of other track systems out there to choose from.

Nuc Tuber I couldn't hear the train over the kid enjoying himself.  Some people on here will probably complain about that.

single backed foam tape commonly used for insulation attached to the underside of the track will deaden the noise

I have a friend who is a very successful restaurant interior designer.   He tells me that the sales of food and liquor go up dramatically as the noise level within a restaurant rises.  This is why most restaurants have hard ceilings, floors, walls, chairs and fixtures.  He even installs reflectors to increase the sound level.  The din is one of the key elements that makes a restaurant popular.  Sometimes the din is more important than the quality of the food, service, etc., to a restaurants success because it adds an element of excitement to the dinning experience.

I suppose that only the older folks, such as myself, want to talk to our partners while we eat our meals.  The younger set can text message to their meal partners while they enjoy the exciting din.  

Do you think that Lionel has done some research and figured out that noisy trains and track increases train sales?  Do loud trains and track motivate you to buy more trains?  Loud whistles and other noise seems to attract people at train shows.  

Joe

I like Atlas track or Gargraves track on cork, glued on plywood.

Homosote would be quiet as well but nixed it due to the humidity / water issues.

It goes beyond ridiculous when I see another thread on how loud Lionel FasTrack is.  Pro, cons, good, bad experiences, sound saving solutions and on and on.  There have been thousands of good and constructive opinions stated on which track is the best and why.  But in the end it's still a matter of personal preference.

In fact, the OGR forum archives has more pages on FasTrack and track in general that it out does the number pages in our nations budget.....and that's a feat in itself.  (guessing)

Most all forum members should know by now what subjects are "button pushers".  Are these threads started on purpose?  If so, there are so many other interesting and beneficial topics one can start a thread on but read our archive pages on how loud FasTrack is first.....it will answer all your questions and give you all the opinions stated here.......nothing has changed.

Steve, Lady and Tex 

You're an ex-submariner therefore a "button pusher". So I find your post rather humorous. That being said, I do think that the number of FT is loud is rather ridiculous.

I'll always try to give help on how to silence it.

Then send them for a can of relative bearing grease and a size 2 mechanics punch.

As someone who is now running tinplate on pin-connected 027 tubular laid on a very thick (but only a small oval sized) bare wood table rescued from a furniture factory, I am glad to see posts about various tracks (including Fastrack) and the noise they generate... Because I'm planning a table top expansion and knowing about this stuff {via other folks experiences} ahead of time is valuable in helping me make decisions?

So currently I've decided on keeping my 027 (especially for the lesser curves space required?) but adding bendable Gargaves to it and then placing it all onto Woodland Scenics black foam roadbed. I've seen and heard this stuff in action and not only does it effectively keep running sounds to a more comfortable (to me?) level, IMO it also has a nice sort of ballast-like roadbed look to it?

I especially like the sounds of my Marx passenger cars running behind a Marx Commodore Vanderbilt loco; the sounds of their wheels and couplers clicking together over tubular rail joints has to me the realistic sound I hear when traveling on real trains running over the older style non-ribbon rails. And I want to hear and enjoy these sounds, and not a lot of booming echos from noisy track laid over bare wood!

Certainly everyone has their own opinions and likes and dislikes about tracks and noise, but IMO it's very helpful to read stuff about this so as not to have to keep making the same mistakes and having to constantly experiment on one's own........

Thanks guys for alla info here,

Skip

and, @kj356, the OP, LionChief products have the sound limited due to Fed noise regulations. The train is at 95db highballing, but the sound effects are limited to prevent hearing loss.

I have a plywood flat top, layout with carpet under pad painted with grass and dirt colors. I simply connect the fastrack and let it sit loose on the under pad. I run wires through the under pad under the track, then under the table to produce a flexible hidden wire effect. This allows me to make changes to the layout as I learn and grow. I have been changing and improving the layout and train operations continuously over the past 10 years. With this flexible type layout, I have been able to incorporate many of the great ideas I lean on the Forum.

With the loose track on the carpet under pad, the noise level is way below the sound produced by the engines. It is important have a track sub roadbed method that does not transmit the vibration (thus noise) to the table frame. I have a friend who uses plastic wire straps to hold down the track, instead of solid screws.

Thanks: JK

I've used a gray foam matting that I found at Lowes, comes in a 3x5' roll 1/2" thick and is usually used for cushioning purposes. I cut it the width of the roadbed and screwed the track down to keep it snug and drilled a hole through the roadbed and matting to put power drops in. I'm building a 20x40 triple main layout and when trains are running you hear trains not track. It has made a tremendous difference and looks great especially after ballast (see attached pics).

This thread has helped me a great deal in the beginning stages of constructing this project.

Cheers,

Lance

Same here...been up for 8 years. People who don't like noise should not be messing with trains.

Flash; Can you try a DB reading with the fastrack on a piece of plywood. would be an interesting comparison.

Joe K

About four years ago I purchased a good quality db meter and tested my Fastrack and a variety of "noise mitigation measures."  I had mine on top of acoustic tile on benchtop but in a relatively noisy room ( hard celings).  I got 73 db of noise.  Way too loud given normal conversation was about 55.  

One point: if you're testing and trying things to deal with the noise you want to eominate, be sure to turn off the chuffing or diesel sounds, etc.   You want to measure and try to reduce the noise (sound  you don't want) so you can hear that sound that you do want to hear.  During tests about the "noise" eliminate the sound you don't want to try to eliminate.  I did that.

Eventually I found various means that reduced the noise about about 15 DB: filling the "inside" of the roadbed solid with Great stuff helped a lot; no screws, just a bit of Liquid Nail in places to keep it located; and a thick skirt around the benchtop: turns out a lot of the sound was getting generated under the benchtop with it vibrating.  I don't think wthis was just noise traveling through a layout of acoustic tile and pink foam, either (hard to imagine it would).  It think this was more mechanical - low frequenty vibrations and such shaking the benchwork and causing the (in my case wooden) underside of the tab letop to vibrate.  The skirt really helped, and used a heavy one: instead of just fabric I bought carpet runner at Lowe's and used it as a skirt - great stuff for both keeping sould under the layout and absorbing it as it bounces around the trainroom.  

I also found that a string of 20 of so  plastic scale reefers (what I run most of the time) makes a noticeable racket on its own as it rolls along: the plastic walls vibrate I guess.  About 3 db worth of the noise was that.  I filled each with a bit with Great stuf and let it expand inside, binding the walls,  - means I can't open the doors any more but was I ever going to? They quieted down nicely.   

I ended up with about 58 db or so . . . still a bit noisy, but alot better than 73.  Now that I have Atlas track, though, its not nearly as noisy - maybe 50 or 50+ now.