I wore a regular sized backpack last year and nobody said anything. But the cars aren't that far to drop things off.
The problem with large backpacks is that the wearers often lack "spatial awareness" in crowded spaces and turn suddenly only to smack someone (happened to me a few times at other shows) or knock something around or off of tables (again, witnessed it happen at other shows). Put a couple of steam locomotives in one and it can become a wearable wrecking ball.
The no dolly / wagon / wheeled suitcases rule makes sense in that they are easy to trip over, and given the age demographic, that is a liability both the TCA and the fairgrounds do not want. Since they started allowing strollers in the halls, I have seen a couple of people skirting the rules by pushing strollers around filled with trains and no children in sight. 
The best solution for those anticipating a lot of purchases is to bring a large canvas tote bag and make trips to the car when it becomes too full or starts getting heavy. Plus, the bags fold up nicely and do not take up much space when empty. I've even seen people in the halls carrying two full large tote bags, and by the look on their faces, it wasn't bothering them at all. 
Andy
@Traindiesel posted:If you get tired and buy any large or heavy items, it’s been my experience that the vendors will hold your purchase to pick up later.
Just remember to go back and get it!
Thank you Brian. I will keep this tip in mind should I go wild on my purchases.
@Andy Hummell posted:The problem with large backpacks is that the wearers often lack "spatial awareness" in crowded spaces and turn suddenly only to smack someone (happened to me a few times at other shows) or knock something around or off of tables (again, witnessed it happen at other shows). Put a couple of steam locomotives in one and it can become a wearable wrecking ball.
The no dolly / wagon / wheeled suitcases rule makes sense in that they are easy to trip over, and given the age demographic, that is a liability both the TCA and the fairgrounds do not want. Since they started allowing strollers in the halls, I have seen a couple of people skirting the rules by pushing strollers around filled with trains and no children in sight.
The best solution for those anticipating a lot of purchases is to bring a large canvas tote bag and make trips to the car when it becomes too full or starts getting heavy. Plus, the bags fold up nicely and do not take up much space when empty. I've even seen people in the halls carrying two full large tote bags, and by the look on their faces, it wasn't bothering them at all.
Andy
Thank you Andy. I have already set aside a couple large, reusable, canvas grocery bags for the trip. 
Also packaging an empty suitcase for the trip.
I've tried reading the website (and the primer) and I'm still confused. Can I show up at the door and pay for a guest entrance badge? If I can do that, are there halls I won't be able to access?
When I went to the show in Timonium a couple weeks ago, I walked up and paid the $12 entrance fee and went inside to shop.
@jcesl2 posted:I've tried reading the website (and the primer) and I'm still confused. Can I show up at the door and pay for a guest entrance badge? If I can do that, are there halls I won't be able to access?
When I went to the show in Timonium a couple weeks ago, I walked up and paid the $12 entrance fee and went inside to shop.
The short answers are yes, and yes (and I agree that, unless you know what you're looking for, the website is less than helpful to the newbies!).
I've been twice in the last year and a half (missed the October show) as a non-TCA member, and in both cases I bought the day guest pass and had no trouble entering/re-entering the public halls. There *are* allegedly other halls and events the guest pass is not supposed to work with, but6 since I've never attended any of those events or locations, I can't opine on what I might have missed. FWIW, I suspect the Timonium event (which I also attended, on Saturday only) had at least as many vendors and exhibits as I saw at either York event. FWIW2, a lot of York attendees at both shows claimed to have been disappointed by the current shows, which in their telling paled in comparison to what was there 'back in the day'.
Thanks Steve. The website referenced members sponsoring guests a couple times, but it seemed weird to me that someone could randomly see an advertisement for the show and then be turned away when they show up due to lack of a sponsor.
My wife wants to attend to see what its like, and my Dad might attend as well even though he is past the "buying" stage and just at the "operating" stage. Just trying to figure out how much I will be spending on entrance fees...
Thanks for the comparison with Timonium. If its about the same size but mostly O, I'd be ok with that. Also want to visit the Millhouse and Altoona Modelworks booths to window shop.
@jcesl2 posted:Thanks Steve. The website referenced members sponsoring guests a couple times, but it seemed weird to me that someone could randomly see an advertisement for the show and then be turned away when they show up due to lack of a sponsor.
My wife wants to attend to see what its like, and my Dad might attend as well even though he is past the "buying" stage and just at the "operating" stage. Just trying to figure out how much I will be spending on entrance fees...
Thanks for the comparison with Timonium. If its about the same size but mostly O, I'd be ok with that. Also want to visit the Millhouse and Altoona Modelworks booths to window shop.
AFAICS, York is all gauges, with no higher percentage of O scale than the Timonium show IMHO.
@Scott In Texas posted:Thank you Andy. I have already set aside a couple large, reusable, canvas grocery bags for the trip.
A UPS store sets up in the entrance outside of blue and silver - they will pack and ship. I'm guessing it isn't cheap, but depending on the item it might be better than sticking it in your luggage.
@jcesl2 posted:I've tried reading the website (and the primer) and I'm still confused. Can I show up at the door and pay for a guest entrance badge? If I can do that, are there halls I won't be able to access?
When I went to the show in Timonium a couple weeks ago, I walked up and paid the $12 entrance fee and went inside to shop.
You can buy a guest pass ONCE that will get you into all of the halls. Just join TCA and you won't need to worry about it.
@Steve Tyler posted:...I've been twice in the last year and a half (missed the October show) as a non-TCA member, and in both cases I bought the day guest pass and had no trouble entering/re-entering the public halls. There *are* allegedly other halls and events the guest pass is not supposed to work with, but6 since I've never attended any of those events or locations, I can't opine on what I might have missed. ...
There's nothing "allegedly" about other halls. There most definitely are four halls for which one must be a TCA member or guest. Generally speaking, the four member halls contain most of the unusual stuff that you're unlikely to see elsewhere. Limiting one's visit to the dealer halls is missing out on what makes York different.
And of course York isn't what it used to be. What is? Anytime you get a bunch of gray haired guys (me included) together for just about anything, you're going to hear that refrain - it gets tiresome.
@jcesl2 posted:Thanks Steve. The website referenced members sponsoring guests a couple times, but it seemed weird to me that someone could randomly see an advertisement for the show and then be turned away when they show up due to lack of a sponsor.
The only people that would get turned away for guest attendance are people who had already attended once as a guest or those that refuse to follow the guest registration process. To get all-access as a guest, you have to go to the registration area in Silver Hall and ask at the desk to attend as a guest (the great folks behind the desk will act as a sponsor if you don't have one). You must have ID as that is how they determine if you are eligible for the one time only guest status.
You can attend only the public hall (Orange) and the registration for that is in the lobby of Orange Hall. It is cheaper than attending as a guest, but you miss out on four buildings full of trains. The Orange hall floor space, according to the fairgrounds web site, is around 74,000 sq. ft., and the other four buildings add up to around 87,900 sq. ft., so you miss *over* half of the meet with the public-only option.
The Eastern Division has people all over the fairgrounds that are happy to help, answer questions, and point you in the right direction.
Andy
@Steve Tyler posted:AFAICS, York is all gauges, with no higher percentage of O scale than the Timonium show IMHO.
You can find nearly all scales/gauges at York, but O is the biggest gauge by far. If you are talking 2-rail O scale, the percentage may be similar, but I'd still bet you can find more at York. I go to Timonium at least once a year, and York twice a year. Timonium is a great show, but for someone looking for O gauge, it really doesn't compare to York.
Andy
@Andy Hummell posted:The only people that would get turned away for guest attendance are people who had already attended once as a guest or those that refuse to follow the guest registration process. To get all-access as a guest, you have to go to the registration area in Silver Hall and ask at the desk to attend as a guest (the great folks behind the desk will act as a sponsor if you don't have one). You must have ID as that is how they determine if you are eligible for the one time only guest status.
You can attend only the public hall (Orange) and the registration for that is in the lobby of Orange Hall. It is cheaper than attending as a guest, but you miss out on four buildings full of trains. The Orange hall floor space, according to the fairgrounds web site, is around 74,000 sq. ft., and the other four buildings add up to around 87,900 sq. ft., so you miss *over* half of the meet with the public-only option.
The Eastern Division has people all over the fairgrounds that are happy to help, answer questions, and point you in the right direction.
Andy
Thanks for the info!
Not to complain, but when it takes this long to explain the entry process... lol
I just saw that there is a temporary 6 month TCA membership option. I'll just do that so I can register online, and then everyone going with me can be my guests. And if there are certain areas that only I can access, thats ok since I'm the only one spending money anyway.
@jcesl2 posted:Not to complain, but when it takes this long to explain the entry process... lol
Yeah, it actually sounds worse than it is, and the Eastern Division doesn't have the most streamlined web site to explain it, but they are almost all volunteers, so I tend to give them a lot of slack given the amount of work that goes into doing this event twice a year. Once you go once or twice, it really seems trivial.
Andy
@Andy Hummell posted:Once you go once or twice, it really seems trivial.
Oh, I'm sure that's the case. Just requires a lot of motivation for newbies.
@jcesl2 posted:Thanks for the info!
Not to complain, but when it takes this long to explain the entry process... lol
I just saw that there is a temporary 6 month TCA membership option. I'll just do that so I can register online, and then everyone going with me can be my guests. And if there are certain areas that only I can access, thats ok since I'm the only one spending money anyway.
The convoluted entry process is the result of compromises between people who want York to be more accessible and those who want to keep it as an exclusive members-only event (the "it ain't what it used to be" crowd). There's also a long-standing issue with the Pennsylvania tax authorities regarding the need to keep most of the meet for members only in order to avoid requiring non-dealer members to register with the state and remit sales tax (which would effectively kill the meet).
I don't know if there's a limit on the number of guests you can bring at one time.
@Andy Hummell posted:The only people that would get turned away for guest attendance are people who had already attended once as a guest or those that refuse to follow the guest registration process. To get all-access as a guest, you have to go to the registration area in Silver Hall and ask at the desk to attend as a guest (the great folks behind the desk will act as a sponsor if you don't have one). You must have ID as that is how they determine if you are eligible for the one time only guest status.
...
Those heads on stakes near the entrance to blue/silver are from folks that tried to enter a second time as a guest.
I'm guessing that now isn't a good time to talk about the arrows on the floor...
@Mallard4468 posted:I don't know if there's a limit on the number of guests you can bring at one time.
I don't think there is a limit, just the one-time rule. Spouses and minor children of members are exempt from the one-time rule (I'm 99% certain on this, based on the way the registration form is worded).
Andy
@Andy Hummell posted:I don't think there is a limit, just the one-time rule. Spouses and minor children of members are exempt from the one-time rule (I'm 99% certain on this, based on the way the registration form is worded).
Andy
You can raise your certainty to 100% - I can verify that you can bring as many spouses as you want as often as you like (and can get away with).
@Mallard4468 posted:You can raise your certainty to 100% - I can verify that you can bring as many spouses as you want as often as you like (and can get away with).
Based on the registration form, I think it is great that EDTCA is so accommodating for those with multiple spouses.
Andy
@Andy Hummell posted:Based on the registration form, I think it is great that EDTCA is so accommodating for those with multiple spouses.
Andy
Most of us train guys should be grateful if we can find ONE woman to tolerate us, and doubly grateful if that woman will accompany us to York. And extreme gratitude if she'll go to York twice a year.
My ex called them "train a-holes" after she was berated for not having her tag clearly visible when running into a hall during a driving rainstorm. Of course, it was one of the rent-a-cops - not a TCA member, but the damage was done - she wanted nothing to do with train people after that, and I could understand her reaction.
Just join TCA and you won't have any problems getting into all the halls. I don't know how you can compare Timonium with York. Timonium is a flea market compared to York.
@Steve Tyler posted:There *are* allegedly other halls and events the guest pass is not supposed to work with, but6 since I've never attended any of those events or locations, I can't opine on what I might have missed. FWIW, I suspect the Timonium event (which I also attended, on Saturday only) had at least as many vendors and exhibits as I saw at either York event. FWIW2, a lot of York attendees at both shows claimed to have been disappointed by the current shows, which in their telling paled in comparison to what was there 'back in the day'.
Not sure what to say to any of this.
There are only one or two public halls at York (orange, and yellow/gold when it opens), and there are roughly a half-dozen member halls (red, blue/silver, purple, white, black). Blue and silver combined seem larger than the orange hall, red is sizable as well, purple usually has a decent number of sellers. I attend both York and Timonium, and, while the orange hall is comparable in size to Timonium, it's 80% o gauge vs Timonium, which was maybe 33% O this past show. Member halls in York are nearly all S/O/Standard gauge, with just a smattering of small scales.
I MAY attend Timonium, and I ALWAYS attend York. And I'm not one of the "back in the day" crowd. I'm 33 and have only been going to York since April 2019. It is miles ahead of Timonium or any other show I've attended as far as O gauge goes. I'm sure it was even better decades ago, but the volume of product, modern, MPC, postwar and pre, can't be compared to any other event in the region.
