My apology for not keeping up with the threads posted on these handsome cars, but what is the feedback now about the 'high-water' look of the space between the trucks and the chassis?
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It's been pointed out to me that all Lionel passenger cars ride rather high over the trucks. The ABS models strike me as being higher still but frankly I have got used to the look when running a full set of seven cars.
There are other things about these cars that are really not as good as I hoped, including the single color and one piece interior assemblies, which are not very realistic, the fact that the cars issued to date are all "generic" in the sense that they all have the same exterior details as the ESE cars and the fact that the LED lighting takes a long time to reach full illumination. I think these are more serious issues than the height.
Sam...this video might be helpful if you haven't seen it already....it is a video of the Texas Special set on my layout..
Alan
Hancock52 posted:It's been pointed out to me that all Lionel passenger cars ride rather high over the trucks. The ABS models strike me as being higher still but frankly I have got used to the look when running a full set of seven cars.
There are other things about these cars that are really not as good as I hoped, including the single color and one piece interior assemblies, which are not very realistic, the fact that the cars issued to date are all "generic" in the sense that they all have the same exterior details as the ESE cars and the fact that the LED lighting takes a long time to reach full illumination. I think these are more serious issues than the height.
The store near me has these on a shelf above the 18" aluminum cars and the thumbtack coupler is very obvious compared to the older hidden tab. Same issues on the 89' and 86' scale freight cars.
BobbyD posted:The store near me has these on a shelf above the 18" aluminum cars and the thumbtack coupler is very obvious compared to the older hidden tab. Same issues on the 89' and 86' scale freight cars.
Fair point although I think on the passenger cars the thumbtack is set back a little further (under the diaphragm) than it is on the freight cars. But compared with some earlier Lionel 18" or 21" cars the difference is pretty obvious.
OGR Ad Man posted:Sam...this video might be helpful if you haven't seen it already....it is a video of the Texas Special set on my layout..
Alan
Alan,
What is creating the enhanced sound effects in your video? It sounds really good.
Thanks,
Bryan
Regarding the couplers, I've often wondered why the manufacturers bother to put operating couplers on passenger cars anyway - How many of us actually uncouple and switch them around? Sure, a (very) few might operate like a real passenger yard but how many uncouplers are really used out there by hobbyists? Years ago, we used to superglue passenger couplers to keep them from opening at inopportune times!
Alan, source on the 39' rail joint clickety clack. Dubbed in? Nice vid!
c.sam posted:My apology for not keeping up with the threads posted on these handsome cars, but what is the feedback now about the 'high-water' look of the space between the trucks and the chassis?
As shown in the new catalog, and noted in the thread about the catalog, there is a notation by the pictures of the latest 21" cars that says "Lower truck bolster height for increased realism." So apparently Lionel has responded to this criticism and lowered the cars.
Doesn't matter to me - these cars are far too large for my use. However, I hope they do the same for the 15" cars, if those happen to come into being during my lifetime!
One thing about lowered cars is the relationship of those with the engines pulling them. Unless Lionel lowers their scale F-3s, F-7s, E-8/9, etc., they're going to tower over the lowered cars and give a weird look to the trains.
Alan,
I do recall seeing the video before, but it is great to see it again. They make a very handsome and believable train. 
Sam,
I agree with you that I do not know who couples and uncouples their passenger cars once they are placed on the track. It would have to be someone with a very serious passenger terminal. Watch, someone will chime in and show us an example. Actually, I would welcome it. 
Alan's video is running again! I can hear all the neat sounds while I type this.
Is the tack really that bothersome though? They're right below a GIANT coupler..
If you really don't want the tack and never uncouple the cars, then I would suggest putting Kadee couplers on there as Lionel designed these with the mounting pads.
RidgeRunner posted:OGR Ad Man posted:Sam...this video might be helpful if you haven't seen it already....it is a video of the Texas Special set on my layout..
Alan
Alan,
What is creating the enhanced sound effects in your video? It sounds really good.
Thanks,
Bryan
Thanks Bryan....the enhanced sound was downloaded from the internet and then I just added it while making the video. The video was done with the basic Windows Movie Maker program...
Alan
Thanks Tom and Mark...I had fun finding the sound file online and dubbing it in...
Alan
breezinup posted:c.sam posted:My apology for not keeping up with the threads posted on these handsome cars, but what is the feedback now about the 'high-water' look of the space between the trucks and the chassis?
As shown in the new catalog, and noted in the thread about the catalog, there is a notation by the pictures of the latest 21" cars that says "Lower truck bolster height for increased realism." So apparently Lionel has responded to this criticism and lowered the cars.
Doesn't matter to me - these cars are far too large for my use. However, I hope they do the same for the 15" cars, if those happen to come into being during my lifetime!
One thing about lowered cars is the relationship of those with the engines pulling them. Unless Lionel lowers their scale F-3s, F-7s, E-8/9, etc., they're going to tower over the lowered cars and give a weird look to the trains.
I was surprized by how much higher locos are to passenger cars in actual fact. I just have to get my EMDs to about the same height as the Alcos!
OGR Ad Man posted:RidgeRunner posted:OGR Ad Man posted:Sam...this video might be helpful if you haven't seen it already....it is a video of the Texas Special set on my layout..
Alan
Alan,
What is creating the enhanced sound effects in your video? It sounds really good.
Thanks,
Bryan
Thanks Bryan....the enhanced sound was downloaded from the internet and then I just added it while making the video. The video was done with the basic Windows Movie Maker program...
Alan
Well done, sir!!!
Bryan
midnightwrecking posted:I was surprised by how much higher locos are to passenger cars in actual fact.
Really? Not the ones I've seen.
I guess I was thinking of these.
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midnightwrecking posted:I guess I was thinking of these.
There are exceptions to everything, but one can't draw conclusions about normality from a small sampling of abnormal examples. In the vast majority of cases, engines and passenger cars were the same height or nearly so. (Thinking about it, it wouldn't be much of a "streamliner" if parts of the train were different sizes! No question that a passenger train certainly looks much nicer when the height is uniform.)
I had high hopes for the new Southern 21 inch passenger cars, but the ride height was a deal breaker. That was the first, and only, Lionel order I ever cancelled.
The "lower truck bolster height for increased realism" is promising.
Really nice photos above! Thanks!
Um - isn't there a reason that 3-rail models have to ride high on trucks? Even a 15" car on O72 will need clearance for the extra swivel required on most 3-rail curves.
Even worse, 3-railers have to put up with undersize cylinders and pilot wheels, and no tailbeams on their steam models, not to mention blind drivers.
Surely Lionel and MTH are not making 3-rail products depart from scale in the truck/coupler area just to irritate customers?
Nice video Alan and it really illustrates the look I'm referring to. Especially the silver trucks which accentuates the large space between the trucks and the carbody...
Wonder if the first issue cars can be retrofitted with the new release models?
The thumb tacks are easily removed while maintaining the 3 rail coupler.
c.sam posted:Nice video Alan and it really illustrates the look I'm referring to. Especially the silver trucks which accentuates the large space between the trucks and the carbody...
Wonder if the first issue cars can be retrofitted with the new release models?
You are right Sam. Not sure about that huge opening for the Observation rear truck. Do they all have those pins holding the letter boards on?
Laidoffsick posted:The thumb tacks are easily removed while maintaining the 3 rail coupler.
Especially since most folks don't uncouple and pull the sleepers out of the train. You still see that spring loaded pivot. We have begun viewing the layout from trackside height on chairs and these new Lionel couplers make their appearance known when they go past, including the 86' and 89' rolling stock.
Interesting thread. Agree with some of the posters about 18" cars better fitting their layouts aesthetically. 16" aluminum cars look nice and may be a better fit for some layouts as well. As long as the folks who purchase these love them, that's all that matters.
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bob2 posted:Really nice photos above! Thanks!
Um - isn't there a reason that 3-rail models have to ride high on trucks? Even a 15" car on O72 will need clearance for the extra swivel required on most 3-rail curves.
Obviously clearance isn't an inherent problem here, given that Lionel has now designed the cars to ride lower. And there's no universal rule about certain clearance requirements just because there are 3 rails.
A major factor is curve radius. Minimum track radius specifications are given for engines and cars these days. More scale-size 3 rail trains frequently have greater track radius specifications, meaning wider curves, meaning there's less swivel, assuming swivel might be an issue with a particular car or engine. It's no longer a one-size-fits-all world in 3-rail, like it was in the Postwar era.
Don't some real steamers have blind drivers? I think that was discussed on here before. And the few of us that model short lines with mixed trains are switching combines, RPO's, and baggage cars out to drop off freight cars. And then, for variety and interest, send trains out with different cars, under the imaginary assumption that there is less baggage or mail expected (or more near a holiday) on one trip, or it's Saturday shopping day, and a full coach is needed for the big city. Of course, these are not Class 1 name trains, and matching cars are not a goal.
colorado hirailer posted:Don't some real steamers have blind drivers?
Yep. Tuskegee 101 at IRM has blind main drivers and it's not even a very large locomotive.
Rusty
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